"The Toughest Of Decisions: Play For High School, Or An Academy?"

Discussion in 'Youth & HS Soccer' started by Beadling Boy, Nov 30, 2013.

  1. SheHateMe

    SheHateMe Member

    Feb 14, 2011
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who's going to police this stuff? Nobody unless its the parent of some kid who doesn't think his kid is getting a fair shake.
     
  2. headerdunce

    headerdunce Member

    Dec 19, 2005
    Yesterday I had lunch with a local Academy coach, who told me that USSF is considering a proposal to abandon the "no high school soccer" rule, at least in socal. Apparently several of the socal clubs are behind the proposed rule change, and USSF has agreed to consider it.

    I hope USSF listens. I've never understood why USSF believes a blanket rule should apply throughout the country, when every state has different player pools, weather, coaches, traffic problems, high school programs etc. A "federal government" approach to this issue does not allow the clubs and coaches and directors to be flexible based on their specific situations and needs.

    Very few coaches in socal will criticize USSF on the record, but off the record very few are in favor of the "no high school" rule.

    I have my doubts regarding what USSF will do, because USSF seems to enjoy micromanaging from Chicago.

    Will keep you posted if I hear or learn more.
     
  3. soccerall

    soccerall Member

    Mar 16, 2005
    Wasn't it Socal that started the no high school playing? Weren't they first, before the rest of the country? What happened?
     
  4. jeremys_dad

    jeremys_dad Member

    NYC Football Club
    Apr 29, 2007
    The Big Easy
    Club:
    Paris Saint Germain FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Club rats in any HS sports can in a not overly misconstrued comparative, be likened to NHL and NBA playing five rings events. Our son plays, but I'd have been happier to see other kids get their chance. Punishes families of have not's. In large mega schools there are only a few limited positions for such a shamefully small percentage of the body. Those club kids very likely aren't ever going to be incarcerated. Some other student athletes might benefit in other ways from those slots. Our society might benefit. Perhaps there shouldn't be a traditional club hiatus every spring. It absolutely kills club coaches losing kids that long. "How much better they'd be if I had them all spring" which could be total horseshit, but we all know they are definitely thinking that. Lack of club training and events in the spring might need addressing.
     
  5. headerdunce

    headerdunce Member

    Dec 19, 2005
    Yes, originally the socal clubs refused to join the Academy because it wouldn't allow their teams to play in Coast League. Then USSF agreed to allow socal teams to play in both the Academy and Coast League, but to get that concession from USSF the socal clubs agreed they would play Academy games during high school season. To do so, some of the clubs did not allow their players to play for their high school.

    Fast forward to today, and the concerns with the "no high school" rule (as described to me last weekend) are multifaceted, including players being bored/burned out playing with the same players against the same teams all year, not enough Academy games during the winter months, not enough Academy games generally, player turnover to high school/non-Academy clubs, players in U18 quitting or failing to show up to practice after signing letters of intent, and USSF not enforcing the "rule" consistently.

    Bottom line: most of the Academy coaches see no point to the rule in socal and would rather go back to the 12 month season with high school ball rather than the current 10 month season without it.
     
    Hararea repped this.
  6. rhrh

    rhrh Member

    Mar 5, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    How does the academy schedule compare to a top D1 college schedule? How does it compare to a pro U20 academy schedule?

    If they have states that all have soccer in the same season, it will be easy to coordinate. I assume states have fall or spring HS soccer, and that none have January and February, or later than April. That leaves four months at least, not even counting the summer, when players can play across regions.

    The main problem I see is that if your HS soccer program sux but you are on an academy team, you have to choose between playing with and against terrible players or training on your own while other kids get their names in the paper for being part of top teams. You choose your club team, but if your family doesn't have the money or transportation available, you can't pick your HS team.
     
  7. ThePonchat

    ThePonchat Member+

    #ProRelForUSA
    United States
    Jan 10, 2013
    I've Been Everywhere Man
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Arizona, Texas, Mississippi, Florida, and various other southern states have high school soccer through the "winter" months -- including January and February. I am not sure of the starting/ending dates.
     
  8. rhrh

    rhrh Member

    Mar 5, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Florida lists both boys and girls soccer as winter. Football is listed as fall, so players can play both football and soccer. That's not the case in the Northeast as far as I know.

