Should MLS institute a Community Shield?

Discussion in 'MLS: Commissioner - You be The Don' started by alslammerz, Aug 6, 2009.

  1. Philly33

    Philly33 New Member

    Aug 11, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Im not suggesting that all 65,000 k people from M&T Bank Stadium in Baltimore will follow mls simply because they have a community shield but it is evident that those 65k people like the traditional way of soccer. So i dont think that mls should shy away from certain things because they havent been americanized. If anything trying to change the league has had a negative effect in the past(the pk after every game era). And im not trying to say that mls will be able to attract all 65,000 k of those fans to the next dc united game anytime in the forseeable future, but if mls can gain 2 or 3 thousand then they are growing their fan base and thus the league is moving in a positive direction.
     
  2. alslammerz

    alslammerz Member

    Sep 3, 2007
    Staten Island, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    (slams head into wall... considers pointing out idea was to make winning the US Open Cup more profitable by adding another home game or to bring MLS soccer to non-MLS markets, not to convert the masses to the MLS...again tries to point out it's not to copy the EPL, and would be similar to what the NFL does with their Hall of Fame game... thinks better of it, just gives up.)
     
  3. DCUdiplomat96

    DCUdiplomat96 Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    I beleieve they came beacuse of the Teams not because its soccer lolol
     
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  4. WTAMUCrew

    WTAMUCrew Member

    Mar 16, 2009
    Amarillo
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't really have an opinion on the game either way. If it existed I would watch it but if it never happens I won't lose any sleep either. It could have many positives that other posters have already shared, but some other negatives could be:

    1. It would take place at the beginning of the season when MLS struggles to get fans in the seats.

    2. MLS has already fabricated a number of competitions and cups that fans are already supposed to care about. Although I did notice that fewer people had bad things to say about the Trillium Cup this year than in years past. Fans (especially new fans) need time to embrace and understand what is already here.
     
  5. henryo

    henryo Member+

    Jun 26, 2007
    Related Thread:
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/2011-mls-community-shield-for-real.1616631/#post-26397854

     
  6. henryo

    henryo Member+

    Jun 26, 2007
    Short Updates:

    L.A. are the Winners of the "Imaginative MLS Community Shield" of 2013, Version 2, between the Winners of USOC (K.C.) & MLS Cup (L.A.) of the previous season:
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/2011-mls-community-shield-for-real.1616631/#post-27022150

    2013-04-21 L.A. vs Sporting Kansas City (H) 2 - 0 W​

    The Winners of the the "Imaginative MLS Community Shield" of 2013, Version 1, between the Winners of USOC (K.C.) & Supporters' Shield (S.J.) of the previous season, will be know on Aug-18 instead:
    https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/2011-mls-community-shield-for-real.1616631/#post-27022143

    2013-08-18 S.J. vs Sporting Kansas City (H) -​
     
  7. Achowat

    Achowat Member+

    Mar 21, 2011
    Revere, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm like 68% sure that's not what "Imaginative" means.
     
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  8. henryo

    henryo Member+

    Jun 26, 2007
    Just try this, I'm like 66.67% sure it should work: ;)

    [​IMG]
     
  9. DCUdiplomat96

    DCUdiplomat96 Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Pleas NO, NO more Eurosnob fantasies, no need for unnecessary games.. I mean you can schedule a regular season game Between the League Champions and the regular season best record team. and make that the first regular season game like the NFL does.
     
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  10. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Doesn't need to be a Eurosnob fantasy, but I do invite a few more games, especially games that offer some silverware. It doesn't have to be a huge thing, but it can just be something for ratings and fun.
     
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  11. Achowat

    Achowat Member+

    Mar 21, 2011
    Revere, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    "I like soccer; I like soccer I care about; I wouldn't mind if there was a little more soccer". If you disagree with any of that, might I suggest to you basketball?
     
