Road to Brazil 2014: Peru-Colombia, Lima

Discussion in 'Colombian National Team' started by pepinointer, Apr 7, 2012.

  1. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Si pero contra Bolivia se veia cansado en el 2ndo tiempo por eso esque Leonel lo sento, aunque por el otro lado Guarin en ese momento si no me equivoco estava un poco pasado de peso... De todas formas pa cerrar un partido Valencia Sanchez daria mucha seguridad y Cuadrado puede bajar mas (cosa que hace en Lecce donde juega mas retrasado)

    Pipe you have to understand something, he has been playing as 5 for 4 or 3 years ago.. Sometimes players just have bad games... We cant cruzify him for that game just saying that 10 is not longer his posicion
     
  2. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    I'm not crucify him, I do think that Guarin, Sanchez & Valencia are better then him in the middle of the field. Aldo played as a "5" i Santa Fe and when he moved to Nacional, he played way more offensive, like a "10" and had a wonderful job. I must be honest that I'm not follow him in the past 2 years, but also he hasn't had the best time in Mexico. By the way, 3 years ago he returned to Nacional for one semester, he never played as a "5" in our club. Aldo Leao can produce much of him when he play as a AMC and not as a DM but that's my own opinion.
     
  3. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    There's so many ways Pekerman can go with this.

    He can stick with his Aldo-Sanchez experiment he started against Mexico. He can bring in Valencia and have him start with Sanchez (which I like a lot in theory) but this could be dangerous due to them never playing together in a match. As others have mentioned in other threads Soto can be an option, but I am not sure he and Sanchez mesh chemistry wise either. Guarin is getting back into his groove again but he is a bit of a liability on Defense. His abilities on attack though can't be denied.

    I trust in whatever Pekerman chooses.

    If it were up to me I'd just stick with the mexico lineup for continuity.
     
  4. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    And give up on Guarin? :eek: We cannot efford it. Guarin is our best CM and must play vs. Ecuador & Peru.
     
  5. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    I don't see it as giving up on Guarin. I see it as believing in the system and believing in the team that was out there against Mexico.

    I think we can afford to do it. Aldo is not much of a drop off and is better defensively.

    I won't complain either way. Guarin can play.
     
  6. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    Also look at it from a strategy standpoint. If you can bring in Guarin as a second half substitution that could be an even greater benefit against tired legs.
     
  7. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Pibe the thing is that u said "Aldo cant perform well as 5" and thats not true; hes been playing defensive mid in Mexico and doing it pretty good, so whe u say "Aldo cant perform well as 5" u make it sound like end of story and im pretty sure ur making that opinion based on Mex Game, now like i said before we aint a superpower NT so we need everybody in good level

    The mid im pretty sure is going to be Sanchez Guarin... Now if Aldo manages to show in la sele what he shows in Mex he can come in for Guarin, (because even though theorically Valencia defends more Aldo can attack more, so he would be Sanchez replacement) also Guarin is not playing 90 min because he gets tired we dont know if he is going to be match fit 100 by the time we play Peru

    Clenbuterol Soto and Sanchez had play together before not with Valencia though but those two had already play together

    Also the usage of mids depends on how many ppl are going up front, we know James, Cuadrado (2 wingers) and Falcao (Striker) are deff starting, if Pabon start then we are playing with 2 DM (Sanchez - Guarin) (im not a big fan of Guarin playing as a double 5 though)
    And if Pabon doesnt play then Guarin can play in thaf line of 3 in the mid which is the best for Guarin, Sanchez obviously is the DM and in the left i guess Soto could go in like those 3 used to play in Copa America
     
  8. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    I have not seen them play as Defensive midfielders together. Soto has been more of a left attacking midfielder/ left wing for Colombia.
     