    It's kind of funny, to think that the highest level of a sports organization wouldn't trump HS sports for teenaged participants. Is it that many think that 18 year olds are over the hill for soccer, but 22 year olds are most often recruited for football?

    Is every football season in a US state in the fall? I checked California and their football is in the fall. Florida's is in the fall. Why would one sport be consistent (more consistent apparently) and other outdoor sports switch?

    Assume three seasons of boys soccer, and coordinate. Pre-season with HS team should be trumped by academy tournaments, otherwise no academy games during your state's HS season.

    (I've mentioned before, that if you have residential programs at least at the MLS academies, this will no longer be an issue as the "HS team" will be the academy team, period.)
     
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  9. ThePonchat

    ThePonchat Member+

    #ProRelForUSA
    United States
    Jan 10, 2013
    I've Been Everywhere Man
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would imagine so. The way I see it, most of the US aligns their youth leagues relatively similar to that of the professional leagues:
    • Pro football -- August to November (postseason in December/January/February)
    • College football -- August to November (postseason in December/January)
    • High school football -- August to November (may or may not include postseason late November to beginning of December)
    • Middle school football -- basically the same as high school, maybe a little shorter
    • Youth football -- same as middle school and high school
    Next sport:
    • Pro basketball -- November-ish to June-ish
    • College basketball -- November to April (regular season is over around end of February or beginning of March; so, only 2 months difference, just like college football)
    • High school basketball -- November to March
    • Youth basketball -- whenever, don't really want to look at all the different leagues and AAU circuits (include that in HS)
    Next sport:
    • Pro baseball -- March to November (preseason in late February for a month and postseason lasts forever)
    • College baseball -- February to May (probably late May is the end, and postseason goes deep into June)
    • High school baseball -- March to May (could be different starting month depending on location and temperatures AND length of season allowed by state)
    • Youth baseball -- probably many start in March and run through July, includes Little League all the way through summer ball opportunities (include that in HS too)
    But, soccer goes:
    • Pro soccer -- March to December (postseason in November/December)
    • College soccer -- August to November (postseason in November/December)
    • High school soccer -- varying seasons, varying lengths
    • Youth soccer -- depends on where you are at...maybe 10 month calendars
    So, there's a vast difference in how amateur soccer operates in relation to their professionals. The same isn't said for football, basketball, or baseball. The biggest difference out of those 3 is baseball (and that may change if NCAA Division I starts allowing competitive play in the fall -- it was on the docket recently for consideration). But, soccer has an incredible difference from how one can participate as a youth and the opportunities presented in high school and college -- now, I don't want to get into the discussion of club, PDL/NPSL, etc. I try to keep away from that in basketball in baseball as much as possible too.

    It's obvious to me there is a lack of opportunities for development that is similar to professionals in soccer than any other sport. It can happen as a youth, but once you enter 13-22 years old, there's a drastic drop-off in commitment to one's individual team without having to mix it up with outside opportunities.

    To me, it's no wonder club and/or DAs are becoming an emphasis.
     
  10. Hararea

    Hararea Member+

    Jan 21, 2005
    The shortage of games is really glaring. In Northern California, the De Anza Force are idle again this weekend. That makes 12 idle weekends in their last 15. To call this a "season" is ridiculous.
     
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  11. headerdunce

    headerdunce Member

    Dec 19, 2005
    In socal, high school season is roughly early December to late February with playoffs in early March. This allows all club players, both Academy and non-Academy, a nine month window to train and play with their club/Academy teams if they play the full high school season with playoffs.

    Before the "no high school' rule, most top players in socal did just that: nine months of club/Academy ball, and three months of high school ball. The players enjoyed a break from club ball to represent their schools and play in front of their classmates and friends, and they sometimes gained confidence playing as Captains, playing different positions, getting recognition in the local paper etc.

    According to my coaching friends, the players (and coaches) would return to club ball energized and excited after the high school season. In contrast, what they're now seeing is Academy players going through the motions and burning out because they are training and playing with the same players and coaches all year, and they are playing half as many games in front of no one (except family and a few coaches).
     
