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Discussion in 'New York Red Bulls' started by SlowFox, Apr 1, 2012.
I know this is a Red Bull forum but I thought a note was warranted.
Quite a shock.
My attitude is you don't need to say anything. I just don't think it's fair to say nasty things when he's not around (at least theoretically) to defend himself.
Actually, I posted merely because he was a notable figure in NY Soccer and because it was completely unexpected (by me at least) being, I believe, he was only 65.
Is it true or is this an April Fool's thing?
Oh, geez, I forgot completely this was April 1st.
All I can tell you is I heard it on Sirius a little while ago. It was part of a newsbreak so I would assume it's accurate.
BTW: If the moderators feel the thread is not appropriate for this forum then I'll understand, just wanted to mention it.
I had just heard it mentioned on XM so it must be true.
I became a soccer fan living in NYC as a kid when the Cosmos were at their peak. I started playing and loving the game because of Chinaglia, Pele, Beckenbauer, Alberto, et al.
He was a controversial and entertaining figure, and a tremendous striker. American and New York soccer owe him a debt of gratitude.
I greatly disagree with this.
Not that I'll lose any sleep over that, but the sport is more popular in this country because he played here. He was a towering figure, on and off the field.
I had to check a few other sites myself. It's true, apparently.
Love him or hate him, you cannot deny the accomplishments. The man averaged a goal per game for 8 years in this country. He was remarkable.
And the Cosmos/Red Bulls fanbase owes him a proper tribute.
I'm thinking that in the 9th minute of the next home game everyone should hold up a piece of paper with the number "9" on it.
As a player sure but as everything else nope. I'll pass on the tribute.
In the 70s when I was a teenager, I went to all the Cosmos games... even the ones at Hofstra, Randalls Island and Yankee Stadium before Chinaglia came. Randy Horton, Siggy Stritzel, Werner Roth and Pele were my heroes. Then came Chinaglia with his scoring prowess. He turned the Cosmos into NASL champions and I was exhilarated. As I became a bit older and smarter in the 80s, I realized Giorgio was a very arrogant and destructive person. I guess it was no accident that he almost single-handedly ruined the Cosmos with his petty grievances and political manipulation (see the movie Once In A Lifetime for more on this). So on the one hand he obviously loved the game and I am sad that he has died. On the other hand his passing has reminded me of the ambiguous type of person he was.
Is this legit or one of those andy Kaufman things??? Giving away my age here but is this real or an April Fools thing?
When I was listening to the RAI (Italian) TV today, I couldn't believe my ears. I had the pleasure of meeting him at Spartan Stadium in San Jose when I was a kid and my uncles would all speak Italian with him. You can say whatever you want about the guy but there was no denying he was truly the best strikers ever to step foot this side of the pond. The NASL possessed the top goal scorers of the modern soccer ear of the 70' & early 80's soccer in Best, Muller, Topmuller, Francis , Cubillas and Pele and a host of others but Giorgio compared to them made goal scoring look simple. I'm more than sure he could have easily played and scored a lot of goals as well in today's MLS without any problems!
RIP & Addio Giorgio!
He was an asshole, but he was also a talented, immense figure in NYC during my childhood.
He was the Cosmos equivalent of Reggie Jackson. When you were a kid (not to mention lack of 24-hr news cycles and sports talk radio), it didn't matter he scored goals by the bucket load and that is why we loved him.
With Chinaglia, it was all about him. Everyone else had to feed him the ball while he just stayed up top. Bogicevic passed up numerous opportunities to shoot to be this guy's servant.
My condolences to his family, but let's be forthcoming. I grew up watching the Cosmos as he was one of the major reasons for the downfall of the team and the subsequent downfall of the league.
I don't believe that. That is a myth. In 1980 the league had 24 team in 1984 when Chinaglia was in Italy, the league dwindled down to 9 teams and in February 1985 when the NASL folded, there were just 7 teams willing to put forth a team. The indoor MISL was taking over and the Cosmos, the Minnesota Strikers , Chicago Sting and the San Diego Sockers were all hot to make the jump to the indoor game. The Cosmos folded after 33 games and Chinaglia tried to run the team and play an exhibition schedule with the Cosmos and other foreign opponents but the league was already dead. Their last game ended in a brawl against Lazio in 1985. You can argue that Warners wanted to outspend everyone else and thus made teams fold but that is besides the point. Half of the new owners who came in were not knowledgeable about soccer and they didn't really even care about the sport and all they were trying to do was make a quick buck and left the game as soon as they got in. They also spent millions on aging stars to try to match the success of the Cosmos, and lost significant amounts of money in doing so and when those stars were either too old or whatever, no one was good enough to take their place. Gulf & Western for examle virtually came in and folded the Washington Diplomats as soon as they bought them. Peter Pocklington did the same thing in Edmonton. I was with the Quakes back then and I saw what was going on. You can say he was a jerk or a stuck up arse this is true but Chinaglia had nothing to do with the demise of the NASL.
