Seriously? Are you that naive? Firing Gary Smith was a minor infraction, it was the lying to us, telling us that we were going to watch 'exciting attacking' soccer. This is by far the most boring lump of shit I have ever watched. It was stating that we were going after all the hardware, unless we are going after the chumpions league I have no idea what he was talking about. It was stating that we were going after a coach with MLS experience, we got a big fat turd with that one to.. we got one who had never coached in the MLS or even a professional. Coaching kids and development teams is a little different then the pros. Hell, he is in charge of player acquisition.. do we need to go through that? Edu, are you ********ing serious? Why aren't we playing hill? Why aren't we even trying to play this style of soccer that the lying turd Bravo claimed we were going to play? He needs to go, he needs to be removed from our HoF whatever that is. He, by himself has done more damage to the Rapids than any owner or person I have seen.
IIRC you were ranting against Bravo before that statement was even made. Except that Pareja was an assistant coach in Dallas, for the first-team, before he took over the Academy. I still haven't seen a quote where the Rapids said they were going after somebody with MLS head coaching experience, just experience in MLS. And if coaching kids and development teams is different than the pros then I'm sure you were up in arms when Clavijo left and the Rapids hired a guy with no head coaching experience and primarily youth experience, right? How long have you been a Rapids fan. This is nothing compared to some of the bottom of the barrel moments (Clavijo's last year, 2001, supposedly 1996 though I wasn't a fan then). And I can think of a lot of team hall of fame/retired numbers in sports that have come back in a management capacity and destroyed the team. I can't think of a single one who's ever had their name removed from their hall of fames or their number un-retired because of it. That's just a idiotic suggestion. Regardless of what Bravo does or does not do as Technical Director, it won't change the reason he was inducted which was his play on the field. Short of something completely heinous (I'm talking Joe Paterno/O.J. Simpson type incidents) there's no reason to remove his name.
Being an assistant is not MLS head coaching experience. They stated they were going to get a coach with MLS experience.. a big name if I recall correctly. I'm not going back a year to hunt down quotes for you. When Clavijo left it was a much different situation. We were bad, maybe not as bad as we are right now. It was mid season and Gary Smith was already with the team, he took over and had 10 games left or so. During that time he must have proved himself and given the state of our team, I had no problems with the hiring of him. This situation is a bit different though, we took a middle of the road to good team and destroyed for no reason, just because Bravo has some agenda going on. What does it matter how long a person is a fan? If I was a new fan I would be equally as pissed and the flying turd which is this FO. But to make you happy, I've had season tickets since the Clavijo's years... note the word 'had'. I'm just saying that for effect, although I would be perfectly happy if they did remove it.
Probably because the last time we had this discussion nobody could find those reported quotes. You can be pissed that they hired an assistant coach instead of a former head coach, but if you're going to make claims that that's what the Rapids said they would do, it would be nice to back them up with the actual quotes. I was just wondering if you had experienced some of the low points in this team's history when you claim that Bravo has done more damage to the Rapids than any person or owner you've seen. At least you're admitting the hyperbole...
I'd rather be slightly naive than the place you're coming from. Although I don't think I'm being naive, just level headed and hopeful for the future.
Oh I was there, but times have changed. The MLS is becoming a competitive league with big name players entering the league. Teams are doing more to compete.. back then we sucked, but it was more like we were a expansion team, or a forever struggling team trying to figure it all out. We figured it out though, got better, won a cup, learned a lot about the Champions league etc.. it was exciting being a growing team. Bravo destroyed that, he basically took us back to the low points.. and even lower. To me, that is far worst than anything we have experienced in the past.
There is another word for that, it's called loser. You can sit back and be hopeful all you want, nothing changes when you do that, and you continue to lose. I would rather take action, make a change now so that the future has the opportunity to be bright. Right now under Bravo and OP, this team has no chance.
And we arrive right back to the root of our disagreement. You see the Gary Smith regular season teams in a significantly higher light than I do. You think we figured it out, I think we were the same struggling team we've always been.
I don't agree with calling people a loser in this thread but L L L L L L W L is a pretty low low, it's a whole new realm of struggling as always.
You do realize you are one of the few who actually believe that right? Maybe you, marx, a couple other people on this forum. Most open minded thinking folks recognize that GS was a big improvement over what we had and he had the team going in a positive direction. I'm not saying he was Alex Ferguson or anything, but for our team, in this league.. he was a good fit. I guess though you like the L L L L L L's under the current coach right? Oh that's right, he is going to do great things! Ya, keep thinking that.
Anyone else amused by saying OP's current tactics are crap but its really exactly what GS did with some new names and skill set. I would guess if GS was here when Pablo went down we would be playing a bunker 5-4-1 right now. Not my taste at all I can help with one of qoute's people were talking about: Upon introducing Oscar Pareja as Gary Smith’s replacement in January, the Colorado Rapids declared the hire a transition away from the Englishman’s pragmatic approach to a flowing, possession-oriented style of play, one with some attacking panache that would be built upon a 4-3-3 foundation. "It's not just about scoring a goal," Rapids technical director Paul Bravo said at the time. "It's about how you get there to do it. We want that style for 90 minutes.” http://www.coloradorapids.com/news/2012/05/opta-spotlight-has-pareja-met-expectations-colorado If interested check out ESPN's article on Rapids with Pareja hiring. http://espn.go.com/sports/soccer/ne...s-take-calculated-risk-new-coach-oscar-pareja
Yeah, so? I don't decide my views based on popular opinion. If you want the fans to vote for the GM, become a Sounders fan. Open-minded is not what comes to mind when I've read a number of the post-Smith leaving rants in the last 9 months... Back-to-back 5th place finishes and blowing off any non-league competition is an improvement over the Rapids historical results? That's going in a positive direction? Sure, there were things to like about how the team played, but that's the core fundamental difference between me and many other people. The results weren't there and I saw nothing from Smith that made me believe he could get those results. Ah, there it is. The idea that if somebody didn't like Smith they must like Pareja. Its not a binary situation, you can not like Smith and not like Pareja. The decision to let Smith go and the decision of who to hire in his place are two separate, but linked, decisions. I'm not upset about Smith being let go but it doesn't look like Pareja was the right decision for a replacement (though I doubt I'll really feel solid on that until the end of the season).