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  12. bigsoccerdad

    bigsoccerdad Member

    Dec 30, 2010
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    #37 bigsoccerdad, Apr 3, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2014
    Totally agree.....I'm for having more balance. Let's face it...no one comes to Academy games except parents, not even their friends to cheer on the team...coaches don't make it fun enough (some kids are still 13 and living moment by moment...not thinking college). It isn't a fun experience to watch an academy game...it actually seems stressful as a spectator, no spirit. Also, the down time is too much, soccer is just same routine, with not a lot of excitement. Academy teams hardly have the excitement of winning a state cup or regional cup. Let these kids play high school or off season sports like basketball or even wrestling, etc. Multi sport athletes always excel in their primary sports vs. others, IMHO cuz of cross training. The problem can be though that two sports can overlap, and then it is a battle of the coaches to pressure the kid one way or the other, and that puts the kid in the middle. And, while the majority of soccer coaches are good role model, there are the unfortunate ones who you'd prefer your kid not be with day in and day out for four years of their adolescent life. On a side note, there isn't one college coach who doesn't like a soccer player who also has accolade for being a fast track star...read some of the "signings" articles....but god forbid, how does a player accomplish being on a academy team and on the track team...
     
  13. keeper dad

    keeper dad Member

    Jun 24, 2011
    I could not agree more Bigsoccer dad. My son has not pursued joining an academy team based almost entirely on his desire to play high school soccer and other high school sports. From my perspective the growth he has seen during his freshman year, from both a sport and social perspective, is phenomenal and tells me he made the right choice.

    On the soccer side, his school is fortunate in that everyone from the AD on down have soccer backgrounds, including many former Division 1 players and as a result have one of the better programs in the state and most likely US. They are placing 3 to 5 players into division 1 programs every year, many of whom start as college freshmen and obviously none come out of the academy programs. The relationships his club program and high school program have within the college community will give him ample access should he choose to go that route.

    The social side of soccer has been phenomenal as well. He has had to learn to play/appreciate different styles of play and work with others he previously "hated" simply because they played for a different club. There are kids he has known since kindergarten that he has never liked, due to club affiliation, that are now some of his better friends, all because of high school soccer. A tremendous life lesson.

    On the non-soccer side he has also swam and is playing water polo for his school. Is the challenge to fulfill both his club soccer and high school commitments difficult? Hell yes but again the time management and logical thinking/decision making he has had to learn at 14 years old will pay big dividends down the road. In terms of cross training, that has been the biggest benefit to date. Granted I think he hit a growth streak at the same time but the transformation in his fitness and physique in the last 6 months is phenomenal and can be directly attributed to swimming. Having not seen his club team since summer, when they got back together in December (after high school fall soccer) he went from being one of the slowest on the team to running circles around nearly everyone. He has grown into a leader in training when a year ago he was a follower. This would not have happened without high school sports. Being a keeper, water polo has been a tremendous supplement to his soccer training. The position plays very similarly between the two sports and his recognition of shot angles, ball tracking, distribution (from his hands) have all increased due to polo. The close proximity of shots in water polo (rarely does a shot come from more than 5 yards away) has also helped to improve reaction time.

    This is a long winded way of saying that the high school ban may not be the right decision for everyone. Is my son son going to make the MNT? Most likely no but how many academy kids will? There are those that should specialize in soccer and for those the high school ban might make sense. From our perspective the chance to participate in both soccer and polo ODP programs, compete for national championships in both (his club has a national championship already and his polo club competes in the national tournament annually), and have two potential college routes to choose from makes more sense than putting all of his eggs in the academy dream of the MNT or professional soccer that will not pan out for 98% of the academy players.
     
  14. rhrh

    rhrh Member

    Mar 5, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Academy is not the right decision for everyone. Those of us in areas with a large soccer base have many many choices, and even the top academy in our area complains about the HS soccer ban because some kids play for public high schools that are very good.

    The odds are that none of our kids will make the MNT, academy team or not. And top non-academy clubs, even down to the top ten clubs in the state not the region or nation, not even with national potential, still send a lot of kids to college to play soccer. Yet I would say the proportion of kids who want to play in college or pro is a lot more on academy teams than all but the top twenty teams nationally.

    I am jealous, keeper dad, my son's HS soccer is a travesty. We can't afford private school, so either he travels 1 hour each way, on a good day and not during rush hour, 2 hours if rush hour, to an academy or he plays for a team with practices 30 minutes away with traffic, that still plays top teams from the NYC area. The latter is working out for him.

