The Nani Thread, Capoeira Inspired Aerobics [R]

And my point is that Ronaldo was given those bad games. He was involved in most of our games his first 2 seasons and it wasn't performance that was justifying it. It was potential. We can't complain about Nani not reaching potential if we don't give him the platform to reach it. I am not comparing players' ages. Some player develop at different speeds and at different times. Fletcher was an early bloomer in terms of technique but the mental part of his game lagged like 5 or 6 years behind. AFAIC Fletch was able to technically do all that he can do now since he was in his late teens. However he's only become a big game player and a non-passenger in the last couple seasons. Shock horror, he's done much better when given a run of games. Not to mention when Ronaldo came we had 1 winger in the team and some part timers who would occasionally play wide right. We can't compare the lack of pressure Ronaldo faced when finding his feet in a team that was in rebuilding mode as opposed to Nani who is trying to fit into a team that is expected to win at least 1 major trophy a season and is being bandied about as SAFs and United's best ever.

As for Nani being Ronaldo or trying to be him, I don't think he is. Nani is very unique. He rarely uses tricks but relies on slight of foot. He loves to cross and is an accurate crosser. He's an explosive guy over the first few yards, but he's not

 

While I agree that Nani needs more games to realize his potential, the fact that he still commits some basic errors (shooting when a pass makes more sense, holding the ball too long) is what bothers me. Making the right choice and failing to execute is better than making the wrong choice. I assume its decision-making that is keeping him from getting more minutes.

 

I agree with you on his decision making especially his choices to shoot first and ask questions later. You do have to take into consideration the fact that those shots he takes look like Field Goals ranging from 12 - 35 yards. If he was able to put 20% of them on net I think Fergie would give him more run outs.

 

How dare you show your face tonight!

 

Fair enough, all players miss but Nani misses

 

i think he ll start tonight !

 

i hope he is no where near the pitch today.

 

You're having a laugh. When's the last time he's started an important match for us? He is clearly in the doghouse and/or just being trot out in the domestic cups, weaker league matches. I can't imagine he'll be out there tonight.

 

More chance of him not being in the 18 man match day squad than starting, imo. Think he'll probably be on the bench though.

 

Not even on the bench.. not surprised though.

 

I am slightly but certainly saw it as a possibility.

If Park wasn't going to start (assumed he probably would), it became obvious.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

This hate is just retarded. Nani didn't have a great game in his limited time but he definitely did a job. He held the ball well and forced Porto to send 2 or 3 guys to the flank, which means they weren't running through the heart of the pitch. He beat the first man innumerable times in 10 odd minutes and that was good enough for me.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

"I got me one!"

Still though, he was poor last night and had Richardson given an identical performance for us when he were here, there would be 30+ posts slating him by now. Nani's wastage in possession, sheer laziness about getting back, and either uncertainty or lack of intelligence on the night did show. He did get past his man on a few occasions, but almost every single time just gave the ball right back or put it out of play. Giggs drifted outwards to his spot more in the last 10 minutes or so and not only got by the men more consistently (at 35 years of age having played the full 90), but also then did something with it in areas where Nani was so wasteful, getting us a number of corners to alleviate pressure near the end as well. That is a very fair comment.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

Nani was on the pitch for how long? Giggs had an entire game to make an impact and for all his flicks and tricks he created NOTHING of worth, aside from one or two set pieces. Nani dribbled no less than 6 Porto players in less than 15 minutes and whilst he did nothing with the ball, he'd barely had time to make a considerable impact.

Comparing him to Richardson is foolishness of the highest degree. Richardson THOUGHT he had talent that Nani possesses but Richardson tried to do what Nani can and he failed at every step along the way. Please stop comparing a shitty entitled bitch to a misguided but talented youngster who is going through a rough patch.

Don't give me none of that 'got one' bullshit either. I'm not discussing this further.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

That is f'king laughable. Giggs at 35 years of age, who played the full 90 minutes, far outperformed Nani in the last 10 minutes, who is a 22 year old who by then had had 10+ minutes to bed his way into the match. Nani was getting by his men and then wasting possession horribly, this is the type of thing that Richardson was slated for - and rightly so all things considered - in his time here. You can run by the opposition players all you want, but when you just wind up giving the ball right back to them seconds later, it's rather f'king pointless. Just like trying to concede even the most blatantly obvious of points.

