Post-match: San Jose Earthquakes - Club Deportivo Chivas USA (Sunday, 5/13) postgame thread [R]

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by Goodsport, May 13, 2012.

  1. WondoSoWonderful

    May 3, 2012
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    im confused as to how anyone could put that goal on anyone except dawkins. it was dawkins who made the critical mistake, and hernandez and corrales who tried to cover for him
     
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  2. dred

    dred Member+

    Nov 7, 2000
    Land of Champions
    I think the kid got a lucky deflection off the defender, the ball had bizarre spin as it went in off the post. You also warned us about Juan Pablo Angel. ;)
    Every soccer game is a "close match" on the scoreboard. What was not close was the number of dangerous chances created.
    I don't think giving up 15 corners and requiring Kennedy to make several diving saves was a brilliant Chivas strategy, it was just the natural outcome of one team playing a lot better than the other. We didn't just take more shots, we created more scoring opportunities. They had one half-chance and somehow the cross snuck past Dawkins and Morrow, off Correa and in. (Meanwhile the Golden Boot winner skied every header.)
    Garza looks like he has some talent, and can use either foot, but that cross was the only thing he didn't screw up today, like when he stumbled over the ball and had to pick up a yellow to stop the ensuing counter. I'd like to see him get some more chances with the A team to blend in cuz he looks like has a ton more potential than say, Joey Gjertsen.
     
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  3. dred

    dred Member+

    Nov 7, 2000
    Land of Champions
    What's depressing is that Dawkins had actually closed the gap on the winger, and slowed down just as he got the cross off.
     
  4. falvo

    falvo Member+

    Mar 27, 2005
    San Jose & Florence
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Not sure but I think Ampai might be on his way out as he hasn't played at all yet this year. It was good to see Sercan Guvenisik finally getting minutes. Hope he does well.....
     
  5. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As I'd written in the in-game thread, the Earthquakes were missing their speedy starting wingers in the worst way. :(

    On a somewhat-positive note, though: we're now seeing first-hand why strong starts to seasons (something we haven't really been accustomed to in the post-Golden Age until this year) are so valuable. Vital midseason injuries tend to happen to almost every team at some point, but because of the Quakes' strong start, they're still currently in second place in both the Western Conference and in the league overall. It's certainly vastly different than from the past few years when the team had to scratch and claw to climb out of the hole it had already dug for itself by midseason or so; hopefully our depth can continue to carry the team through until our injured starters finally return. :)

    GO SAN JOSE EARTHQUAKES!!! :(


    -G
     
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  6. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ah yes, we are a team that has gotten used to speed, and we don't cope so well without it. And, that strong start that I've been whining about is proving very helpful.

    I didn't see the game. :( I've been wine tasting in Walla Walla and forgot to set my DVR. Damn.

    So while I didn't see the game, I think it's interesting, in an analytic sort of way, to see the different opinions on the match. I will note, that most observers think we should have started Croninja instead of Khari and that Garza should have gotten more minutes.

    On the Ampai front, he's not especially fast, but he can hold the ball in traffic, with his head up looking for options. He's got killer ball skills and looks to combine with other players. He wasn't great as a winger for us. I doubt that he'd bring more to the position than Baca, who is faster.

    That said, I expect us to cut or trade him, which is tragic.

    GO QUAKES!!

    - Mark
     
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  7. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Did the definition of tragic get changed recently? How did I miss that?
     
  8. hc897

    hc897 Member+

    May 3, 2009
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    When was the last time Cronin played? It feels like it's been forever. Khari had a few really solid performances and it appears that Yallop has decided that merits a start of every match now. I don't think he had a particularly bad game, mind you, I'm just confused as to why Yallop's given up on the middle pairing of Baca and Cronin that was so successful early on.
     
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  9. bsman

    bsman Member+

    May 30, 2001
    MadCity
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    OK -- here's my read on the game:

    The Good: I do have to applaud our forwards -- they consistently pressured the Goats' defense, creating many turnovers, corners, etc. by their tenacity, and also agree that Ramiro looked good yesterday -- Beita was strong as well.

    The Bad: However, I think that the pairing of Justin and Jason in the middle is not what I would have selected. Is Ike injured again? I'm perplexed that Frank didn't start him. I would have vastly preferred an Opara/Hernandez pairing.

    The Ugly: I though that for at least the first 30 there appeared to be little, if any cohesion in the midfield. Moreno especially seemed to be on a different page than the rest of the team (lots of passes to spaces where no one was making runs, etc.), Simon was essentially invisible and Baca saw very little of the ball. Eventually, Moreno was able to make some decent passes but I have to agree with the prevailing opinion that this midfield combination was, if not a disaster, at least the worst we've seen. Oh -- and I'm incredibly tired of watching Khari get beaten on headers by players a half-foot shorter than him. Someone should really teach him to jump!

    At any rate, I can report that Frank looked REALLY pissed off at the end of the first half, and not a whole lot happier at the end of the game. I believe we will see a significantly different team on the field this Saturday...
     
