The Full Autopsy - U23 Qualifying

there is a core of u23 that are coming around or are already there....
Chandler
Boyd
Agudelo
Mix
Williams
Jozy
Gatt
Gyau
Wotten
JAB

Did I missed anyone?

p.s. I hope Aron J. is reading this and decides to get in the banwagen.

Will Bruin

Perry Kitchen (really has grown as a CM)
Amobi Okugo
Nick Deleon
Matt Hedges
Sheanon Williams
Dilly Duka

Andrew Jean-Baptiste and Tommy Meyer have shown some flashes. Especially Meyer being thrown into playoff action with De La Garza out. Jean-Baptiste should've been given playing time the entire final 1/3 of the regular season, guy in front of him was garbage and Portland didn't have much hopes for the playoffs.

Those are the main core, but I really wouldn't be surprised if some of the younger players like Pelosi, Guido, Flores and Rubin are playing up a level in the coming years. Look, I realize that everyone wants to keep players in their age group, but sometimes a 16 year old is better than a 18 year old, and sometimes an 18 year old is better than a 20 year old. When you have special players, you don't need to baby them.

For example, if Flores is ready to play with the U-20 team next year, why the hell not? Yeah, I realize he plays for the U-17 team, but you don't see Major League Baseball teams keeping players in AAA to help for the AAA playoffs if that player can help the big league club. And I am just using that as an example. Maybe Rubin is the guy that is ready to play up a level. Heck, maybe someone like Pelosi gets a few appearances with the Liverpool first team this year and gets selected for the Gold Cup. Who really knows what will happen, I just don't get the point of babying players by keeping them at a certain level if they are ready for a higher level.

And how exactly would you know that?

I guess we will just have to see if they are ready or not. JK certainly hasn't had a problem calling up young players. Today, he started a 21 year old while a 19 year old, 21 year old and 22 year old came off the bench. Not to mention a 20 year old with basically no first team club experience was called in.

The USSF seems to be taking an aggressive approach with young players, at least with the USMNT. I guess we will just have to see if that happens with some of the youth teams, but if a player is ready, there is no reason to baby them.

I agree with your notion of playing up but that should apply to their club teams where they play every day. Ideally professional club teams determine what level they should play up to. A pyramid system we don't have in this country yet. This is where we are so misguided as a country. Youth National Teams should not determine who's good and who's not. Professional club teams do that.
Both Rubin and Flores and players we don't even know about need to worry about their next professional move so they can learn how to play the game professionally before they care what age level of the National Team they should play on. It all revolves around their professional progress up the ladder. I've seen Rubin and Flores enough to know they are still boys and no where close to becoming the superstars you deem them to be. Alot of work and development to go but the foundation is there.

I think we will all know when some of these kids and younger ones will be ready, for now these seem to be the next core of players coming down the pipe.

He did have some first team club experience though.

Well, Pelosi is playing with what is pretty much the reserves for Liverpool, and he seems to be playing pretty much every game for them. It also seems like he has been playing well. Its hard to tell me that if a guy gets an appearance with the Liverpool first team that he is not ready to get an experience with the USMNT. I am not saying he will get an appearance with the Liverpool first team this year, but he seems pretty close to breaking into the Liverpool first team roster.

I like to think of young soccer prospects in the way that you would think of a baseball prospect. Once that prospect is dominating at the level they are playing at, they need to move up a level to keep improving by playing against better competition. I can't tell you for sure that Flores or Rubin are ready, but I think its at the point where it should at least be a consideration, and I think Pelosi might be called into the National Team in the next year as well.

This isn't the Freddy Adu situation. I am not calling anyone the next Pele or anything like that. This is also not the Juan Agudelo situation. I am not saying call these two up to the U-20 team so they can be called up to the National Team half a year later. I am just saying that when players have been playing so well at a certain level for a decent amount of time, it might be time to move them up to the next level even if they are playing with older competition.

What age group would these guys being playing up exactly? Pelosi is playing with the U20's and then will move onto the 2014 U23 cycle. CONCACAF isn't UEFA where there's an U21 every 2 years. A 21 y/o Junior Flores would be competing with a 23 y/o Luis Gil in 2016 for example, that's a huge difference in soccer years, Gil will have been a pro for 7 years. But the better player will/should play. These 2 are only like 16 months apart.

According to Wikipedia, he has 3 first team appearances in his professional career. JK has even called in guys before they made a first team appearance(Boyd). My point is that he doesn't seem afraid to call in young players if he thinks they are good enough to be called in. He isn't holding back in terms of a player's age.