    We will see this time next year where he ends up. There are D3 and D1 schools on his list. He also would consider playing on a college club team. I think that educated soccer players with educated parents in terms of how to find a college soccer fit is more important than just being on an academy team, especially if the commute and/or the fees are ridiculous.
     
  15. arreola

    arreola Member

    Jul 1, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago
    Exactly. We are the best in the world in Basketball and have been for almost ever and will probably be so for a longer time. Did we ever put an Academy system or anything even close to it in place to get the best players filtered up to the top for the NBA ot college programs?? What did we do?? Oh, thats right, "we" allowed for the ghetto players to play in college and NBA to drastically improve the level of play!!
    These players came from no structure whatsoever U6-U14 at the very least, and still continue to do so in its majority of NBA and College players.
    We have this immediate example and Brazil. Same thing.
    USA isnt too big for Basketball to find its best players. Why do we think USA is too big for Soccer that we need the Academy which is bvery comparable to the AAU program in its cost and travel expenses and who exactl;y pays for it. You wont see too many Suburubia AAU paying players making it pro or even college. Why do we believe it will work for Academy. Like Academy AAU isnt really a place much needed for college recruitment. High school manages fine with that as it should.
    Do we or have we ever needed AAU to play the best vs the best or for better development?? The Hood seems to be doing much better at that!!
    Come on people wake up to reality. We have a perfect example and we choose to ignore it.
     
  16. bigsoccerdad

    bigsoccerdad Member

    Dec 30, 2010
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    #41 bigsoccerdad, Apr 5, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2014
    Let's not be fooled that the Academy teams are a collection of the best players. I look around, and that is not all true in our area. Academy has to do a lot of selling to win over the kids who have another sport for the off season, or even other interests such as academics (hmmm...shouldn't they all) . Many are dedicated and talented soccer players but don't want to give their soul to the academy soccer gods, and with boys that is many. So tired of soccer coaches thinking they own your kid, and often don't even talk to the player much or parents. I've had kids on high levels teams with outstanding coaches who communicate and motivate positively, and it made such a different in creating a winning, fun, exciting environment, which is so good as you only have one chance to be a kid...And I'm going to say, they are usually coaches who have kids themselves.

    Spectator sports just add so much encouragement to the players thru fan support, school support, etc. And soccer at the club level isn't this way...it is at the High School level though. Hope those on this thread have good role model coaches on your Academy teams, cuz we don't have them. And for the kids not playing any other sport as expected from Academy player, this is the only coach they have. I couldn't imagine a kid having to be with these coaches so much and travel with them too , when they rarely talk to their players as people, much less create any sense of pride for the team, or excitement. Where is the mental aspect of the game and bringing out the best in a player on the field and off. These coaches barely get to know a player...they treat them like chess pieces on the field, and avoid the parents at all cost. They hardly seem to care when a player is sick, struggling in school, etc. I would like to see a college/pro player who goes back to thank their Academy coaches like you see in football and basketball. Something is very missing from the game of soccer in the USA.
     
  17. bigsoccerdad

    bigsoccerdad Member

    Dec 30, 2010
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    The Youth National team rosters favor Hispanic players with strong technical skills.. Just saying.
     
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  18. headerdunce

    headerdunce Member

    Dec 19, 2005
    Well.... still no decision by USSF regarding SoCal Academy players being allowed to play high school soccer. According to a couple of coaches in the know, the issue is heating up, because there are several passionate advocates against the rule here locally, but USSF wants a "national rule" regardless of local needs and local differences throughout the country. My read: USSF will be more interested in "saving face" than listening to the SoCal coaches in the know, so nothing will change.

    One thing is for sure: since this rule, the talent pool for the Academy teams has diminished because some Academy level players choose to play for their school, and the talent pool for the high school teams has diminished because some players choose to play for an Academy team. So, the rule has the effect of ensuring that the best players no longer play together as they did before the rule.
     
  19. arreola

    arreola Member

    Jul 1, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago
    So true. Some guys I know are passing up Academy offers for many reasons.
    They find out how expensive it is even if fees are waved.
    1. Travel - Some Academies help a little with this but it still amounts to more than what many families can realistically handle.
    2. Pro tryouts - Most if not all Academies do not allow for their players to go to these tryoiuts unless the other team is a "partner" club of theirs. Too much hassle to do secretly.
    3. No Tourneys - No guest play for anyone no matter how good of a tourney it is. I think that Academy players cant even guest play within the club.
    4. More Fun - High School is just more fun and appealing to the average teenager. School spirit. Girls. Comradery. Need I say more?
    5. Many NON Academy Showcases - There are enough College showcases to do away from Academy to persue your scholarship.