  10. hc897

    hc897 Member+

    May 3, 2009
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I thought the Jason and Justin pairing was pretty brilliant. Other than the goal (which wasn't really their fault), the two cleaned up everything. Hernandez' brilliant faked header to Busch comes to mind. Those two guys are far and away better soccer brains than Opara. Granted, Chivas didn't get forward all that often, and having Opara on set pieces may have helped some, but the guy has been the one leak in an otherwise water-tight defense.
     
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  11. Revolt

    Revolt Member+

    Jun 16, 1999
    Davis, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    First post pretty much nails it. I was going to comment that Conference USA kinda out-Quakes the Quakes yesterday.
     
  12. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Thanks to a little bit of luck and the good graces of others, I was actually at the game this time. I forgot how much faster soccer looks in real life.

    The Quakes didn't play badly. They played really, really good. The combined effort of the team is supposed to generate scoring chances and limit scoring chances for the other team, and that's exactly what happened. There are some good sized dents on the advertising boards on either side of the goals that can testify to that. It was just a lot of bad luck, a slightly bad day on Wondolowski's part, and most importantly a very well executed Chivas defense. This game wasn't a fluke - Chivas did the same (and worse) to other teams they visited.

    The 3-5-2 was brilliant, and I just wish it lasted for about 10 minutes longer before bringing in the forward heavy formation. I thought Dawkins looked much more at home in the center than on the outside, and should be starting there instead of Moreno, who is the only Quake I would criticize.

    Garza is ready for prime time, and I think should be playing until Chavez comes back. Guvenisik will be when he gets used to the speed of MLS play, but he has the talent and some absolutely amazing speed. He has to be put in as a late sub a few times so he can learn.
     
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  13. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    Chris Dangerfield called Correa the best player on the field in the first half. Quakes were fortunate that he cramped up and wasn't the same in the 2nd. There was talk that he might not play the 2nd half. As for Angel, if he plays, he's a guy you need to worry about because, while long in the tooth, he's a class finisher, and as we saw yesterday, 1 goal can turn a game.

    That's not exactly what you said in the pregrame thread...
    It's actually quite common in games where the road team goes ahead and decides to try to pack it in and see the game out. As I mentioned, there were multiple games just like this in 2010 where the Quakes were the road team with the lead, packing it in.

    Sure, he's excited, nervous, and green. But when you desperately need speed on the wings and you have a guy on the bench who has it, maybe it's a good idea to play that guy, green or not green. We've seen it pretty clearly now in the 2 games he's played a little bit. He has the ability to buy some space on the wing and cross the ball.
     
  14. ColinMcCarthy

    ColinMcCarthy Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Quite a bit of negativety here, undeserved. Here's my takeaways that haven't already been said:

    1. While I do think we missed the speed of Chavez/Salinas, I'm not sure how effective that would've been against Chivas at home, who were ALWAYS going to bunker. This was even more true once they got the early goal. Chavez is also tricky, so we probably did miss that.

    2. People criticizing Dawkins are off-base, by a long shot. He had about five dangerous shots, a couple of which were blocked. Recall the one in 2nd half that was a sure goal but for that defenders face. He controls the ball well, always. And links up well. Not to blame for the goal, as whoever turned it over at that point in the field was. He tracked back very quickly and was right on the Chivas player when the cross went in. Morrow just missed the clearing header. Hernandez was right on the goal scorer. Ball was going wide out of Busch's reach, but had MAJOR english on it to sneak in. Well taken but slightly lucky goal.

    3. I do think the team as a whole came out flat. Maybe it was the sun but after the second Chivas shot in the first 15 minutes, Frank was off his bench, yelling at everyone in not language to start playing.

    4. The switch was on in the first half but did not happen until Frank switched to 3-5-2 in the second half, pushing Beta up. Then Corrales hit some beauties to Beta, and we were getting a lot of chances. The first half 4-4-2 was neutralized by their five man midfield, and that's why we didn't look that dangerous first half. Frank and staff made good adjustments.

    5. Would've liked to have seen Cronin- Baca in the middle but understand that Moreno-Stephenson-Baca gives us more on the ground creativity. The right call given that Chivas were going to bunker and we didn't have a lot of experienced speed on the wings.

    6. Amazing how much expecations have changed. This was a good result given the circumstances. We showed winning characteristics in not giving up and then we got the tying goal against a very organized defense. And we were missing three starters.
     