Clive Toye hated Chinaglia so I'm sure he would blame him for anything and everything. The Quakes beat the Cosmos in their last NASL game at Giants stadium 1-0 with a goal by Godfrey Ingram in front of only 10,000 fans. A far cry from the 77k + 5/6 years earlier. The Quakes had already decided to drop out of the NASL during the August break when the league went on hiatus because of the 84 LA Olympics and said they would go amateur using only or mostly American born players. Even though the new ASL which Toye discovered had its origins in late 1986 (2 years after the last NASL game was played) when he had initial talks with USSF boss Chuck Blazer on how to launch a new pro league along the eastern seaboard, it didn't start play until the spring of 1988. By May of 1987, five franchises were established, with another five coming on board late in the year. The team names hearkened back to the NASL days, with the Diplomats, Strikers and Rowdies among the teams. His aim was to run a pro league along prudent fiscal lines, that would be focused on American players which was the exact opposite of the NASL ownership group hopes and plans. I still have Paul Gardner's article regarding the crappy play of the first game. I can't find it but it was about the New Jersey Eagles against one of the newly renamed teams either the Ft. Lauderdale Strikers , Washington Diplomats or the Tampa Bay Rowdies. He wrote how utterly disgusted he was by the level of play despite many former NASL players on the pitch. Of course he was used to watching top foreigners in the NASL and at that point, 4 years later all that was left were the few American NASL holdovers like Sonny Askew and GK's Winston DuBose and Arnie Mausser.
I always thought Chinaglia was one of the best forwards I ever saw and this is true even today. Sure he was a terrible president at Lazio but that doesn't mean he single handedly folded the NASL! I mean sure, I do retain Chinaglia is/was a controversial figure possibly on the verge of illegitimate dealings and there is no denial of this but he was not responsible for the demise of the entire NASL. There is no way he could have been as the league was losing teams left and right and I don't know how he or anyone else could have prevented that from happening. He went back to Lazio when the Seattle Sounders folded and the same went for the Tulsa Roughnecks who had just won the league in 1983 and subsequently folded right after , only to be saved for one final year in 1984 and then folded again after the season. The bottom line was indoor soccer was taking over and thats what everyone wanted. This is why Lee Stern and the Chicago Sting bailed for the MISL. The same goes for the Minnesota Strikers and the San Diego Sockers not to mention the Cosmos who also joined the indoor league. By 1985, none of those teams cared to play for the NASL anymore. I know for a fact that the Quakes and Sockers wanted out so who was left? The Chicago Sting, Toronto Blizzard, the Vancouver Whitecaps , the Cosmos and the Tampa Bay Rowdies and you are really believe you were going to have a coast to coast NASL with only 5 teams , 2 in Canada and three American clubs in the east and no other interested expansion ownership groups on board? I mean there is no way it will have worked or happened and I don't believe for one second Chinaglia was the at fault...
1984 Final Standings
Chicago Sting 24 13 11 50 49 120 .541 8,376
Toronto Blizzard 24 14 10 46 33 117 .583 11,452
New York Cosmos 24 13 11 43 42 115 .541 12,817
Tampa Bay Rowdies 24 9 15 43 61 87 .375 10,932
San Diego Sockers 24 14 10 51 42 118 .583 5,702
Vancouver Whitecaps 24 13 11 51 48 117 .541 13,924
Minnesota Strikers 24 14 10 40 44 115 .583 14,263
Tulsa Roughnecks 24 10 14 42 46 98 .416 7,797
Golden Bay Earthquakes 24 8 16 61 62 95 .333 10,676
I commented on the Fanatic site that Henry's goal explosion over the last two games hasn't been seen in these parts since Chinaglia. In a weird way the torch has been passed. Sad, was in the pro Chinaglia camp back in the day, guy scored tons of goals.
let's not forget clint.
anyway. forza giorgio.
on the field he was legendary for us. when i played when i was young, always wanted #9 because of him. i was there when he scored 7 in one game. for me, he is one of the players that will always be associated with #9.
fantastic player, RIP.
Even as a Sting fan, I appreciated what Giorgio brought to the game. He was the best striker in the history of the NASL. Sad day. RIP Giorgio.
Sad day for futbol in the U.S.
Chinaglia was a dynamic figure, particularly in the post-Pele Cosmos teams that I saw in the Swamp back in the day.
He may have been ascerbic (both as a teammate and as an executive for the Champions World Series), but without him, the landscape of American futbol would not have been the same.
He wasn't my favorite Cosmos player, and he obviously had dubious personality traits, but he was a true "Star" of the game and a key reason why the Cosmos won titles and attracted attention. I learned to love soccer watching those Cosmos at Giants Stadium and on Channel 9 out of NYC (on my little black and white TV).
So many fond memories. Giorgio was part of that. I even had a "Giorgio" soccer ball as a kid.
Anyone that blames the folding of NASL on Chinaglia is nuts. This post does a good job of explaining the situation. Also NASL spent so much money on these top stars and they were way ahead of their time in being able to support such a league. Attendance was good at many games, but they expected better success from TV which never materialized and the league folded on itself. The amount of available American players of any quality was minimal and the league tried to foster development by requiring 3 players on the field to be americans where inevitably one would be the goalie (aka Shep Messing), another often a defender (aka Werner Roth), and we also had Ricky Davis who was billed as the American star.
The memories of all this led to the current structure of MLS. The long term success once again will depend on the growth in TV ratings.
Here are all 50 of Chinaglia's goals from 1980. Nothing better than listening to Jim Karvellas shout "... shot and a goal!"
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJvRMAwFs7c&feature=related"]All 50 Giorgio Chinaglia goals to break the record 1980 - YouTube[/ame]
Funny you should say that. I was just thinking of how some aspects of Henry remind me of Chinaglia.
* Aging superstar who's lost a step, but...
* Truly brilliant goal-scorer, and...
* Can still turn games, if not entire seasons, for their "NJ retirement club"
* Huge ego (I'm the most important player on team... give me the ball!)
* Shows frequent frustration in the failings of his teammates
* Far from diplomatic interview style
But in the end Henry is the greater player. I'm speaking as a fan of Arsenal, Cosmos & NYRB.
I truly admired and appreciated the talent and passion that Chinaglia & Henry brought to their clubs. But neither has been my favorite player.