The best players of the season 1982/3

Strömberg was part of IFK Göteborg's UEFA Cup winning team in 1982 and also won IFK's first national title in 12 years the same year. When Sven-Göran Eriksson brought him to Benfica winter 82/83 many Portuguese considered it part of his "Nordic excentricity", but Strömberg conquered the fans in short time.

In 1983 Sweden had an excellent year beating Holland 3-0 in Utrecht, Italy twice as mentioned, etc. Strömberg was usually brilliant and scored three goals vs world champions (one at Nya Ullevi, two at San Paolo).


Benfica was a world class team during Svennis' two years at Luz and Strömberg added all that power on the midfield that Chalana, Sheu & Co needed in their technically virtuosity. Unfortunately, Benfica's president Fernando Martins started spending so much money on the stadium (increasing its capacity from 75,000 to 130,000 by building a third "ring") that he couldn't afford Chalana (Bordeaux), Strömberg (Atalanta) and Eriksson (Roma) any more.

 

Hi comme,

I had been AWOL from BS for a while but I see you're still producing excellent stuff as always.

Just a quick one for you,

I see you've included both Richard Gough and Dave Narey in your lists, both stalwarts of Dundee Utd's defence, as well as Scotland internationals.

82-83 was the only season where Utd won the league and, whilst their defence was the best in the country the same could be said for their attack. With this in mind, did you consider Ralph Milne at all for inclusion in the wingers category?

To me, Milne was a more traditional winger than say, a Gordon Strachan, and from his right wing position he scored 21 goals in all competitions that season including 4 in Europe (where Milne has gone on to be the clubs all time leading scorer in European competitions) as Utd made it through to the q-finals of the UEFA cup.

I would assume his lack of international appearances hampered his selection?

 

It was a fine effort. I'm just glad to see our young team acquitting itself so well in the CL. Watch out for Wanyama. He is learning fast and making great strides. He wont remain in Scotland for very much longer, although I'd love to hold onto him for another season or two.

I haven't looked at your list (apologies) for 81-82. Danny was at the height of his powers in the 70's and the one season I would suggest he would have merited inclusion in the 80's would have been 81-82. He was captain for Scotland in Spain 82 but, for me, he wasn't quite at the height of his powers as he was the decade before. Some of that may have been down to the ankle injury that lost him over 12mts worth of football near the end of the 70's. He never quite had the same sort of pace after that. Danny McGrain wasn't a sprinter but he was deceptively fast when in full flow.

Roy 'The Bear' Aitken. They don't make them like that anymore. A pure old school footballer. Hard as nails. For Roy I'd suggest his title winning centenary season as captain in '88. Possibly again '81-82 season. In 82-83 Celtic were being hard pushed by both Dundee Utd and Aberdeen at the time. Roy, from what I can recall, was exceptional in defence but in the early 80's we were a better side going forward than at the back. He wasn't at his best for Scotland at the '86 World Cup but he was played in a midfield role and although he could cover for that position he was more effective at CB.

Tommy Burns could have been a notable mention for 82-83 as he was still in outstanding form carried over from the season before. Infact, Celtic's grip on the title was lost when Tommy succumbed to injury at the beginning of January as, before that, Celtic were flying. We had already won the League cup against Rangers and were looking unstoppable in the league. Both Arsenal and Everton were very keen to sign him before the season had started but Tommy signed a contract extension to remain at the club.

Murdo MacLeod may be worth consideration but I'd imagine the central mid area is well populated as is. 19 goals this season in all competitions. (some of them his trademark 20+yd screamers) including the winner in the League cup final against Rangers but as mentioned above, the title was lost, and this was due to the loss of Burns more than anything else.

 

Certainly GKs and DFs used to be more regulars in their rating through season.

For example, if you have two players with similar ratings and one is defensive player and the other an attacking player. In 90% of cases, the attacking one, would have the higher peaks during the season, instead both had similar average rating.

Coincidence or not, most people tend to remember in a better way the performances of the attacking player, instead they used ratings or not.


btw, i personally used those ratings in domestic league, to had a first view to the general performance, also considering the strenght of the league in that era.
As a second step, i added intl. matches (clubs/NTs) give it more importance if X player made impact (especially in high stages).
In this case, i could rated up/down one category from the initial class, considering domestic league only.