...and that, is that.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

I don't see all the hate for Nani. In terms of defensive tracking, yes he could have been better but I thought he held up the ball properly and when he actually had possession of it he kept it the majority of times. Richardson couldn't hold a bowling ball if he had to.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

Anyone who criticizes Nani for not running hard enough last night is being absolutely rational. How a young player can be put into a game like that and not just run as hard as he can the entire time is baffling.

I can live with the poor decision-making as I assume that he can grow out of it. What I can't live with is that Nani couldn't (wouldn't) press harder than Giggs who had played the entire match. That just doesn't cut it.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

I don´t think it is fair to compare Nani to Giggs. How many games are Nani getting this season? They are very far between and one cannot expect him to deliver at the same level of the regular starters.

This fall when Tevez was on the bench for long stretches of games, (but still shorter stretches than the amount of games Nani have to sit out) people didn´t compare him evenly with Rooney or Berba. Everybody recongnized that Tevez needed a run of consecutive games before one could judge him on the same level of Rooney and Berba.

Imo that makes it very unfair to compare Nani to Giggs in a one of game like yesterday´s.

I don´t think the comparison to Richardson is too valid either. If you talk about simply tracking back, they might be even. On the attackingside it is very much different. Richardson had speed, a good shot with both feet, but outside of shooting his right foot didn´t exist, he couldn´t beat a man on anything other than speed, he didn´t ever show the same potential of football IQ, his movement was never great and his passing was never great. Nani is by no means a master off all these, but has showed glimpses in all these departments on several occations. That means if Nani is given time there is a fair likelihood that he could become a very good player. That same likelihood never existed with Richardson. People tended to complain about Richardson getting playingtime when he a lot of the time didn´t seem to care about anything other than himself, combined with that it didn´t seem likely he had the tools in the locker to become Manchester United quality. At least with Nani there is hope that if he is given time he can develop into Manchester United quality.

The only thing I would say Richardson have that stands out in his favour compared to Nani is his confidence. Richardson has that Manchester United confidence of old where players believe they are the best even if it is not necessarily true. Nani´s confidence is a case for a shrink.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

I dunno... I didn't really have much of a problem with Nani's application. I thought he didn't put in (m)any tackles but I didn't think he had a horrid defensive performance. I'm actually of the opinion his task was NOT to defend. He was supposed to stretch Porto and stop them from attacking with everyone.

I recall a couple times he was flanking Evra and he didn't put in tackles but I'm not sure if that was a lack of application or him not wanting to give up a FK when we've got Evra, Vidic, Rio and O'Shea all back defending, not to mention Carrick playing sweeper.

Nani won iirc 2 headers in central areas up the pitch and contested several more. He was brought on for Berbatov, not for his defensive skill but to inject pace into the team. If Nani was brought on to play a winger in a 442 then why didn't Rooney move up top?

Tactically it would make no sense to sit deep and invite Porto to attack us. However, if we brought on someone with loads of pace and the ability to dribble multiple defenders, it meant Porto had to play a deeper defensive line AND had to committ a midfielder to him as well.

Also, those of you who complain about a lack of end product in a 10 minute appearance have never been on the pitch greatful there is someone who sapps the oppositions energy by forcing them to track him. Especially if he is doing it solo and has little to no support, allowing everyone else a breater, and to get back in position.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

nft

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

Based on total minutes, Nani has played in about three less matches than Giggs. In the Champions League, Nani has played only seven minute less than Giggs.

Anyway, that is beside my point. Nani could still have been expected to have the same level of commitment as Giggs.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

Like I said in another thread yesterday, Nani looked like he had just donated blood. I don't know if it was because of his (extreme)lack of confidence, lack of will power, or if he was told to be calm and not do anything wild. If it's the latter, he went to the other extreme of wild and erratic to almost lifeless. Weird.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

It's been such a strange 2nd season for him, after what he did last year.

 

Re: Arsenal #7 [R]

Giggs usually play once a week and some times every other week. But that is usually the biggest stretch he is out of the team. Take for instance Nani´s 3 last games, Tottenham in the league cup final, then there is 6 games until he played again against Aston Villa, and then 3 games to this Porto games when he gets on. Giggs plays in the PL and the CL together with most of our first team players. Nani has played mostly cups which means he doesn´t have had the chance to play mostly with the same players around him. Is it then fair to judge him evenly with Giggs in this one game?

I have no problem agreeing that he was way to lazy and should have shown the same commitment as Giggs, however the post of Billy that I responded to also made clear comparisons of their play with the ball and output of corners and dribles, it is that comparison I think is a unfair.