  9. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    No, I would still go out on the field with Fredy. This is a crucial week for us and we need our best gunners. By the way, I don't agree that Guarin is less defender then Aldo. Don't forget that Guarin was a DM until he improved his attacking game and became more offensive. He still can tackle well and defend if he'll need to. I would like to see the same lineup vs. Mexico but with Guarin & Sanchez in the middle and I still have my doubts if Perea should start next to Aquivaldo. I don't like Perea but he is much more experience the all of our CB's except Yepes. On the other hand, his "experience" cost us in a goal vs. Venezuela. I think that Zapata-Aquivaldo can be good for the games.
     
  10. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Ohhh but i thought u meant just playing together not in a certain position
     
  11. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    I have seen lot's of Mexican soccer the last decade and I have to disagree. Aldo right now is slightly better on Defense than Guarin. Especially since Guarin has a tendency to lose his cool and get yellows when things aren't going his way.
     
  12. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Maybe I wasn't express myself good enough and picked up bad words. Yes, Aldo can perform as a "5" and already did it in Santa Fe and I admitted that I haven't seen a lot of him in Mexico. As a person who saw Aldo for 2-3 years every game when he played in Nacional, the guy seem to be wonderful when he played as a "10" or an "8" and helped the offensive part a lot. He and Aristi were the main reasons in our 2 titles in 2007. aldo never played as a "5" in Nacional, this is why I thought that it would be better to use him as an attacking mid and not according the friendly vs. Mexico but basically you are right, it won't hurt us to try him in another position.
     
  13. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    I'm not disrespect Aldo and honestly he is one of my fav players as a Nacional fan, but we need to win these games and I would like to see Guarin up front who can co-op much better with James and Falcao then Aldo. these are extremely important games for us and guarin is very needed.
     
  14. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    You are making it seem like Guarin is the key to victory. I think we can win without him starting.

    We shall see.
     
  15. crzdcolombian

    crzdcolombian Member+

    Jul 17, 2006
    Avon,CT
    Club:
    FC Internazionale Milano
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    According to losing him against Venezulea and turning to shit and not having him against Argentina. I say no we can not win without Guarin or Sanchez in the middle
     
  16. Clenbuterol

    Clenbuterol Red Card

    Aug 25, 2011
    Club:
    --other--
    We did not have Falcao in that match too. We also did not have Pekerman as coach. There's a lot more factors you have to take into account than just Guarin not playing.
     
  17. pibe10

    pibe10 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 30, 2005
    Petach Tikva, Israel
    Club:
    Atletico Nacional
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    No I didn't say it. We can win with or without Guarin as well, but if I need to choose, then Guarin it is, he is much more complete player then Aldo. The fact that we played decent vs. Mexico in one friendly, doesn't mean that you should give up on one of your key players and GUarin is a key player. Not the only factor but sure is ver important one.
     
  18. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Nadie esta diciendo que Aldo es mejor que Guarin, solo que si Aldo jugara en la sele como lo hace en Mexico pueden haber razones tacticas para poner a Aldo en un partido donde se necesite mas marca pero tambien alguien que tenga vision.
     
  19. pipevasquez

    pipevasquez Member+

    Sep 8, 2007
    Bogotá City
    Yo, si creo que Guarin es indispensable para la selección. El medio campo sin el, se queda sin ideas y es el mejor acompañante para James
     
    minus repped this.
  20. corazonazul

    corazonazul Member

    Jun 29, 2007
    canada
    seguramente, viendo el primer tiempo del inter vs milan, se junta muy bien con schneider
     
  21. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    Guarin es el titular no hay duda, pero aveses tacticamente se sientan jugadores...
    Por ejemplo imaginate que Valencia muestre lo de Brasil, tu lo puedes meter de titular haciendo un doble 5 junto a Sanchez vs peru

    Y cojes a Guarin fresco y preparado vs lq altura de Quito...

    El equipo ahora recien se esta armando y no tenemos nisiquiera un 11 titular, pero creo que a futuro Pekerman puede banquear jugadores que uno esperaria fueran titulares por razones tacticas
     
  22. minus

    minus Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jul 18, 2004
    Portugal
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    I totally agree with the above. Guarin without a doubt is one of our best player. To sit him in favor of Aldo would be ludacris and this coming from someone who thought Aldo performed well against Mexico. Aldo proved to be a good option if Guarin is not fit.
     