 

How do you know the performance in international matches? That is very difficult to assess for all (relevant) clubs and national teams.

 

The problem with incorporating international appearances, or the lack of, into how well a player was performing in a certain timeframe is the issue that a player can be omitted for international selection due to factors not pertaining to how well he was performing in a football sense.

 

In Italy, defenders and "mediani" were usually top rated in the 80s, when the general style of play was extremely cautious (not to say destructive). There was a major change in the early 90s with the rule against passes to the GK and in the same period Zdenek Zeman also brought an offensive revolution to the game (Liedholm and Eriksson had started in the 80s, but without domestic followers), and after that the top rated players have been mainly offensive MFs and strikers.

Yes, we tend to remember attacking players better, also because there is something called "topscorers", and there is no equivalent to that among defensive players of course. If we don't remember more than a few fragments from a WC or Euro, surely most people remember who was the topscorer.

But, honestly, how many remember the assist leaders of World Cups and Euros or CL:s?

 

why had Zeman followers and others not?

 

Liedholm's teams were kind of hybrid: he usually played zone defense, but when man-man-marking was needed, he did so. What was so typical for his fotball was the urge to pass the ball, keep possession, dominate. That was in sharp contrast to Trapattoni's Juve, that never - not even when they had the best squad in the world - really gave up that 'catenaccio' mentality (something that made Platini go bananas on more than one occasion). I think Italy wasn't mature for Liedholm's football yet, and maybe the 1982 WC victory made its footballing culture even less aware of the fact that a change was needed.

Eriksson's Roma 1985/86 was a brilliant and often spectacular team, but they blew the season in the last home game (vs already relegated Lecce), and since Italian football culture was still completely obsessed with titles, Eriksson got the tag "perdente simpatico" (nice loser). Which is probably the worst tag you can get here.

Zeman's Foggia was a real revelation to many people. There were a few seasons where Milan was so superiour and so cynical that "Zemanlandia" became the main attraction of the Sundays. What was so attractive about that team? Besides the attacking spirit, also the fact that Zeman had almost unknown players that he turned into stars. People still talk about that team: it became the symbol of a utopia, something to believe in when Berlusconi started all the transfer insanity that has culminated in recent years.

 

That was under Capello his guidance right?

Yeah, I remember that very well.

 

I'm not pretending give an exact science, just explain a methodology who let us rated players with less errors than using the fragile memories.

I personally conceded to awards, specialist analysis, etc. a valuable info to add/less points to the first rating (when available) in an adjustment exercise.

I can think of the likes of Di Stefano, Figo or Nedved, all of them in their primes, don't get the chance to show themselves in the biggest scenario.

So i would ask: their closest rated players, had an enough impact at intl. level or NT level to equally / surpass them in an overall rating in a certain year? This is more clear in a WC year.

Is also valid, imho, rated down a X player who had a supreme domestic league performance but failed into shine at highest level (i.e Ronaldinho in 2006). In this case the rating difference between him and closest competitors should be reduced considering club performance only.

 

About Di Stefano an argument can be made that it was his own fault.

Figo did show himself at euro2000 when he was in his prime. He got 2 assists, scored a great goal and was among the best rated players. He was also good past his prime for Portugal.

Nedved was great at euro96, in euro2000 again one of the best rated players (but in tough group) and in 2004 in injured condition, and was again good.

 

In South America, most people tend to remember in highest consideration to players who can make this game an artistic way to express themselves.

I'm thinking in the likes of Pele, Maradona, Garrincha, etc. None of them strikers per se.

 

Of course wasn't Di Stefano fault.
But i think that in his prime years, the difference between him and his closest competitors was huge enough to don't be surpassed for his lack of NT achievements in those years. Arguably with the exception of 1958

 

Why not?
Spain has the best club in Europe, stacked team with Kubala, Di Stefano, Gento doesn't qualify and no one cares?

Much appreciated if anyone can give me a qualified response with more insight.

 

Figo did very very well at Euro2000. mediocre in WC02 and so-so in Euro04 (Deco was better)
Nedved was good in Euro04 ... ((Baros was topscorer..for Nedved and Tomas Kocisky was better)

 

true .. why not?

