Should we be afraid or VERY afraid? (Supreme Court Campaign Finance Decision)

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by purojogo, Sep 12, 2009.

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  1. purojogo

    purojogo Member

    Sep 23, 2001
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    #1 purojogo, Sep 12, 2009
  2. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

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    #2 DoyleG, Sep 12, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    More thank likely to open to road to proper campaign finance reform.
     
  3. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
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    #3 yossarian, Sep 13, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    How so?
     
  4. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    #4 appoo, Sep 13, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Can someone see if I have this right? A group of conservatives wants corporations to be free to use as much money as they want to during an election - by claiming that corporations have unlimited funds to give based on the 1st amendment?
     
  5. purojogo

    purojogo Member

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    #5 purojogo, Sep 13, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    ANd you might argue another group of conservatives, with far more clout and power, may be willing to do the same.... err....they are called the majority of the Supreme Court..... I truly hope this is not the case...

    BTW, going more directly to what you are saying..it all goes back to granting legal "personhood" to corporations.... and how far one is willing to go with this.....
     
  6. MasterShake29

    MasterShake29 Member+

    Oct 28, 2001
    Jersey City, NJ
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    #6 MasterShake29, Sep 13, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Would not the decision also apply to unions also? That would seem to side step the "personhood issue".
     
  7. Pathogen

    Pathogen Member

    Jul 19, 2004
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    #7 Pathogen, Sep 13, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    That's fine with me. I'm sure Unions would be more than happy to give that up if corporations were no longer granted personhood.
     
  8. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    #8 appoo, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    But wouldn't that also mean groups like Swift Boat could directly fund campaigns - limitlessly? I thought the campaign money was insane last year - but at least the vast majority of it was donated by people, and it had limits. This...wow.

    John McCain may have a coronary on the spot if the SCOTUS goes in a certain direction with this
     
  9. DoyleG

    DoyleG Member+

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    #9 DoyleG, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Same can apply to ACORN and MoveOn.org

    McCain might have a coronary but he would be happy to lead the charge against this in a much more broader campaign reform bill. Especially considering what he has done in the past is only a fraction.
     
  10. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    #10 appoo, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    I may hide in India for a year next election season. This is going to be unbearable. Hell I thought last year was on the edge of unbearable.

    I really hope he does, but he'd get ostracized in his party - far worse than he would have in the past, because of the internet. I mean, look at the Tea Party - which had a good message to start with, and ended up 75K marching on Washington, many comparing the POTUS to Hitler. The conservatives would destroy him.
     
  11. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
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    #11 yossarian, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    What would "proper" or "more broader" campaign finance reform entail?
     
  12. MattR

    MattR Member+

    Jun 14, 2003
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    #12 MattR, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    I have no problem with this, as long as the law would require the relationship to any corporation that provides over $100,000 to be graphically associated with all printed production material, and the disclaimer on radio and television ads using the parent company.

    For instance, "I am John McCain, sponsored by the Banks of the Federal Reserve, Lockheed Martin and Blackwater, and we approve this message."

    Corporations might as well just fricking sponsor a congressperson, for all the influence they have over the legislative process. At least then I can choose my Coca-Cola Republican over my Pepsi Democrat.
     
  13. argentine soccer fan

    argentine soccer fan Moderator
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    Jan 18, 2001
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    #13 argentine soccer fan, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    I am thinking of appropiate sponsors for political figures. Like for example Enrond could sponsor Bush or Viagra could sponsor Clinton.
     
  14. Metrogo

    Metrogo Member

    Apr 6, 1999
    Washington Hghts NY
    #14 Metrogo, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Corporations give through their PACs, as do unions. I don't see this as a major ordeal in campaign finance reform, since presumably the Corporations would be limited to the federal contribution limits.

    It is a major ordeal in jurisprudence. If the court overturns this 100 year old law, something that has been a part of our democracy for generations, it will be a new high water mark of conservative judicial activism.
     
  15. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    #15 yossarian, Sep 14, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    I've read previously that Scalia and Thomas both favor overturning Buckley v. Valeo, so potentially even the contribution limits could be in danger.
     