    If travel were completley free, I think that would help Academy's case quite a bit.
    State High School associations should make a few allstar teams and challenge Academy teams to see how true it is that the talent has shifted towards Academy.
    I think many would be very surprised.
     
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  20. Ruud11

    Ruud11 Member

    Dec 2, 2009
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    I hear there is also talk here in PA to let Academy players play HS ball again. Currently some do, some don't and it is a total mess. Lots of finger pointing and unfairness. It is actually a total joke. Either all do or don't.
     
  21. jeremys_dad

    jeremys_dad Member

    NYC Football Club
    Apr 29, 2007
    The Big Easy
    Club:
    Paris Saint Germain FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Without Academy level club soccer teaching important Pavlovian responses to our youth, most children would not have a chance on a pitch outside Northern North America. Same goes for losing lots of games while learning one touch and getting longballed by teams not interested in player development. Europe has clubs hose games are more scrimmages, plus they have the luxury of cmpetent officials. Playing up all the time while getting repeatedly crushed by bigger faster kids. There are many many BasketBall moms out there that put Gymnastics moms to shame. Kids practice shooting for hours and hours, it aint all Ghetto Ball. Soccer can't be compared to other sports. It's a much simpler and more difficult requiring a lot more mental and physical prowess. Apple pie and orange pie don't compare. Baseball kids are more and more playing club ball. Hockey started high level clubs aka academies long long before soccer. Long enough to make us as good as Europeans in a rink.
     
  22. arreola

    arreola Member

    Jul 1, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago
    Actually, without Academy plenty of players are getting plenty of opportunities to play in Mexico where the youth level is currently one of the highest in the world. Are you saying that only Acadamey can teach players how to play?? Are all Academ,ies teaching their players how to play creative soccer?? I would say absolutely not to both.
    Of course soccer can easily be compared to basketball development wise. Both require players with creativity and skill. Both can be played 1v1, 2v2, 3v3 which is actually much better for devlopment at the younger years. I would even say crucial. Both show to have more success when done in an environment where there is no structure. Just for fun as this is where they devlop their signature moves. Both seem to get their bestt world class players from poor environments where pickup is the only thing availabkle at the younger ages. Basketball has the hoods. Soccer has Brazil's ghettos to get the best players from. I can go on and on. Baseball is dying in USA as they play more and more club ball and guess who is better at that?? Small Central American Islands and Venezualans. Bad example for your point. Hockey?? I dont see many black or Hispanic players playing Hockey. Maybe they wont try it because of those ridiculous club prices that only a certain demographic of people can and are so willing to pay. If Hockey were more accessible to ALL then maybe just maybe we would already be better than the Europeans. Ever think of that option?
    The reason many of you argue in favor of the expensive Academy system is because you know its hard for poorer players to come through this system giving many of you a better shot since you have the money to spend. there I said it.
     
  23. jeremys_dad

    jeremys_dad Member

    NYC Football Club
    Apr 29, 2007
    The Big Easy
    Club:
    Paris Saint Germain FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Not arguing about any sports sports dying, but Geography is everything. FOr the vast majority of our nations expanse, Academy LEVEL club education slash/AKA "pay to play" are a must for most all of America if any kid to have a remote opportunity of having a clue on the pitch. Instruction of that caliber might very well be "free for the asking" on our nations left coast, but it is not that prevalent on the west coast of new England. In fact it's rare to be able to find that knowledge even if you have the money. Clubs are far and few inbetween so travel is consuming.US South could easily have fifty times as many grandfathers who played a somewhat higher level of football then any Americans in the North. 100 times as many. And there are likely Ten teams an hour away not five teams five hours away.

    It's might be some kind of pockets of educated footballers here and there...Ohio/Jersey/others A good chance a high percentage of those are likely to be early gen immigrants or have a neighbor who is. An influx of political refugees here in VT has had lot of good effect on our kids, plus now Vermont has three instead of one decent ref! Parents in a neighborhood educated enuf to play football' version of toss and catch isn't common. And where can we play. It cost a lot to rent time, good places are far inbetween. A good sized indoor field with lighting is priced right up near rink time , actually more since a couple rinks are "subsidized" . A lot of the kids posse play various club HS and prep hockey.