  12. DCUdiplomat96

    DCUdiplomat96 Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Meaningless Games do not get ratings, MLS barely get decent TV ratings as it is, if the League Followed the NFL like marketing they would be a lot more successful now
     
  13. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Meaning is what fans, teams, and players apply to it. If no one gives a rat's ass about this, then no one does. If it is, in fact, considered "meaningless" but fans flock in droves and players get really excited about it...
     
  14. DCUdiplomat96

    DCUdiplomat96 Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You must be talking about the eurosnob MLS fans who basically want MLS to look like a euro clone league.... still SS is just asmall appetizer its not even on the level as MLS Cup
     
  15. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Leave the Eurosnobs out of it. This is an added celebration/competition for last year's victors. I couldn't care less if it were a Community Shield or anything else. It's a chance for teams that succeed to have a bit more fun for their fans, and if it becomes a serious thing, then it's another piece of silverware to contend for.
     
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  16. BrodieQPR

    BrodieQPR Member

    Jun 27, 2010
    Michigan
    Club:
    Queens Park Rangers FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    it wouldn't hurt or anything so why not
     
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  17. Achowat

    Achowat Member+

    Mar 21, 2011
    Revere, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Can I, for the 10,000th time point out that all of sport is a social construction, and the only meaning is that which we apply to it?

    The MLS Cup is a meaningless hunk of metal until someone decides that the team that's lifting it is the champion and that the champion is something that matters.

    If fans and clubs care to say that the Supercoppa Americano is important, than that's the end of it. It becomes important.
     
  18. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I'm sorry. Was I saying anything else?
     
  19. Achowat

    Achowat Member+

    Mar 21, 2011
    Revere, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, other people were. I was backing you up.

    I gotcha back, Jack
     
  20. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Fair enough. I have a terrible way of speaking things wronglylike... just making sure I'm mangling poor old English again.
     
  21. davidrpaige

    davidrpaige Member

    May 17, 2008
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Frankly, I'm getting sick of guys like you who sit there and cry Eurosnob. It is not Eurosnob or Europosing or whatever you want to call it this week, it is embracing the inherent culture of the game beyond the rulebooks. Soccer has been played and embraced, outside the US, for 100+ years and therefor comes with certain nuances that we, as Americans, are finally accnowledging and embracing.

    For us, baseball has the same history track and set of traditions that soccer has for Europe/South America/World. Baseball grew from lose rules into the game today and became an important part of the American culture. For 100 years baseball was the National pastime (yes, I know NFL is now the top sport in America for the past 25-ish years, but in terms of history parallel I'm staying with MLB). Let's say, for whatever reason, the country of France decided to start the French Baseball League (FBL). The FBL would have teams in Paris, Monaco, Lyon, and other cities to comprise a full league supportable in France. After a few years, you happen to be in France and you say, "You know, I'm a bit tired of visiting museums, I need a break. I know, I'll go catch a baseball game in Paris." So you go to the game. While you are there, after the top of the 5th inning, all the Parisians stand up and start to sing "Le Mer." You ask what is going on and a French fan tells you "We get up and stretch midway through the game."

    Now, as an American you know that it is suppose to be the 7th Inning stretch, not the 5th. It is not in the rulebooks or anything official, but it is so part of the game that to even think about it anywhere else is, well, unthinkable. We have been doing this for over 100 years and that is just the way it is. Then there will be other changes to the game outside of the rulebooks the French do because, frankly, they might not know either the cultural importance or just simply unaware. Pitcher brush backs, protecting the pitcher, trying to slip in a spitball, and things like that are part of the game but not in the rules. Baseball is an inherent American game with traditions and "sports culture" elements that go beyond the rulebooks.

