The best players of the season 1982/3

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by comme, Oct 14, 2012.

  1. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    I said before that I was trying to create a "rangliste" for the whole of Europe from some historical seasons starting with 1980-1.

    http://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/the-best-players-of-the-season-1980-1.1886897/

    I've listed below a draft of the best players by position for Europe for 1982-3, and would like some feedback and suggestions on players. Who've I missed out, who shouldn't be included?

    If any of you want to have a stab at assigning the three ratings (world class, international class and national class) to the players then please feel free to. The players are in no particular order.

    Goalkeeper
    Franco Tancredi
    Peter Shilton
    Paco Buyo
    Bernd Franke
    Jean Marie Pfaff
    Andoni Zubizaretta
    Piet Schrivers
    Thomas N’Kono
    Ivano Bordon
    Rinat Dasayev
    Jim Leighton
    Zoran Simovic

    Fullback
    Sebastiano Nela
    David Narey
    Danny Thomas
    Kenny Sansom
    Manfred Kaltz
    Rafael Gordillo
    William Ayache
    Juan Jose
    Thierry Tusseau
    Alan Kennedy
    Santiago Urquiaga
    Claudio Gentile
    Phil Neal
    Antonio Cabrini

    Stopper
    Pietro Vierchowod
    Migueli
    Karlheinz Forster
    Francisco Bonet
    Ditmar Jakobs
    Andoni Goikotxea
    Antonio Alvarez
    Graham Roberts
    Moreno Ferrario
    Willy Miller

    Libero
    Richard Gough
    Alan Hansen
    Mark Lawrenson
    Johnny Metgod
    Antonio Maceda
    Humberto Coelho
    Holger Hieronymus
    Morten Olsen
    Ronald Koeman
    Maxime Bossis
    Roberto Tricella
    Gaetano Scirea
    Edinho
    Glenn Hysen

    Central midfielder
    Paulo Roberto Falcao
    Agostino Di Bartolomei
    Juan Barbas
    Graeme Souness
    Bryan Robson
    Lothar Matthaus
    Paul Breitner
    Uli Stielike
    Soren Lerby
    Ruud Gullit
    Jean Tigana
    Gary Mabbutt
    Miguel de Andres
    Ray Wilkins
    Carlos Manuel

    Attacking midfielder
    Michel Platini
    Dirceu
    Liam Brady
    Alain Giresse
    Khoren Oganessian
    Felix Magath
    Juan Senor
    Juan Lozano
    Giancarlo Antognoni
    Herbert Prohaska
    Carlo Ancelotti
    Safet Susic
    Michael Laudrup
    Fyodor Cherekov

    Winger
    John Barnes
    Gordon Strachan
    Jesper Olsen
    Bruno Conti
    Sammy Lee
    Steve Coppell
    Ludo Coeck
    Geronimo Barbadillo
    Salvatore Bagni
    Pierre Littbarski

    Forward
    Kenny Dalglish
    Karl-Heinz Rummenigge
    Charlie Nicholas
    Jan Ceulemans
    Franky Vercauteren
    Tibor Nyilasi
    Stoycho Mladenov
    Joachim Streich

    Striker
    Ian Rush
    Hans Krankl
    Rudi Völler
    Roberto Pruzzo
    Alessandro Altobelli
    Luther Blissett
    Peter Houtman
    Horst Hrubesch
    Vahid Halihodzic
    Fernando Gomes
    Erwin Vandenbergh


  2. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    Nobody?
  3. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

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    I haven't had much chance to look through/think about this one comme, plus I guess there's a bit of overlap somewhat with the prior seasons.
    I guess one thing I could ask is for the thinking/info behind Mabbutt in and Hoddle not. For Hoddle I guess it could be a case of it not being one of his best seasons.

    It'd also be interesting to see who you are thinking about for the highest ratings amongst the players you've listed so far.
    One player I might check would be Bernard Genghini, interestingly in his only season at St Etienne. I think he was mentioned in previous editions of your project, and it could be he struggled in this season anyway and he didn't score a lot of goals, so it's more out of interest - does anybody have a detailed analysis of his form in this season? Perhaps babourum would be able to help again.
    comme repped this.
  4. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

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    Good call on John Barnes I think:thumbsup:, although not for a World Class rating I'd assume (more applicable to his first season at Liverpool probably for example).


