The Klinsmann Coaching thread, v1

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by bungadiri, Dec 28, 2011.

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  1. Brandinho

    Brandinho Member

    None
    United States
    Feb 22, 2007
    New Jersey
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think you're missing the point.
     
  2. vaquero28

    vaquero28 Member

    Jul 9, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ok then what is the point? In effect you said that "fake Americans" won't fight for the shirt or the US like "real Americans"
    Club teams. all over the world are playing with fake home nationalities but they fight for their clubs as committed as native born players.
    Personally, any time I stepped on the field I gave all I had for the Game, nationality becomes unimportant. Any player who is a dilletante on the field is NOT a player and should not be there. Any coach can tell there is no commitment and such a person will NOt be allowed to step on the field.
     
  3. Brandinho

    Brandinho Member

    None
    United States
    Feb 22, 2007
    New Jersey
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In black and white terms essentially yes, the guys with hardly any ties to the US aren't usually going to provide the extra "show the world" mentality as those Americans who have spent their whole lives in the US. What your mentality is not equal to theirs. I used Jones as an example, he may have the talent but he's have that extra bit of tenacity to fight for his country's pride because, well, it's not his country. He wanted to represent Germany...if he didn't, he wouldn't have played for them first and had to switch.

    It's great that you would choose to rep the US first and foremost, that's what the US needs in a player. I'm the same way. But I'm not them. If everyone had our mentality, Giu****i R***i would look nice in US colors. But the fact is, most of the players in question are guys who had every intention of representing somewhere else before realizing that it wasnt going to pan out for them, so they took plan B.

    Also, are you really going to compare club pride and national pride?
     
  4. Otergod

    Otergod Member+

    Sep 20, 2007
    indianapolis
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's about as black and white as you can make it.
     
  5. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    This much is pretty revealing. It's pretty obvious from the more recent games that the 442 was working better for him, so he's finally concluded the same as our previous coaches and most of our fanbase: for several reasons, the USA plays best in a 442, like it or not.

    Hear that everyone? Begin adjusting your speculative line-ups and depth charts to reflect a 442 team rather than that 4231 team we were going off of earlier. And assume he's going to be pulling really hard for Agudelo, unless another starlet forward drops into his lap.
     
  6. vaquero28

    vaquero28 Member

    Jul 9, 2010
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If one thinks about it, why would there be a a difference? The clubs pay their salaries, National teams are a pittance in comparisons. Plan B still indicates to me a willingness to play for the second choice. So you are saying that the second choice being the USA means they will not give their all? Think about it in shades of grey then. Now that they are tied, there is no longer a choice. Either they play all out and do it well or they are cap tied to the US and they will not play for Germany or anyone else at all. They also are professionals and as such they play every game seriously cause if they don't, their league play also suffers and they risk bench time in both places if they continue lackadaisical play.
    In any color you choose, I do not subscribe to the "fake" nationality at all.
    I know that it would never apply to me personally and lets face it, I am not unique at all.
     
  7. TheNearPost

    TheNearPost Member+

    May 21, 2010
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    And I'd say the 4-4-2 we're using this time around is different from what we used under Bob. That's a pretty easy statement to make considering it's a different coach, but I think the 4-4-2 we're using this time around is something more like a 4-3-1-2/4-4-2 diamond. Two central midfielders between a defensive midfielder in front of the backline and an attacking midfield behind the forwards. I know a lot of people on here don't like to get into these tinier details, but it'll definitely have a bigger influence on the field. Bob's 4-4-2/4-2-2-2 featured a flat midfield. This 4-4-2 diamond/4-3-1-2 is a lot narrower in that area, giving us four central midfielders, although Johnson definitely liked moving wide when the USA had the ball against Slovenia, and Bradley drifted to the flank a few times as well.

    So, if I had to take a geuss at a lineup, I'd go with something like this:

    http://this11.com/topics/show/7794/4-3-2-1-donovan-and-buddle-up-top




    Altidore could be in for Buddle, and Donovan and Dempsey could switch, but something like that. Or this...

    http://this11.com/topics/show/7802/yes-again
     
  8. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    Agreement. Certainly 442's come in a number of different flavors and styles, and the point of departure for Klinsi's 442 I think is going to be the skinny diamond we saw against Slovenia. We might not stick with that exclusively, but I think that's the point that we'll be varying off from. Klinsi's one substantive, positive, real change that he's sticking with from the Bob era is the differentiation of the #6 and #8, and so no matter what we do, that's going to be at the heart of it. He's not going back to a Bob-era, flat-CM 442. With or without true wingers might vary (and we might get one for an asymmetric look, etc). With 2 out-and-out strikers or more of one withdrawn attacker might vary, etc, but the differentiated 6/8 will be pretty constant.
     
  9. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think your point was very clearly stated here:
    You then pointed to Jermaine Jones as an example.

    You seem to be quite confused about who is an American. Jones, Chandler, Johnson, and Williams are US citizens by birth; as such they are Americans, period.

    This quote from Williams says all you need to know "I had goose bumps when the national anthem was playing," said Williams.
     
  10. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agreed. For the January friendlies it might be the 4-1-3-2 we saw against Ecuador or the 4-1-2-1-2 v Slovenia but in either case it will be a 4-1-x-x with the dedicated #6.

    I still think v Italy we will see the same 4-2-3-1 with double #6s we saw against France.
     