    Soccer is the same thing to England/Spain/Germany/ the world as baseball is to us. We are latecomer to the game as a profession and we are just starting to discover a lot of the small, not-rules traditions of the game. Soccer has a flavor and it is not hotdogs and crackerjacks. Lord knows we have done a lot of crap to make it "americanized": count-down clock; 35-yard off-sides lines; no ties; blue cards; golden balls. You know what? They all failed and those leagues that tried to do them failed. Why? Because we are starting to embrace some of the small traditions that is inherent in the game. Guess what? A lot of people like a lot of these things. The popularity of soccer has more to do with exposure to the EPL, Real Madrid, Barca, Bayern Munchen, Club America, and other big soccer teams/leagues. MLS was not created out of a vacuum, the rise of the global game to US audience was increasing, so it is going to inherit many of its aspects including culture.

    Soccer is becoming Football. I personally think this is a good thing. If you don't like it, you have the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA, NCAA, NASCAR, MLL, and other sports to pick from that doesn't have a european flavor.
     
  22. davidrpaige

    davidrpaige Member

    May 17, 2008
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I meant acknowledge, obviously. Ironically, this is what my spell check changed it to. When I looked back I was "what the...?!?"

    I meant loose.

    I do want to make one clarification about the trend of europizing soccer here in the US: I'm not in favor of pro/rel argument. Do I like the idea of it? Sure, but not as a system that can be instituted here in the US right this moment. Currently we just don't have enough teams and quality soccer players to make something like pro/rel work. Mabye in 25 years, if soccer popularity continues to trend the way it is, we could institute pro/rel? Possibly and I would support it then.

    I don't think the argument of instituting such a system like pro/rel tomorrow would benefit MLS/NASL/USL. In actuality, at this point in time, it would be a detriment. Again, we'll see where we are in 25-ish years before we do something like this. Then there is that single entity ownership situation...

    As for the OP, I think it would be a fun game to institute. I personally would be in favor of Open Cup winner versus the Supporter Shield winner. Just gives an extra incentive to win either of those pieces of silverware for the chance of another piece of silverware, which could also lead to more money to another team.
     
  23. canammj

    canammj Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    CHINO, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can't remember what the shield is played for in England. Something to do with the players fund or retirement? If thats the case, I am sure our players association won't mind the game if it can put some $ into a fund that maybe can help players that are hurt, have addiction issues, need therapy, family or medical issues etc. Maybe to avoid what the NFL is now dealing with regarding players who played in the past and are suffering from physical and other issues.
    Maybe also MLS charities or all the other groups MLS and the teams are involved in also get involved. Agree with the other post, ok with this as kind of a replacement of the Hall of Fame game. I don't think we need to go as far as calling it the Super Cup, as that is a little too Euro for me.
     
  24. Achowat

    Achowat Member+

    Mar 21, 2011
    Revere, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The money gets split between the teams who played in the FA Cup Proper to be distributed to charities of their choosing.
     
  25. chapka

    chapka Member+

    May 18, 2004
    Haverford, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not saying there might not be some truth to that...but I don't see how you get from there to "MLS needs a pre-season supercup."

    The supercup is a reasonably longstanding English soccer tradition; the Community Shield/Charity Shield has been around in its current state since 1930, and the idea of a preseason high-profile friendly in general long before that.

    It's not actually a longstanding tradition in the rest of the world. Most countries with preseason supercups only started holding them in the 1980s or 1990s. France is one of the few countries that started earlier, in the 1950s--and then they stopped due to lack of interest. The current Trophee des Champions was held for the first time in 1995. (And if there was any doubt that this is a money-making scheme, not a sacred soccer tradition, they haven't held it in France since 2008).

    Spain started their supercup in 1982, Italy in 1988, the Netherlands in 1991. Germany have only had a "traditional" Supercup since about 2007--before that, they had more of a mini-league format between 1. and 2. Bundesliga teams.

    It's also far from global. In the Americas, the only countries I know of that hold a supercup are Argentina, Mexico, and Trinidad & Tobago. And Argentina only started theirs last year. Brazil doesn't bother at all.

    Does this mean the U.S. shouldn't have one? Of course not. But it's not as much a part of the fabric of global soccer history that we're philistines if we don't.
     
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