The 2012-13 Season Thread | The Tito Era begins!

Interesting thing from an article on Song, the notion of Barca occasionally playing a double pivot. Not sure it suits Barca but with both our fullbacks so attack minded and the success Spain has had with the formation who knows: He even ventured a new tactical variation with the player in the squad: "We can also play with two holding players or bring him on for the last minutes if we need more height on the pitch. He can play in three positions". http://www.marca.com/2012/08/21/en/football/barcelona/1345536742.html

 

He can actually play in four, he's played as a rightback a few times before as well.

With Alba and Song (who can play fullback) in the squad, pretty much means we won't have to see Puyol anywhere other than central defense anymore. A good thing in my opinion, his days of playing as a fullback are over.

 

IMO playing 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 (with Barca) is a bit theoretical (not totally, but a lot). I mean we almost always have the back four, and in front of them six players and since the backline is usually high, the "front 6" is packed in opponent's side of the pitch. Label them as 3-3 or 2-3-1, makes little difference. Might as well label it 4-2-4 as Xavi usually plays a little closer to our own goal than Iniesta. Or 4-1-1-4.

As for fullbacks, I dunno why Puyi as fullback would be something we should totally avoid. He is not at his best there, but IMO there's a chance he is more valuable to the team than Song there. It's one thing to sign Song and think he can play in two spots, but thinking he covers three spots is something else. Who plays three spots for Barca? No one, though Puyi did that exceptionally well I think. Some could, but it wouldn't be for Barca's best.

 

Well I agree that I'd prefer not to see Puyol start at FB and with Adriano backing up RB and LB and Montoya backing RB the only risk is needing Puyol to cover LB if Alba and Adriano are both injured/suspended at the same time. Even in that case, while Muniesa's injury hurts, we could perhaps see sneak peaks of Grimaldo at LB or the triumphant 2nd return of Abidal at LB (possibly happening as early as December). So unlikely to need Puyol even at LB but for the moment he has to be 3rd on the depth chart at LB and 4th at RB. And I'd rather see Puyol starting then Song or Thiago or JDS.

Of course our CBs and DMs still have to "deputize" and play wide as the situation warrants when Alves and/or Alba are caught out by a quick counter attack which often starts with a long pass behind one of them.

Tito: “I’m also very happy that Abidal can be here with us. [Addressing Abidal] If you feel strong and if you have the desire to come back, I’ll wait for however long it takes, your struggle is our source of strength.”​

 

with Song's arrival and Muniesa's injury the 25 first team jerseys are currently like this. Still need to re-sign Tello long term which could include a promotion (and till he's signed the rumors of his leaving will also persist) but for now he is Barca B and plays first team wearing the #37 jersey and Sergi Roberto does same wearing #28. JDS may be surplus with Song's arrival and there are rumors of him leaving, Affelay away rumors also persist. But for now this is what we have (sorry for the formatting and a nice link here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012–13_FC_Barcelona_season which suggests our whole squad cost only 214M Euros as so much was home grown via La Masia ):

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1​

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GK​

Víctor Valdés (3rd captain)

2​

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DF​

Dani Alves

3​

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DF​

Gerard Piqué

4​

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MF​

Cesc Fàbregas

5​

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DF​

Carles Puyol (captain)

6​

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MF​

Xavi Hernández (vice-captain)

7​

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FW​

David Villa

8​

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MF​

Andrés Iniesta (4th captain)

9​

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FW​

Alexis Sánchez

10​

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FW​

Lionel Messi

11​

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MF​

Thiago Alcântara

12​

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MF​

Jonathan dos Santos

13​

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GK​

José Manuel Pinto

14​

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MF​

Javier Mascherano

15​

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DF​

Marc Bartra

16​

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MF​

Sergio Busquets

17​

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FW​

Pedro Rodríguez

18​

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DF​

Jordi Alba

19​

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DF​

Martín Montoya

20​

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MF​

Ibrahim Afellay

21​

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DF​

Adriano Correia

22​

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DF​

Éric Abidal

23​

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FW​

Isaac Cuenca

24​

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DF​

Andreu Fontàs

25​

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MF​

Alex Song

—​

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DF​

Marc Muniesa

 

Stops you every time when you see the figure how good a deal Pique was.

 

Yup. In many ways, we've been playing kind of a 4-2-4 formation for a long time with Xavi-Busquets as a double pivot and no real strikers.

Though the brilliance of this team is that it can morph formations as needed without subs.