  23. minus

    minus Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jul 18, 2004
    Portugal
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    I would much rather play Guarin against Peru in a game that would make more sense to be more offensive minded than against Ecuador due to the high altitude plus I think Guaro will run out gas much faster if he plays against Ecuador.
     
    pibe10 repped this.
  24. delrojosere

    delrojosere Member

    May 5, 2012
    Club:
    America de Cali
    Contra Peru creo que seguramente el alineacion sera asi...

    ---------------Ospina------------
    ---------Yepes--Aquivaldo-------
    Zuniga------Sanchez-----Armero
    ---------------Guarin-------------
    Cuadrado-----Pabon-----James
    ----------------Falcao-----------

    Esto sera un esquema mas offensiva. Mas para ganar. Es basicamente lo que uso contra Mexico, con el reemplazo de Aldo con Guarin, en un posicion un poquito mas adelante de 7 o 8 estilo Ballack.

    Contra Ecuador creo que Pekerman usaria un esquema mas defensivo. Para lo que hemos escuchado del microciclo imagino que podria ser algo asi...

    -----------------Ospina--------------
    Perea--Yepes---Aquivaldo--Armero
    ---------Sanchez--Valencia--------
    ---------------Guarin---------------
    ---------Pabon------James----------
    --------------Falcao-----------------

    Este es un sistema mas cerrado, con los laterales funcionando como Fullbacks envez de Wingbacks y con dos enganches estilo Sanchez. Guarin mantiene su posicion de contra Peru. En total el equipo juega muy ancho para cerrar el campo y abrir el posibilidad de contragolpe.

    Tambien podria armar la linea de engancha con Tres, poniendo Soto en el Centro en lugar de Pabon o James, para jugar con sol un delantero.

    ----Guarin-Sanchez-Valencia---
    ---------------Soto----------------
    --------------James---------------
    --------------Falcao---------------

    Eso seria un sistema aun mas cerrado atras, para asegurar la linea defensivo mas que cualquer otra cosa. Como jugo Colombia siempre cuando contra Brazil.

    Pero toca ver, porque Ecuador en casa es difficil, pero no me soprenderia que se jugara asi. Ademas se podria hacer el cambio despues al fin para marcar gol de ultimo minuto el equipo quedaria algo como.


    -----------------Sanchez-Valencia--------------
    -----------------------Guarin---------------------
    Ibarbo/Cuadrado/Zuniga----------------James
    ------------------Muriel--------Falcao-----------

    o

    ----------------------Sanchez--------------------
    -----------------------Guarin---------------------
    Ibarbo/Cuadrado/Zuniga----------------James
    ----------------Muriel-Falcao-Jackson----------

    O INCLUSO

    -----------------Sanchez-Guarin--------------
    ---------------------------------------------------
    Ibarbo/Cuadrado/Zuniga----------------James
    ------------Muriel----Jackson----Falcao-------
     
  25. elviejomen

    elviejomen Member+

    Aug 3, 2007
    Hasbrouck Heights NJ
    Club:
    Junior Barranquilla
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    El fuerte de Peru es la delantera con un doble 5 firme no solo los contragolpeamos sino les desconectamos a los delanteros (su fuerte) del resto del Grupo, vs Ecuador la pelea se va a librar en el medio campo asi que nuestro mejor volante mixto (Guarin) tiene que estar a 100% alla. Pero ese pensamiento sirve cuando hay un proseso, ahora apenas se esta armando un equipo, Valencia es una incognita con la seleccion, no se sabe si Aldo en su 2nda oportunidad muestre mas, en que nivel llegara Sanchez... En fin hoy por hoy claro que Guarin debe jugar y de titular, pero a futuro (no muy lejano) pueden haber razones tacticas por las cuales puede ser banqueado. Ahora existe otro punto, en Inter creo que Guarin aprendera a marcar mejor
     

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