The best players of the 1986 World Cup

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by comme, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2004
    I did hear that Bilardo did NOT want Pasarella in his team, since his team were SOLELY built around ONE player, a superstar in Maradona!

    In other words, Bilardo wanted to END the "Pasarella reign" (captaincy) from older coach ... Menotti, and rebuild his NEW TEAM (more European style = organized in midfield, solid in defense, and ONLY Maradona had freedom in attack!.

    This is another controversy head line from Fillol about that "Pasarella fiasco" at WC86:

    Jueves 15 de noviembre del 2012 | 19:25
    Carlos Bilardo le dio laxante a Daniel Passarella para sacarlo del Mundial 1986
    Ubaldo Fillol no dudó en revelar lo que se pensaba. “‘Bila’ llevó a ‘Passa’ y le dio una laxante que al final lo sacó del equipo”, dijo.
    [​IMG]

    Argentina terminó siendo campeón mundial en México 86, sin Pasarella. (Internet)

    (GOOGLE translate)

    Ubaldo Fillol , former goalkeeper of the Argentina national team, revealed that former Albiceleste strategist Carlos Bilardo took a laxative to Daniel Passarella to remove Mexico World Cup 1986 tournament was eventually won by the Argentinians.

    "He (Bilardo) was always very aggressive with Passarella and me, because we were kidney (former coach Cesar) Menotti. In football could not objetarnos. However, do not accept the relationship with 'El Flaco' (Menotti). He made me play every game and then cleansed me, "said Fillol.

    According to former goalkeeper, "Daniel (Passarella), however, took him and gave him a laxative you took it out of the computer. And nearly killed him. " In consultation with Fillol whether literally or figuratively speaking, former River keeper replied, "It's literally all we know, but no one dares to say it. Where was Passarella Mexico during the World? Internship with infernal diarrhea. They gave him something to drink, "he said.

    According to a popular story circulating in the football environment, but denies Bilardo during the second round match of Italia 90 World Cup between Argentina and Brazil, the former coach had prepared a container in which water mixed with sleeping pills and was the offered the Brazilian Branco as he approached the rival bank to hydrate.


    =============================================================

    Maybe Vegan or Once had something to say about this???


  2. Once

    Once Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2011
    One thing is what happened to Passarella and another thing is what was known at the time. We are discussing the latter, not the former.
    I think it is pretty clear that the general impression was that he was going to play.
  3. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2004
    That's the KEY! I think both of you are correct in your point.
    I agree that to many people's surprise (at time in Argentina) Passarella was "dropped" with excuse as "not fit" or Injury! So just lately Fillol made a very controversial claim (as above) of what "happened" with Passarella!
    Still remained as unclear ...
  4. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

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    Jul 19, 2008
    A laxative can take a player out for an entire month? :rolleyes:


  5. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    Sep 17, 2004
    Who stops him to give it before every practice game LOL ... j/k
    That could well be an exaggeration on Fillol's part .. but clearly Bilardo did not like Passarella as captain of his team, at least not in his idea
  6. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Once said some posts ago that Passeralla not playing the first game was a surprise (post #92 for example) but it wasn't in my estimation. The illness he had can take a long to leave the body, let alone coming back to full strengths after not training for four consecutive days at all and losing 3 kilograms (Passarella was a 70kg bloke). It was only a five days before the first match that he was declared 'recovered'.

    Apparently the Argentinian camp wanted to give the impression of a full recovery (while in reality he had still the same illness), but only the bookmakers know whether they were swayed by this. Maybe they only would do so when they saw visible proof of the recovery (actually, some trainings were done in public, with journalists around the field).
  7. Once

    Once Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2011
    In post 92 I said I found surprising that by 31/5 it would have been known Passarella was not to play, as you claimed. It was in post 97 that I said "I bet more than one was surprised not to see him in the lineup". Vegan had made a similar remark previously. And it is completely reasonable if contrasted with what Mundo Deportivo had to say about it at the time.
    At the time the team doctor said Passarella had lost 3 kg of weight, he said he would make him subject of a special treatment to help him regain it, that was a week before the debut (published 27/5). Passarella's affliction at the time caused him to practically dehidrate. So his weigh loss was related to that. Dont fighters lose crazy amounts of "water weight" to make weight before fights, and a day or two later they not only have regained it, but they step up to a ring and do what they do? If two days later (published 29/5) it is said that Passarella is recovered and training again, he had likely been under the said regime and gained some weight back. And there were still a number of days ahead to continue treatment before the debut. That is the last thing Mundo Deportivo had to say about it. Since they had been following the situation and said nothing more about it until after the first game, it was likely because there was nothing more to say about it. Again, it is easy to look at it retrospectively when everybody knows how it went. Another thing is what was said about it at the time. And THAT is what we were discussing. No matter how much we go back and forth with it, it looks like it was not known by 31/5 that Passarella was not going to play, as you said, and it did catch more than a few by surprise that Passarella did not play the first game.
    There is no way we know what these bookmakers had in their heads when they announced their four favorites (Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay and Mexico), although a pattern does become evident. Only one team in their top4 made it past QFs, btw.
  8. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

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    Club:
    Feyenoord
    The thing is that this loss of 3kgs was still the situation when he was transferred to the hospital. It was also the situation after the first game, when his absence was clarified by the staff.
    Considering that a couple of training sessions took place in public, open for journalists, was the recovery visible? I don't know.

    Yes, I agree that the Argentinian staff wanted to communicate a successful recovery programme, from 29/5 until the first game (in Italian archives - La Repubblica - you can find that at 28/5 his illness was seen as something serious, but at 29/5 and 30/5 they reported a recovery including a successful test game against a Mexican club behind closed doors).

    You can think I was wrong but I still think it was throughout the tournament far from certain that he would play.
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2013
  9. Once

    Once Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2011
    The thing is what was known about the situation by 31/5, not that which was discovered later or what we know now.
    When did such clarification (in the bolded part) take place? Because the first thing Mundo Deportivo says about it after the first game is from June 4:
    http://hemeroteca.mundodeportivo.com/preview/1986/06/04/pagina-57/1138123/pdf.html#
    "Passarella will play against Italy"
    "This would be the only change in the lineup from the debut game, with Passarella in for Brown"
    "Team doctor Raúl Madero said Passarella was not included in the first game because he was not at the 100% of his capabilities".
    "The veteran footballer was affected by a enterocolitis last week and then suffered a gastric reaction to the medications he was given".

    BTW, this page also shows Brazilian legend Sócrates claiming that both Brazil and Mexico's games are fixed (his accusation sparked by a goal that in his view was incorrectly disallowed to Spain in the match Brazil beat them 1-0) for political and commercail reasons. He basically claims that the WC is a business and if Mexico and Brazil didnt move on to the next round, such business would suffer greatly. Interesting.

    Do you know of any reports on Passarella either not participating of them or doing it and looking bad? At least Mundo Deportivo does not publish anything like that and, as I said, having been following the situation like they had, I would imagine they would have said something like this if there was anything to say about it. On June 5, a day before the second game, Mundo Deportivo places Passarella among the starters to face Italy:
    http://hemeroteca.mundodeportivo.com/preview/1986/06/05/pagina-18/1138139/pdf.html#

    And such indications of recovery from the Argentinian staff continued after the first game for what MD informs.

    That he would not play was not a certainty either for a good part of it.

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