These 2 are only like 16 months apart.[/quote]
I thought Gil was a '93 and Flores a '96?

Yeah, I meant 26 months but Flores is only eligible for the 2016 olympics like Gil

I hope some guys like Gatt and Mix make upward moves club wise this transfer window.

Boyd, Gyau, and Agudelo will have to keep grinding away with their clubs. does anyone know when Agudelo's contract. I have no doubt that he could latch on to a La Liga side. IMO, he's made for that league. Super technical and dynamic.

Other than Will Bruin, who John mentioned...............

Jack McInerney had a great year in MLS for a 19/20 year old, solidifying himself as an MLS forward.

Brek Shea, of course, had already been an MVP candidate in MLS, and now has 15 USMNT caps. (still only 22 years old).

We have three starting goalkeepers in this age group in MLS: Hamid, Johnson, MacMath. We only need to "hit" with one of them for the USMNT to be set for years. [Guzan's staking claim to the 2018 cycle anyway]

Joe Benny Corona is getting playing time for a good Tijuana team.

Kofi Sarkodie and Sheanon Williams are now starters in MLS. Despite the grief that Sarkodie got for being in the U23 qualifying team, he's now demonstrating what the fuss was about. He's improving his defensive game, and is a terror up and down the flanks. He's been starting in the playoffs for Houston.

At centerback, Matt Hedges and Tommy Meyer came on strong. Let's not forget that Zarek Valentin got into 15 games for Montreal, and did pretty well.

There's a lot of talent in this 20-23 year old age group for the USMNT to pick from. Klinsmann has grabbed a few of the guys, and I bet we see a bunch more get a look in winter camps/friendlies.

And let's not forget that there are quite a number of NCAA players in this age group that will emergy. Dillon Powers of Notre Dame will be a top 5 pick in the draft. He's a 2-way midfielder that at one point was the captain of this group with the U20's. I could run down a real long list there, but there are plenty of guys to talk about here. Sebastian Ibeagha and London Woodberry will be in MLS next year as homegrowns for Houston and Dallas, for instance.

[There are a couple of recent U23s that haven't done much. Ike Opara is a source of constant frustration. Seemingly has talent, but juuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuust seems to be missing something. Jared Jeffrey really hasn't emerged. Teal Bunbury hasn't taken the "next step." Michael Stephens seems to be the odd man out in the LA midfield. Tony Taylor is a mystery.
Stefan Jerome has fallen off the face of the planet.

Then there's Freddy Adu...............................................]

The next U23s are gonna more talented. Not only are they gonna be more talented, they'll be playing for some decent teams outside of MLS.

Couldn't agree more with you even if I try.
p.s. and let's not forget about young Julian Green.

Pelosi is not close to first team action. He is playing NextGen which is essentially U21's. Liverpool buys alot of players, not all players come up through the ranks. So your two presuppositions are not true, he is not a reservist, and he is not close to first team action. We are always looking at talent. Most of our talent for the U23's were below the maximum age for eligibility. The younger you get the more difficult simply due to physical variability. Playing up is always considered, less impoortant on the national team structure, and simply not really a major issue or benefit you think. We need to fill in so many other gaps to get to a point where we have 16 yr olds playing up with 18 yr olds everyday in a professional development structure. Most national camps are a week or two so not the intensive comprehensive play we need. If I can offer some comfort that Ben Lederman who's 12 is playing up having been called into the U14 National Camp.

Isn't Liverpool's reserve team essentially their U-21 team? That is the highest level they have besides the first team, so he is one level away from the first team. If I am not mistaken, he could be playing for their U-18 team right now, so the fact that he is playing with the U-21 team probably shows something about what they think of him. Plus, the reports form the games have been almost all positive.

I think you are overrating the physical variable. Flores is not a target forward who relies on his strength and height. He is a technical player that relies on his skill and quickness. Just look at players like Messi. I am sure I was bigger and stronger than Messi at 15 or 16 years old, yet Messi is the best player on the planet having probably below average strength for the average adult male and being about 3 or 4 inches shorter than the average adult male. Sure, if we were talking about a CB or a CF, you might have a point, but soccer is not like other sports, the physical aspect is really not as important. I am not saying soccer doesn't involve physicality, but a 5'5 CF is the best player on the planet, that should say it all.

Now if Flores isn't ready for the U-20 level, skill wise, thats one thing. However, I think its something that merits discussion.

Did I argue that we aren't calling up players regardless of age, or did I say moving up some of the younger players is something that should be looked at.