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Discussion in 'Referee' started by briansnat, Jun 10, 2012.
I've always found that comment odd as well.
When I hear this, it's most often the case that the person saying it doesn't know the difference between a push and a fair charge. But like you, I don't know what they desired response is.
I think it is usually an attempt at saying "this referee is such an idiot that I am not even going to recognize that he exists; the kids will have to manage this themselves."
It's called being passive-aggressive. They think of themselves as the kind of person who would never yell at a referee and it helps them maintain their self view.
This seems to be the favorite comment/instruction from a local (boys) high school coach. He has coached for years, but still can't seem to understand the difference between fair and foul contact. What irritates me the most about it though is that since few of his players and none of the parents know anything about the game, they assume his complaints are valid and they start griping as well.
I was once told that the average Region III family spends ~$15K per year getting each kid to Youth Regionals; registration, equipment, tournament fees, travel, etc.
I've done it. Mainly after the umpteenth contested offside call.
Coach is totally focused on the play. I quietly slide over and stand (generally 20 yards upfield from his bench) a little behind him. His team is defending.
Ball is sent forward.
"OFFSIDES!" The arm goes up. No flag. "OFFSIDES!!! OFFSIDES!!!"
Coach starts to look for me. Finally "finds" me.
"I was right coach, you can't judge offside from here. Please return to your technical area and conduct yourself in a responsible manner. Thank you."
This is important. We have a younger referee (was a grade 7 at one point) who was a bit of a star, but was quite immature and pretty abrasive with adult players and coaches.
I finally realized he was trying to be like "us", "us" being older, bolder guys who can get away with a quippy retort or standing next to a coach on the touchline or chewing out a senior and well respected (and feared by some) high school coach or snapping at a former pro player.
Point is, you have to know what you can get away with, and in some (most) cases, it's not very much. Sometimes the best thing to say is nothing. Know what is appropriate for all parties concerned, on that field, on that day.
Know what works for you and more importantly what doesn't.
Stark can't referee like Webb and expect it to work.
I know what my outlay was for my daughter. She played at a fairly high level, probably just under the highest tier. That meant our tournaments were more regional in nature with only one plane ride a year. Still, we were in for over $7500 (not counting emergency room visits!!). I don't put that number out there proudly. Not bragging. Just facts.
I did a very high level men's amateur game in which an attacker realizes his in an offside position just as he sees his teammate with the ball looking at him. The attacker says "I'm off!" The teammate passes him the ball anyway. Flag up. Whistle. The atackers' teammate on the bench, behind AR1 says, to no one in particular, "I guess that was a pretty easy call."
Maybe it isn't the same thing, but my younger daughter had a coach at U-14 who would say something similar to his players. It really wasn't aimed at the referee. He just wanted the guys on the team (Laura was the only girl on the team) to toughen up a bit. During one half time talk, I hear him tell them "You let them take the ball away from you too easy. You need to play more like Laura." The mostly Latino boys on the team are just looking daggers at Laura, who just smiled back.
I hear the "Don't let them push you around" comment a lot. And I'm always wondering what pushing they are talking about. I guess it really means "play harder".
It means, "I don't like what is happening to my baby and you should either call it or my kid should get a free shot at the opponent."
This is at least how I interpret the tone of this quote most of the time.
Such cynical resposnses! This comment is being made -- always -- by the sophisticated soccer aficionado helping the players understand the intricacies of the game. The comment is intended to let them understand that when they feel contact they can't let it affect them, but must fairly battle through the conact to win the ball rather than being driven off the ball. Like and true aficionado, the speaker is typically a strong supporter of referees, who knows that the contact by the opponent must have been fair or it would have been whistled by the referee -- the misuse of the word "push" does not, however, indicate any lack of knowledge, but is a subtle message of sympathy to soften the message of "play harder!" How anyone can think such wise counsel from the sideline could be criticism of the referee or encouraging retailation, I just can't fathom. . . .
I've never said that as a coach, but I've said things in the same...not the same neighborhood, but the same zip code. Is this with really young rec players, where you're going to have a really big disparity in inherent aggressiveness, especially among girls? In that case, the parent/coach is probably finding an awkward way to tell the child it's ok to be tough. Older, more competitive players, well, that's somewhat ominous.
I used to use this as a coach, particularly with my HS girls team. The comment was never directed at the referee - always directed entirely at my player. No matter how much we'd talk about soccer being a contact sport or practice shoulder to shoulder challenges on the ball, a 5 foot high marshmallow would resist being pushed off the ball more than most of my players.
PK called during the first attack, about 10 seconds into the game, into PA by a U11 player:
Coach is screaming - "Referee, you CAN'T give a call this early into the game!"
Is there an agreed upon time as to when we can start?
OK. Let's give it a couple seconds. <looks at watch> How abouuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnow? <points to spot>
This is clearly wrong. You most certainly can call a PK in the first minute.
It's the LAST minute when you are not allowed to call them.
Many of the times I've encountered the "don't let them push you" type comments it has been a way for coach/parent/whomever to try and get the player to "be stronger" or more "aggressive" when they weren't resisting any of the shoulder to shoulder contact from the other team. More like a way for said coach/parent to encourage players to use their own bodies better to win/shield balls. (potentially bad way since it isn't teaching how to do it)
Unfortunately the biggest line of baloney I've heard recently is from a tournament administrator and my assignor who cant seem to figure out between them who did what games for a tournament i did over memorial day weekend. 3 weeks later, I havent been paid and I'm waiting on $500...
As far as stereotypical parents go, Backwards Hat guy is spot on.
Let me also add:
Latin/Hispanic dad - Has probably an extra 25-30 lbs on him and doesn't look like he's run anywhere in years. He's usually away from the rest of the parents, 10-20 yards from the corner flag so he can give out instructions to his son - usually the team's speedy winger or playmaker. At some point, Junior will tell dad to shut up and that he's supposed to take instructions from the coach, not him.
Queen, Backwards hat Guy and Latin/Hispanic dad are all magnified by 5x when they are parents of a team with a name sounding like: World Class Elite Rush FC. They've paid a princely sum to get their tyke on the *best* U-11 team around and want everyone to know it.
Aside from that, i remembered a good one from a few weeks ago. Tournament final, and I'm AR1. other refs warn me about the coach who I am in front of. He is the Complain about Anything and Everything coach. He lives up to his reputation throughout the game which was evenly called without much controversy. His team gives up 2 goals in the first half due to keeper howlers but always looked the better team. After they go roaring back to 4-2 it looks completely in the bag. mind you, he's been questioning EVERY call. Throwing $.02 in wherever he can.
With a minute or so left, a ball over the top is played to his best player, who takes a first-touch that kicks up into his arm, then comes back down to his foot where he then hits a stunning volley that chips the keeper who was frozen at the top of the 18. I dont believe in stealing the show as the AR so I sit there motionless and the CR looks at me. i pop the flag in my left hand, signal the other way and pat my left arm with my right hand to indicate handling. CR gives me the nod and we restart.
Coach says, "you got that one right, but you could have called it sooner"
Me: *burst out laughing*
I guess you are wrong most of the time then.
(Rufusabc, not directed at you.)
The adults have taken a sport for kids and turned it into a business for adults.