The best Di Stefano did was to win Copa America 47 (6goals/7games) for Argentina (but not so sure he was the best player there!!!)

At WC58.... I guess Di Stefano was like Messi ... (could not adapt with the team) so he failed in QUAL 58 for Spain

WC62, he was a bit too old(36) and was injured not fit (on bench during the final round)
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Part of that ... I never rated Di Stefano in my TOP3 - besides the fact he was not so superb in invidual talents (like Pele Maradona Garrincha and arguably to Cruyff Zico ,,)

 

Italian newspapers have a professional category called "pagellisti" (from "pagella"=mark), which isa journalist who doesn't write the match report but simply gives all the players, coaches and referees a mark and a short explanation to why a 6,5 was given rather than a 7 etc. They are usually doing a great job and there's also a uniformity in standards that is difficult to find in other countries (in British press, the MoTM in The Sun can very well be the Flop of the Match in Daily Mirror etc).

Having said that, it's never possible to eliminate bias altogether. When rating a Messi, it's easy to judge the player by his own rather than general standards, and there's also a risk that a goal scored gives that additional point that the player hadn't deserved for his overall performance. This bias can be reduced by taking as many different ratings as possible into consideration, of course.

One big flaw in the "rating game" is France Football, who stubbornly continue to give the mark 0 to a sent-off player, regardeless of the quality of his performance.

 

Spain NT having that stellar cast at late-50s (i'd add Suarez too) it would be too excesive give all responsability to Di Stefano for the WCQ failed.

When i mentioned Di Stefano, Figo and Nedved i was thinking (mainly) in WC performances when they were in their primes, as examples of class players who don't shine in highest stage (WC knock-out stages in last years, could be arguably, but is off-topic)


btw, since everybody has their own thinking about rating players, my posts will follow the criteria i explained before, considering 82/83 was a post WC season.

So, let's back in topic

 

They had Suarez too.

Zarraga of Real Madrid wasn't even a sure starter.

That Spain NT was simply an all-star team in midfield and attack.

According to my sources they played with a forward line of: Kubala, Stefano, Suarez, Gento

I don't get it too.

 

It actually seems Di Stéfano had some responsability in Spain's WC fiasco in 1957. The Spanish team team was vitually out after only two games: first they only managed a draw vs Switzerland at Chamartín (crowd 125,000). El Mundo Deportivo describe the Swiss team as very defensive - as expected - and the Spanish team as slow and over elaborate. About Di Stéfano: "Esta vez Di Stéfano no nos convenció. No fué el ariete adecuado para romper un cerrojo" (This time Di Stéfano didn't convince us. He was not the kind of striker to destroy a deadbolt").

The Spanish goals were scored bu Luisito Suárez, after a combination with Di Stéfano, and Miguel, after assist from Suárez.

In Glasgow two months later Spain went down 2-4 to Scotland and once again the slow pace of the Spanish team seems to have been decisive. El Mundo Deportivo tells Kubala was included in the team only a few hours before kick-off, but that was not enough since "an errant Di Stéfano was completely obscured" ("oscurecido por completo un errante Di Stéfano").

The Spanish goals were scored by Kubala (assist Miguel) and Suárez (ass Miguel): on both occasions via Scottish GK Younger's hands.

 

Well then we should NOT give all the credits for Di Stefano winning 5 UCL for Real since they were the very first Galacticos team ever ... , NO? C'mon witrh Kubala, Gento and Suarez ... the team were virtaully equal to Brazil70 Brazil 82 or Brazil06 in NAMES. So IF we blamed on Ronaldinho at 06 or WC02 QUAL, then we should keep the SAME STANDARD.

However, I'll be fair to say it MIGHT NOT be "enough" games to judge Di Stefano in big stages besides 5games in WC58 qual ... and 7games Copa47 = dozen big games. (note I already IGNORED 5games at WC62 when he was not fit)

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Both Figo and Nedevd did well in Euro (2000, and 96/04).
At WC level: Both were just so-so in WC02 and WC06 respectively when their team FAILED in group stage. (At least Nedved had an excuse with Czech suffering injuries there)