  5. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    Well Hoddle was injured for quite a bit of this season, so that hampered him. Mabbutt had his best ever season this year and started to establish himself in the England team which was no mean feat.

    Obviously the two players were leagues apart overall and Mabbutt normally played as a centre back but this year I think his fitness gave him the edge.
  6. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    For this season I would say Platini, Dalglish, Magath, Falcao, Forster.

    Undecided entirely on some others.

    People often ridicule Luther Blissett of course and suggest that Milan meant to sign John Barnes, but he was top scorer in probably Europe's best league. A real achievement that.
    PDG1978 repped this.
  7. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

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    Thanks for this and the other answer above. Yes, I'm sure Blissett had his limitations but it's similar to how Garry Birtles did a lot better at Forest than at Man United I should think.
  8. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

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    babaorum I meant - sorry I got that wrong before and it stuck wrongly in my mind.
  9. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    OK, internet seems now working a bit again.

    Well, I disagree with a few choices (don't think Förster was beyond question the best defender of the season) and I don't firmly believe in classifications as World Class or whatever but I'm certain that Piet Schrijvers doesn't belong in the list.. It is true that some questioned the offloading by Ajax, also because other experienced guys left which could have damaged the nurturing process of the young guys. That was the reasoning at least of the press and coach himself as well as the the young players.
    But his form wasn't very good and necessarily the best GK of the Netherlands or low countries. He went to Zwolle (and had as honor to play in the last competitive match of Johan Cruijff) but he gained infamous nicknames as 'bolle van zwolle' (literally 'the sphere/ball of Zwolle' which means something like 'the fat one of zwolle') and 'het lek van PEC' ('the leak of PEC').

    I would go for a Belgian GK and Pfaff was controversial for a reason. That was both related to Pfaff himself who had noticeable weaknesses and to the competition he had at that time.

    My 2 cents.
    comme repped this.
  10. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Concerning Forster,

    I have that doubt about the certainty because Dieter Bast, also an defender, has a higher rating and was more often included in the 'team of the week' too. Bast was 7 times included and Forster 4 times. 7 also seems to be the record for that season for a defender (not sure about this observation though).
  11. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    That's interesting. World Soccer stated that he was in the best form of his career and that he was going to be a huge miss for Ajax for whom he's been a key player.

    Also there was a suggestion that he was the Dutch player of the year. This was in a separate article by Eric Batty talking about why he thought Joachim Streich should have been European player of the year for 1983.

    Did you have the Dutch players of the season by the way?
  12. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    Forster received another world class rating overall though from kicker I think. In a preview for the 1984 Euros there was also a mention of him as being almost universally regarded as the best "stopper" in Europe.

    Where are you obtained the teams of the week from by the way?
  13. schwuppe

    schwuppe Member

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    msioux75 and comme repped this.
  14. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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  15. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    He was player of the year based on ratings. But it was controversial, he had also a few errors and his physical state was criticized.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Footballer_of_the_Year

    Btw, defenders and goalkeepers often have an advantage in average ratings based rankings.

    I'm also pretty sure that Belgian GKs as Preud'homme or Munaron were simply better.

    I'd say that Soren Lerby was Ajax their best player that year. He received universal praise. He went to the heavily indebted Bayern Munich which caused some big tears at Ajax - "debt financed Dinky Toy" and other blahblah. Chairman Harmsen said some unfriendly things and got unfriendly rebuttal back from Hoeness.

    How times have changed... Anyhow, Lerby was without debate seen as one of the best players of Ajax during and after the season.
  16. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes, completely agree on this.

    I do think that ratings (while extremely useful and helpful to a project like this) can be generally unreliable.