 

Same for Keita, Alves, Abidal, Yaya, Marquez, Eto'o, and Ronaldinho among others.

 

Some of those deals were the sort where we paid a lot but the product was great. Ronaldinho, Alves, and Eto'o were all very expensive (of course, esp. with Dinho and Eto'o prices were different in general). Yaya was a steal though.

 

I understand it was a high profile match, but we should have scored 3 or 4 in London and we scored twice at home. So it wasn't like they were amazing defensively. They were worth their money in the 2nd half of the second leg, other than that we were all over them. I doubt having a Llorente to head in balls would have made a difference. Tito probably feels that same way, if we repeated those two matches 10 more times, Barcelona would have cleaned up.

I agree though, I was wondering about Pique up front when we do need some height. He's pretty good with the ball at his feet. If Song is that good too with the ball, then the better it is for us.

 

IF true that's a very interesting list, especially to see Cuenca's name supposedly included next to JDS and Affelay, as players Barca would loan out: http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/s...termined-to-fight-for-barcelona-place?cc=5901

 

I don't think Cuenca would be on the list right now since he's out injured for a few more months.

Afellay and Tello I can see us considering loaning/selling but not yet.
JDS and Fontas though are further down the depth chart.

Defense top 5: Alves, Puyol, Pique, Alba, Busquets
Defense next 5: Mascherano, Adriano, Song, Montoya, Bartra

Offense top 5: Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, Sanchez, Villa
Offense next 5: Cesc, Thiago, Pedro, Afellay, Tello

Outside looking in: JDS, Fontas
Injured: Abidal (I'll still be shocked if he returns), Cuenca, Muniesa

 

Good summary and an interesting way to break things down broadly (offense v. defense). Of all the players on our squad I agree that JDS is the most expendable with the arrival of Song (though frankly Song simply replaced the departed Keita whom I wish had simply stayed but I understand Spanish taxes were rising and China offered more PT, stardom, and money before and especially after taxes). But JDS wants to stay and he can provide cover for all midfield spots, still, since all of those have not one but two great players (Xavi-Iniesta-Busquets are backed by Cesc-Thiago-Song), he only gets significant PT if there are injuries. But really that is not much different than Montoya (he plays if Alves and Adriano are not available, and, even then might take a backseat to Puyol in a critical match).

Fontas is also outside looking in but assuming no true Abidal recovery (and given Muniesa's lost season to injury) he really just has to beat out Bartra to be the 4th CB (ignoring Song or Busquets moving back to CB from DM), and he was, to the surprise of some, promoted to the first team 18 months ahead of Bartra, so there's some precedent for him thinking he can beat him out again.

Affelay and Tello are both worth keeping at the moment, provided that they (especially Affelay) want to stay but either or both could be beaten out by Cuenca when he is back.

My thinking is that so long as JDS, Fontas and Affelay want to stay we keep them as valuable depth in case of injuries. But if they are unhappy we unload them now or in January, in that case I'd like it to be an outright sale in Affelay's case (and he'll also fetch the most money) but would consider a loan or sale with buy back right for the La Masia products who frankly might improve more with regular PT.

 

Still time to add that. Nothings changed yet.

 

I started thinking of the team like that last year. People get too caught up with who the backups are for a specific position. With a team as versatile ours, it made more sense to me to think of generally-defensive roles and generally-attacking roles.

Yes, I know that RB and LB are often attacking roles, but in terms of depth we tended to use CBs for cover a lot.

Which is my way of saying that I would be perfectly fine with a lineup of Puyol, Pique, Mascherano, Busquets, Song, Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, Cesc, Thiago even though such a lineup has no wide players at all.

 

I respectfully disagree. I mean sure, players can be versatile, but I don't think it's for the best of the team to see them as THAT versatile. Also wide players are absolutely crucial for us, as we can't pack all our guys to the middle because it would make the bus parking easier and us passing to each other more difficult. When we have the ball, players can move around the field more, but when we have to defend, people gotta know what to do, whom to keep etc. So I think the golden middle way between not versatile enough and too versatile is what I like, and I think that's what we've been doing the whole Pep era (and are I guess likely to continue doing) and it has been a part of our extreme success.

 

I'm respectfully with Rana, the width in a lineup like that would come from where? Messi as a winger again or Puyol pushing up the right side? Iniesta on the left wing w/o an Alba or Tello/Pedro/Sanchez/Cuenca to provide the real width. Yikes. I love our versatility but we do need our wide players.