  15. DasMoots

    DasMoots Member

    Sep 6, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    yallop got too cute with his starting line up. my first impression was woah that's a lot of "supposed" offense in the field from a group of players who all want to play the same position (center mid) and the result was what i thought was going to happen...a big muddled mess.

    as others have said baca is not a winger, dawkins for me is also not a winger either as he always goes into the center or even completely to the other side of the field instead of manning his sideline and running north south. imo dawkins is more of small forward who would play in wondo's spot (if ever there was an opportunity). not sure what cronin did to get bumped for the start yet i was fine with that but give ring a trot out at defensive mid or jma but not khari. khari is good coming in late if we are need of a goal and we can use his cannon otherwise keep him on the bench (he's not a forward either).

    yallop's idea of having ultra flexible players than can play anywhere on the field (in his mind) doesn't work. players have certain skills and putting them out of position will lead to break downs or in this case a muddled mess. putting round pegs in square holes was one of the biggest problems of 2011.

    start moreno or baca at offensive mid but don't have both on the field at the same time. keep khari on the bench as a defensive mid sub if we need a late goal. let your wingers play wing (garza, chavez, shea). rotate your fowards as needed (wondo, lenny, gordon, sercan, dawkins, pizzaro). keep it simple and put your players in positions where they can excel.

    one other thing wouldn't it be nice to have omar jasseh right now? the kid was cheap and as we all know lighting fast, maybe a bit of a head case but we only have 3 wingers and 2 are injured. where was the planning there?
     
  16. DasMoots

    DasMoots Member

    Sep 6, 2010
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    ampai is a center mid and should not be played as a winger
     
  17. nivla

    nivla Member+

    Jan 17, 2003
    Milpitas
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Overall, the team seemed to lack intensity in this game, and one example is Lenhart whom you usually expect more energy. Also, the final ball into the danger area was rather poor. The crosses in the most part were off or too short. Sometimes they were being too cute with the passes and no one was able to pull the trigger.

    This is what I noticed in the first half. I don't like starting Moreno and Khari in the middle. Too soft, too slow and lack of bite defensively. There is no protection before the backline. Chivas had tons of space in the middle and they were able to pass the ball without much trouble. And then the other 2 guys in the SJ midfield are actually CMs. Baca and Dawkins worked hard but they were not true wingers. They were not effective. We really missed Chavez and Salinas for their speed and restless effort. Also, a few guys wanted the ball and often ran into each other: Corrales, Dawkins, Moreno and Khari. The transistion and build-up was slow and that allowed Chivas to come back and defense the lead.

    In the second half, I like how Yallop made the changes. We went with 3 in the back and pushed Beita to the right midfield. Then we put in Gordon to have him up top with Lenhart. That allowed Wondo to play the shadow striker behind them. Then the change I like the most is Garza. That sub gave us a true winger with speed and the ability to take on people. Beita and Garza provided the width and options to send the ball cross field to break down the Chivas defense. However, I have to say that Beita's crosses were poor in light of how well he had been doing in that aspect. Only one cross that reached Wondo in the whole game.

    I am disappointed by Moreno. He made things too complicated . I expected him to control the tempo but not just slowing things down every time. He was also reluctant to take a shot. I would expect a true #10 to put in killer passes. I know he was trying that but he could not pull it off.
     
  18. JazzyJ

    JazzyJ BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 25, 2003
    I would put the goal on Hernandez, Corrales, and Dawkins, roughly in that order. It was Hernandez who lofted up what turned out to be a 50:50 ball. Yes, Dawkins should have come back to challenge for the ball, but it was going to be a 50:50 ball anyway the way it was played. And then Corrales was in position to make a play or mark someone, and he kind of stabbed at the ball unsuccessfully and then started walking. In the meantime Dawkins ran like hell to cover the outside guy (Riley), and Hernandez allowed Correa to get the shot off.
     
  19. Beerking

    Beerking Member+

    Nov 14, 2000
    Humboldt County
    That goal was created by, and allowed by, Hernandez, it's his, he owns it.
     
  20. QuakeAttack

    QuakeAttack Member+

    Apr 10, 2002
    California - Bay Area
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Generally, I have to agree...However, I wasn't so much mad at Hernandez for the initial pass as for his poor marking on the cross. He needed to be between the goal and his man as the ball arrives at worst. In this case, he was behind the player and couldn't even stop a flick to the far post. Let's face it, with Jason in the game, I feel the Quakes will give up at least one goal a game. Still...

    The team just wasn't mentally in the game. My wife thinks that they are starting to read too much of their press clippings. They seemed content to just knock the ball around and were caught flat footed. Still, the team has more than enough opportunites to score. Just poor finishing and decision making. Lenhart had too point blank opportunites (head and shot from the left side of the goal). Beta had a couple of poor crosses and shots went into players or around them when they shouldn't. Other than a few players who bad games, it just seemed each player had a couple of bad moments at the wrong time for the team.

    I agree with those who didn't like the pairing of Moreno and Khai in the middle. Moreno had a poor game and you could see some of the players getting frustrated. Still, give some credit to Chivas. They played a diciplined game and played hard. Other than the time wasting, they played a decent game.

    Lastly, I'm really frustrated at Ricardo who used to be a decent ref. Gordan is getting held by Moreno on a half volley in the second half and no call! I could partially understand if Moreno let go as the ball arrived, but he was still holding him. Ricardo had a perfect view and no PK call. You can't say it didn't affect his shot on goal. :mad:
     
  21. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  22. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  23. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  24. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  25. Goodsport

    Goodsport Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 18, 1999
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A photo gallery of the game can be viewed here and highlights of the game can be viewed here.

    GO SAN JOSE EARTHQUAKES!!! :(

    -G
     

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