    I may well have said this before but Brian Glanville once said that it is impossible to write a match report and give out 22 (or more) match ratings at the same time. It's just too much to expect from someone in a 90 minute spell.
  17. Krokko

    Krokko Member

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    AIK Solna
    Country:
    Sweden
    Realiable or not, here are the highest rated players in Italy, Spain and Germany that year:

    LA LIGA
    2,06 Señor (Zaragoza)
    2,03 Maceda (Sp. Gijón)
    1,93 Barbas (Zaragoza)
    1,87 Álvarez I (Sevilla)
    1,87 Bonet (Real Madrid)
    1,87 Buyo (Sevilla)
    1,86 Gordillo (Betis)
    1,75 Cortabarria (Real Sociedad)
    1,75 Regenhardt (Málaga)
    1,74 Cardeñosa (Betis)
    1,71 Stielike (Real Madrid)

    BUNDESLIGA
    6,93 Franke (Braunschweig)
    6,85 Bast (Bochum)
    6,78 Burdenski (Werder Bremen), Matthäus (Mönchengladbach)
    6,77 Breitner (Bayern München)
    6,75 Schumacher (Köln), Kargus (Nürnberg)
    6,74 Pfaff (Bayern München)
    6,68 Strack (Köln)
    6,66 Völler (Werder Bremen), K-H Rummenigge (Bayern München)
    6,64 K-H Förster (Stuttgart)
    6,55 Wohlers (Bielefeld)
    6,54 Briegel (Kaiserslautern)
    6,52 Möhlmann (Werder Bremen), Nickel (Frankfurt)

    SERIE A
    6,77 Vierchowod (Roma)
    6,72 Martina (Genoa), Ferrario (Napoli)
    6,68 Falcão (Roma)
    6,65 Tancredi & Nela (Roma)
    6,62 Mannini (Pisa), Tricella (Verona)
    6,60 Tacconi (Avellino), Bordon (Inter), Di Bartolomei (Roma), Bagni (Inter), Brady (Sampdoria), De Vecchi (Ascoli)
    6,57 Fanna (Verona)
    6,55 Collovati (Inter)
    6,53 Ancelotti (Roma)
    6,52 Platini (Juventus), Vignola (Avellino)
    6,50 Scirea (Juventus), Edinho (Udinese), Galbiati (Torino)
    6,48 Dossena (Torino), Dirceu (Verona), Antognoni (Fiorentina)
    6,47 Gentile (Juventus), Spinosi (Verona), Barbadillo (Avellino)
    6,45 Causio (Udinese), Casale (Pisa).
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  18. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Interesting Matthaus is so high while he wasn't a locked starter at euro84 I think. In the first match against Portugal he was a sub anyway, and because of injuries (according to coach Derwall) he entered. In the other two games he was a starter though.

    In a preview Rummenigge mentions all good players of Germany and categorizes Matthaus in the second category (below the category with himself, Voller, KH Forster and Schumacher, who are of "European class" in his view). He said that in the context of some (not all!) unsatisfying displays by the team and that the team is good enough to play better.
  19. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    This is taken from the football ratings blog right?
  20. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    What is more reliable you think?
  21. Krokko

    Krokko Member

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    Yes. Ratings from Don Balón, Kicker and La Repubblica.

    Don't forget Glenn Strömberg's incredible form this year. The Swedish nat'l team was really impressive in 1983 (2-0 and 3-0 vs world champs Italy, 3-3 vs Brazil etc), and Strömberg was devastating on many occasions.
  22. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm struggling with Stromberg's appearances between IFK Gothenberg and Benfica. He only made about 35 league appearances in total for Benfica and he was unquestionably excellent in 1983-4, so I guessed he hadn't played that much in 1982-3. Do you have any more info?
  23. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't think there is a single source which can be depended on.

    These ratings are a case of me trying to piece together the picture, but I'm missing quite a few bits. So I'm using the average ratings, player awards, teams of the year, statistics where possible, books and magazines, hunches, trying to apply logic where possible and come up with what I can.

    I'm probably building a reasonably accurate picture, but it is definitely pretty distorted in places.
  24. comme

    comme Moderator Staff Member

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    Just to add that it's the imperfect nature of my sources that mean that help and opinions are so much appreciated. The more information and opinions I have the better these lists will be.

    Ultimately I do think the ones so far are reasonably accurate, and the closer to today we get the better they'll be. Once I get to 1990 I'm able to use the European Football Yearbook as well, which is very reliable IMO.
  25. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    That is why it is good to explain in key words the logic behind choices. Like in the previous thread.

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