Right now the Rapids are as bad as I ever remember, and I was a fan in 1996 (though that year doesn't count for much as a benchmark). GS doesn't have anything to do with that. I don't know if it'd be better or worse with him. I don't see any reason to defend Bravo - it's his vision. He seems to have the best job in the world. He's only responsible for good signings under Smith, can disown the bad ones, and now Pareja isn't achieving his vision. Even the signings are back to being laid at the coaches feet - Edu. The guy seems to be Teflon coated. TD's in MLS have been a mixed bag. I'm not sure MLS has really figured out how the position works. All that is known is that TD's are something big clubs have. I'm feeling more lenient about Pareja. I don't think he's been dealt a very good hand. I don't know if he'd be good otherwise, I don't feel like the Rapids have made the moves to see if he would be. Going into this season I was concerned about the reverence for our captain and the 2010 team, matched with a demand to play a style none of those players ever showed a propensity towards. I can't get past the feeling that we've seen the best that Casey, Omar, JL, and Wynne will ever be able to give the Rapids and a lot of that has to do with the direction the Rapids have gone.
I agree with this completely. GS is a distraction in the argument. At some point the signings and vision of Bravo need to be examined on their own. Theoretically I agree with the stated "vision" but the implementation of that vision has been horrible. I always assumed this would be a rebuilding year however we haven't rebuilt very much at all. I don't think there is a solid foundation to go into next year at the moment. At this point, I would like to see the young guys (Armstrong and O'Neil) get a chance to see if they have what it takes to be a part of the future. I think we also need to find a very talented and creative player to build this style around (i.e. David Ferrera for Dallas or Morales for RSL). Maybe Rivero was supposed to be that player but I don't think he is ready yet. In all likelihood this player will cost some decent money just as Ferrera and Morales do. Maybe that move can't happen until some other big salaries are moved in the off season. We will have to see. But right now I don't see any consistent plan to move forward and that is troubling.
I don't see what the direction has to do with their performance. Casey hasn't had much chance to come back from his 2010 injury and Omar's best is almost 2 years ago (he was no better in 2011 then we've seen this year). I've shared my thoughts on JL early and often. I'd like to hear your thoughts on how the Rapids direction impacted his, and Wynne's, play. Edit to clarify on Casey.
You didn't ask me but I'll take a stab. I personally don't think Wynne is fit to be a center back in a style similar to a 4-3-3. He saved himself many times last year through his speed and through Drew covering him. Reading the game is very important for a center back in this style. Positioning is huge and no matter how fast you are you can't recover if you are horribly out of position. I think Wynne may be a capable Right back if his crossing can improve but his short comings are more exposed in this system. That doesn't explain his complete bone head plays but it does explain some things. As for JL, I don't think he is fully comfortable in the role he was asked to play as a lone DM. He is playing much better with a second DM beside him but honestly I do not think the intention of OP is to play with two DMs. I don't know enough about how he coached the reserves in Dallas but I doubt he used two DMs. If JL can't be a lone DM I'm not sure he will ultimately fit the preferred style. That is just my opinion.
Thanks for that. Being perfectly honest, I don't know the difference in expectations for a center back in 4-4-2 vs a 4-3-3. It would seem maybe they would be expected to cover more of the area in front them since there are less mids. I haven't seen him any more forward then in the past, maybe that's the problem? I think we're pretty close here. Thanks again.
Spot and COYP excellent posts. I am now of the mind to see the kids and other non-starters play so we will know what moves need to be made this offseason, since I don't see anything being done trade wise this year. I think the RFO left OP out on limb with complete lack of moves to bring in players needed to play our new style, especially when the losses started piling up (not to mention the injuries continuing). I do see a place for our 2 veteran local guys: Casey and Mullan, but feel we need to completely shred the remaining guys from 2010. Still not sure between Mullan and Wynne who the problem is but its not likely Wynne will move to RB, Given it may be future spot of Mullan and would you really pay a RB that much of your cap?
you know what bothers me people who deride chelsea for the way they played in the champions league semi and final, yet laud gary smith ball... that annoys the hell out of me... oh and people like damn panda or whatever the name is
It's totally possible to recognize these very poor resluts and not even consider GS. I haven't and yet the L's keep pouring in.
If this truly is your standard why are you not outraged now? From today it appears to me that we need to climb a mountain three times just to get back up to there.
Mainly because it's 24 games vs. 3+ seasons with Smith. I'm not happy with the results But I'm trying not to react too strongly with the small sample size. I said recently though that there's not a wrong answer of what to do with Pareja though. I couldn't find fault if he were fired and I can't find fault in not firing him yet.