  16. purojogo

    purojogo Member

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    #16 purojogo, Sep 16, 2009
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Colbert, of all people spoke of this issue last night.... two full segments .... interspersed with insults to Mexico (is he mad about the Azteca game?)
    [ame="http://www.hulu.com/watch/95803/the-colbert-report-tue-sep-15-2009"]Hulu - The Colbert Report: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 - Watch the full episode now.@@AMEPARAM@@http://www.hulu.com/embed/tISgrCe24UhnIK3rLx7EAQ@@AMEPARAM@@tISgrCe24UhnIK3rLx7EAQ[/ame]

    Gee, the court reporter at the SC caused all this "corporation as a person" issue....? and with full intention at deception and to benefit his own ass? What utter bullshit....


    Colbert explained that the 1886 case (Santa Clara v. Southern Pacific Railroad) that conferred 14th Amendment equal protection rights onto corporations wasn't even in the original ruling. But when the Chief Justice made an off-hand comment that the Court wouldn't hear an argument on whether the 14th Amendment applied to these corporations (saying, "We are all of the opinion that it does"), the court reporter wrote it into the ruling opinion, and the precedent has held ever since. And that reporter of the Supreme Court didn't only have ties to the railroad barons, he used to run one.
     
  17. Dead Fingers

    Dead Fingers Moderator
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    Jan 22, 2004
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    #17 Dead Fingers, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    UPDATE


    Supreme Court eases restrictions on corporate campaign spending
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/01/21/campaign.finance.ruling/index.html?hpt=T2

    Washington (CNN) -- The Supreme Court has given big business, unions and nonprofits more power to spend freely in federal elections, a major turnaround that threatens a century of government efforts to regulate the power of corporations to bankroll American politics.

    A 5-4 conservative majority crafted a narrow overhaul of federal campaign spending Thursday that could have an immediate effect on this year's congressional midterm elections.
     
  18. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
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    #18 Dr. Wankler, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?


    Good. These poor corporations didn't have enough say in how the country was running.
     
  19. Chris M.

    Chris M. Member+

    Jan 18, 2002
    Chicago
    #19 Chris M., Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Exactly. I can't wait until the next congress when insurance and pharmaceutical companies have less influence on reform. :rolleyes: All of the aspiring "Joe Liebermans" will have their wish. Money for nothin . . .
     
  20. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
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    #20 superdave, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    ******** you Ralph Nader.

    This is very bad news. This, combined with the new supermajority requirement in the Senate, IMO will make this country ungovernable. We will not be able to address our serious problems for the foreseeable future. We just won't. The current way of doing politics is incapable of addressing climate change and the deficit.
     
  21. Matt in the Hat

    Matt in the Hat Moderator
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    #21 Matt in the Hat, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    This is great news. The constitution wins again!
     
  22. tomwilhelm

    tomwilhelm Member+

    Dec 14, 2005
    Boston, MA, USA
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    #22 tomwilhelm, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    If you think this decision does justice to the spirit of the Constitution, you're further out there than I thought.

    Corporations are not people.

    This country is completely @#$%ed.
     
  23. Matt in the Hat

    Matt in the Hat Moderator
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    #23 Matt in the Hat, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Hamilton would disagree

    They are just owned and run by them. Are unions people?

    Most of the world would love to be as ********ed as the US
     
  24. tomwilhelm

    tomwilhelm Member+

    Dec 14, 2005
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    #24 tomwilhelm, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    Not sure that's really true, but the sneaky #$&@ (J.C. Bancroft Davis) that actually caused this problem 82 years after Hamilton's death sure would...

    And why the hell would you, of all people, be citing Hamilton as an positive Constitutional example? Aren't you anti-federalist?

    Yup. And those individuals can contribute money to campaigns as they wish. They don't need a corporation to do that.

    No.


    So until the path to destruction we're currently on actually takes us down past Zimbabwe we're not supposed to be upset about it?
     
  25. appoo

    appoo Member+

    Jul 30, 2001
    USA
    #25 appoo, Jan 21, 2010
    Re: Should we be afraid or VERY afraid?

    I don't understand how ANYONE would be in support of this except for rich people who run corporations. AKA the upper 2%.
     
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