  11. kickingdead

    kickingdead Member

    Jan 12, 2012
    Rancho Cucamonga, CA
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I do not mind the German-American selections. They all seem as much american than most of the people in Southern California. I did think the 442 created a better result than the others. My issue with Klinsy is his player selections. I gain no refreshment from watching Rogers continue to play poorly. If you are picking a player from the MLS wouldn't Brad Davis be better option than Rogers. He is older, but I think his distribution would work better in the style Kilnsman is wanting played.

    Oh and how about Klinsy's dislike for calling up Mexican-American players with the last name starting with G? Hurcules Gomez seems to be finding the back of the net in Mexico. And Omar Gonzalez (before the injury) should have been given a chance sooner to help our back line problems. I would go Gonzalez over Ream any day.

    I am no expert though, just someone with too much time.
     
  12. Susaeta

    Susaeta BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 3, 2009
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, of all his comments, I thought this was his most "newsworthy." As a follow up to it, when he was asked about his depth charts, he mentioned that where players rank will be informed by the system the US uses. Probably a pretty obvious point when it comes to a position like forward, where adding another spot has obvious implications to the depth chart. I also read into his comments - perhaps too much - that some players are going to work well in one system but not in another. And the player that comes to mind first is Kyle Beckerman. We will see.

    Overall, I left with the takeaway he wants a battle-tested team. Even if it means the US gets beat up in the short-term, they will be more prepared in 2014. He said he is working on "big nation" friendlies this summer to get ready for qualifying as well. And of course we are seeing the January camp roster travel for friendlies for the first time in my memory. So, preparation comes first, results come second.
     
  13. futbal4eva

    futbal4eva Member+

    Jan 3, 2010
    Club:
    Sao Paulo FC
    Missed Klinsmann's comments, but did see that US v Brazil @Foxboro in May is now on the schedule.

    I absolutely agree with Klinsmann that the whole point for now is to raise the bar on the whole group and see who can keep up. And who can't.
     
  14. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    That's how you protect your captain! :eek:
     
  15. soccersonoma10

    Apr 26, 2007
    I would be willing to bet ANYTHING that he doesn't know the words to our national anthem. Just like when Camoranesi was on the italian national team and he didn't know what to do during their anthem. I don't have an inherent problem with this per se, but Camoranesi got lampooned by the press and fans alike after appearing not to care during their anthem. heres a camoranesi quote on the subject
    "I feel Argentine but I have defended the colors of Italy, which is in my blood, with dignity. That is something nobody can take away."
    I am not so sure that all of our Germerican players feel this way about the USA.
     
  16. kaicyr21

    kaicyr21 Member

    Nov 14, 2011
    Virginia
    Club:
    FC Kaiserslautern
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrqsN9e6mnQ"]Jürgen Klinsmann, Coach of U.S. Soccer Team | Journal Interview - YouTube[/ame]

    Saw this on youtube today. Good interview, for those who haven't already seen it.
     
    1 person likes this.
  17. Brandinho

    Brandinho Member

    None
    United States
    Feb 22, 2007
    New Jersey
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    On New Years Eve in 2006, I was ready to go out but had nothing to do until then. I speak absolutely zero Italian whatsoever, and I learned the Italian national anthem in a few hours. If he plays in Italy and knows the language even a little bit, he should take a few minutes to learn the lyrics. They're actually very simple.

    I wish some more of our players would sing the anthem on the field. It gets me pumped personally, I don't see why it wouldn't do the same for them.
     
  18. meadowland melt

    Oct 20, 2010
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    i don,t want this to sound like i am against a lot of jks ideas, but maybe someone could explain the following.
    1.is he planning on building his team around torres, beckermen, a questionable holden, williams, and johnson. along with a a defense of gooch, bocanega, cherundolo, jones, and anyone else he can find that will be over 32 when the world cup comes around.
    2.so far he is not doing anything to cover all these question marks. there is a good chance that klesjian, felhaber, bradley, and john do not even make the final roster...

    someone please explain these moves...
     
  19. gmonn

    gmonn Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    You sound like nothing changes in the two and a half years before Brazil. Nobody can predict who will be on the roster. Although Bradley is a good bet, not sure why you listed him.
     
  20. kokoplus10

    kokoplus10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 5, 2008
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    At the start it seemed like he had some preconceived notions about the player pool and how he wanted the team to play.

    Now? It seems to me like he's letting go of some of those notions and trying to find the system that works best with what is available to him. Then he'll field the players that work the best in that system.

    It's still early in the process. I'm not sure he has a thorough understanding of the player pool just yet. Once qualifying in underway and the olympics are behind us I think (and HOPE) he'll have a better idea of how he wants to operate moving forward.
     
  21. soccerusa517

    soccerusa517 Member+

    Jun 23, 2009
    Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    it's an hour long

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ytXdCi5dmA"]1v1 with Juergen Klinsmann: A Special NSCAA Convention Interview - YouTube[/ame]
     
  22. kokoplus10

    kokoplus10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 5, 2008
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is he weaing a track suit in an interview??? :eek:
     
  23. Otergod

    Otergod Member+

    Sep 20, 2007
    indianapolis
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I didnt watch it, but surely not. Didnt JK note that all the fans grabbed their pitch forks and torches the last time our manager didnt wear a suit and tie??
     
  24. cleansheetbsc

    cleansheetbsc Member+

    Mar 17, 2004
    Club:
    --other--
    No, they are official team pajamas.
     
  25. Bolivianfuego

    Bolivianfuego Your favorite Bolivian

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Va
    Club:
    Bolivar La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    LOL Watching this video, it basically touches EVERYTHING we have talked about. Love it or hate it.... he is doing it different than many want it to go.

    Really good interview cracking open Klinsi's brain, and himself letting it all out on what he thinks, how it works, how the game should be taught, etc etc.
     

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