    I seldom see NFL hockey .... likely isolated..Just noticed a kick ass dude on the Habs the other nite nite looked black to me. I grew up on the border...clubs just forming playing Canadian teams started a long time ago mid/late 70's ...Hockey is a fabric here. Dated a few hockey players sisters. Their dads and uncles played. Eh? Never had any blacks on our team or in our school or our county. Don't know if baseball is dying or not (and you can get away with saying that in here) but in this area, earlier and earlier, indoor baseball sessions with all the accoutrements, cages machines and mounds. are cranking. I bought an A-Rod shirt just to piss off all our local rabid Red Sox fans. Baseball's death is (save for the Expo's) greatly exaggerated.

    Cost for travel elite Academy LEVEL soccer club can easily exceed cost of a lower level hockey club. Five K and up. NO shit. That's without the DiZney trips or Dallas cupz or what other extra events a club can try for. It's hard not to use the Lords name in vain for what one year's of ODP cost is with fee's practices, short travel trouts, callback and long travel tryouts and further callbacks. All that and not making the "regional squad? ...Priceless to play with other kids that want it that bad.

    Where you live their might be 1000 unbelievable players. Around here less than a dozen. Any kids living out in their respective middle of no where, is burdened with having to play up. Way up. It's not pretty. Refs who've never played.. wicked cold, rain and snow, only met one kids dad who ever got payed to play, and J had one Euro "A" coach a few years who moved back to Europe.

    Finally not to put Mexican ball down, I watch and thoroughly enjoy it all the time in Spanish, it is not Euro Ball. Even Mexicans dream of playing for Madrid or Milan. Our handful of Yanks Abroad playing upper tier could be counted on the fingers of two hands now them former 'blokes" repatriated themselves. (They should have stayed abroad to represent our country. ) (Maybe 2 hands of a GMO baby)

    "The reason many of you argue in favor of the expensive Academy system is because you know its hard for poorer players to come through this system giving many of you a better shot since you have the money to spend. there I said it."

    You F' ing A did....

    Wow. I'd guess that your familiarity with the actual Academy fiduciary structuring is much different then what I was lead to expect. Every club I know scholarships kids. Its hard. Who's ever trucking them usually has to food them too. Hotels are split amongst all that team parents except those kids. I'd like to pretend other clubs are like that. Actual Academies MLS are free I think. Please anyone.... correct me if I'm wrong or it's just some franchises. Either way even if it was just rich kids... that pretty crass statement. It is harder for a rich kid because its hard to play like every game could really change the rest of your life.

    Like Religion, The Beautiful game gains devotion derived from that "need for salvation." My shitty boots are worn into the ground to help put those best Adidas on J's feet. We eat what's on sale and my car's ten years old. We got people in our old club driving shitier then that (but they all do have better boots). It's bad enough we got cops that discriminate against "less" affluent. At the risk of sounding like somebodies father....Discriminating and disparaging against the "more" affluent, in reference to The Beautiful Game, is just not cool. This ain't Wall Street

    I'll end this on a friendly note about frivolously throwing money at roundball.

    $5K++ U.S. = 1 yr training
    $5K++ U.S. = 1 week rehab
     
  24. arreola

    arreola Member

    Jul 1, 2009
    Club:
    Chicago
    Academy is a must in USA?? Who said this?? What statistics do you base this notion on?? Proof??
    The ghetto in Brazil does not have Academy instructed high level soccer IQ as the hood desont either for basketball.
    To have a clue on the pitch?? So then why do the best soccer players grow up in the poorest neigborhoods where "high level" instruction is non existent ?? I can tell you why. Because they are free to try what they want when they want without having to deal with the "A" licensed coach telling him you should have passed it or you have to move like this. Therefore, the most creatively "free" players come forth. Game changers. Go to guys. The eventually highest paid players that teams are formed around. Not the other way around. Clubs are not far and in between in most places. They are if you put an "Elite" tag on them and that would happen in the smallest countries as well. In Chicago, all 3 Academies have better competition to play against in Chicago than in most of the other states they go to in Midwest with very few exceptions. Thats a fact.
    Football, you say?? There are alot of football stars coming out of the north where football isnt as popular and where there arent enough "elite" teams at youth ages. That further proves my point about the Elite status in any sport including soccer.
    Soccer can be played on anything anywhere. Thast why it is unique. Just ask ronaldhino. Have you been to Rio?? No grass fields there open for the public. Doesnt stop them. Why does it us?? Because we choose to believe that Academy is the only way. Thast why. Even though there is no proof of it.
    We have black people in Chicago. And Hispanics. Lots of them. Hockey isnt even a thought and price could have alot to do with it. Baseball is losing popularity and that is a fact. Not an opinion. Google it. Just because it is popular in your city doesnt mean it is in this big country. I speak in general and also dont just base my opinion from Chicago. ODp is bad, no argument there, so the solution is to find a more expesnive rout??
    And agian, I did say that we should make exceptions for the very very few places where competition is scarce but overall that much travel is not needed for MOST.
    Who said Mexican soccer was Euroball or comparable?? But no one can argue that at the YOUTH LEVEL, Mexico is at the top with any Euro or non Euro team. They won U17 World Cup 2011, 2nd place U17 W.C. 2013, won U23 Olympic Gold, 3rd in U20 W.C. 2011, etc. For a USA player to be wanted in Mexico is a great honor because of how high a level Mexico is playing at the World Level in these ages. 2 Mexico teams are kicking ass at Copa Libertadores, 2nd in quality to only the Champions League from europe.
    Corrected. Its just some who scholarship. Non MLS clubs make up for 80% of Academies. I didnt say it was just rich kids but it certainly helps to have money than it is to no have it in this system. maybe thats why you see so many 25+ rosters on Academies which serves no development purpose, by the way. Exactly, but that doesnt stop the rich dads from trying now does it. A rich kid has it tough in that regards. no question. But not the dad paying his way for it. I have seen plenty of kids pushed into playing for Academies by their dads even when the kid's themselves know they are not good enough.
    I am not discriminating against anyone. I am sure there are plenty of rich kids with talent. Whats not cool is having to pay to play for the very best vs the very best in USA. No where else is this done in the world. It is Naive to think that it will magicly work for us especially whemn we lag so far behind.
    Brazil is king and will always be as much as I root for Mexico. No pretty green fields? No excuses. Why does USA look to Europe for development education when Brazil is and has been the best for ever?? Whats that called?? Prefernce?? Does it make sense??
    Come on homie, you can do it.
     
  25. jeremys_dad

    jeremys_dad Member

    NYC Football Club
    Apr 29, 2007
    The Big Easy
    Club:
    Paris Saint Germain FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Please note underlined Academy level clubs are not academies. Could there be some Google Stats to show us where there are and where there are not club scholarships and reduced fees? How many scholarship there are? Surely both you and I don't have the slightest clue. You know academies taking in money from non qualified players parents? I do. And it was outlined and fully out in the open. Scholarships arent out in the open. These players trained but didn't get to play games. Got a training outfit but no gamewear I forget the technical term for this mutually beneficial arrangement. They got to train. Tons of goalies showed up too who weren't on our club. Players in non academy clubs still get to play HS BAll.

    Big Ronaldinio had high level instruction every day since he opened his eyes from every kid in his neighborhood,any one of which if they came here could start on any team playing 3 years up. Kids in your neighborhood might have parents who were stars. Most of America will not have that luxury. Any one who's grandfather and father and brothers all played are high level instructors more qualified then most HS coaches here. And please note that it is every bit as attractive as shitting on rich people to refer to anyone anyone as homie. If you have a problem with the Cubs or White sox sucking why take it out on the rest of MLB. ? I think baseball sucks but I know teams still sell out and TV rights are bigger then ever. So what if it is, doesn't help the US get Americans into FIFA events... Maybe when everyone here gets BEIN or SKY or GOAL things will get better. Whining about those with more wealth then yourself furthers what?

    Do what you have to...We do what we have to do. I am still rooting for our son to emigrate. His next fixture is against an MLS academy team u-18. I'll let folks know what happens. One thing is certain He'll make some more friends. College ball kills any chance of a FIFA career, many parents are in soccer for college scholarship. Our continued investment in his dream is well worth me not driving around in mine. I'm only in my 8th year of watching children learn skills and I believe firmly in Dutch Level A license program and their techniques for training.
     

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