Hoffenheim - retort club, widely hated - no fan base, no support - cant really tell they have a youth set-up but they have the hopp money to buy young talents - finances: they would run double-digit million deficit without Hopp - stadium off the peg(it actually has more seats than the city has inhabitants) Hannover - once the "plain Jane" of Buli and relegation candidate - after Mirko Slomka came, now constantly playing in Europa league - young team with a counterattacking approach - president Kind wanted to overthrow the 50+1 rule(failed) - support is average in buli - youth work not so good - the city Hannover is seen in the rest of Germany as pretty boring and ugly(along with Bielefeld) Frankfurt - traditional buli side with huge fanbase - support is upper middle class(very good away) - but severe hooligan problem - financially always correct, did some low cost 2nd buli player transfer this season - youth work is okay(Jung, Russ etc...) - team: rather young, club is a "Fahrstuhlmannschaft"
1.) I could refer you to the average age of starting lineup chart: http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/1-bundesliga/altersschnitt/wettbewerb_L1.html 2.) Look at the players on the German NT. It could give you an indication which clubs have good academy's. Bayern - 5 - Hummels, Badstuber, Lahm, Muller, Kroos Schalke - 4 - Ozil, Neuer, Howedes, Draxler (the latter two don't play much) Dortmund - 2 - Schmeltzer, Gotze Man U, Borussia Monchengladbach, Hannover, Hertha Berlin, Stuttgart, Bochum, Leverkusen, Koln, 1860 Munich, Rot Weiss Ahlen all have one player each. Considering Howedes and Draxler don't play much, it's really Bayern 5, everyone else 1 or 2. If anything, this just goes to show that all academies in Germany are competitive.
Great work mate...thx... president Kind wanted to overthrow the 50+1 rule(failed) ??? What do u mean by "Fahrstuhlmannschaft"? I was in "Parken" when Hannover was playing FC Copenhagen, think they played pretty well, and true about the counterattacking approach... They had a rather good following... Any chance u can mention some of the prospects from the two clubs? And in your opinion, who of those teams are best prepared for the future?
The 50+1 rule, the rule that prevents EPL club ownership, sheichs or Russian billionaires. A maximum of 49% of a club can be sold. Kind, wanted to put more money into the club but also say were they had to put the money. The problem is due to the rule he never would have had the last say. So all Buli 1st and 2nd buli clubs came together and Hannover was the only one abolishing the rule, think 27 were against. Fahrstuhl-mannschaft = elevator + team. A team that is often going up and down between 1st and 2nd Buli. About the prospects, is hard to say which is better prepared. In general since Schmadtke(sporting director) and Slomka call the shots in Hannover they do really well and their transfers(mostly from the Norwegian league) made them from a relegation candidate losing 7:0 to Bayern to a Europa legua club after the next season. They have their own stadium, no domestic competitor, but there is not so much financial background in Hannover as in Frankfurt. Hannover's youth work is also not as great as other Buli clubs(apart from Mertesacker), maybe because they've been a 2nd buli club for a long time until 2002.It is their second continuous year in Europa league, it'll be interesting if they can do this a third consecutive year. Frankfurt have the much better youth work, supporters. But their big advantage is also a disadvantage in case their team loses or gets relegated - then their fans turn into aggressive assholes. They're doing well right about now. But I think they know they still have to look for fighting relegation. Maybe in two or three years they will play for international business. But all in all you cant compare them. It's a matter of taste.
He was successful actually - the DFL has allowed Kind to take over Hannover, which is all he ever wanted. Are we talking about FSV Frankfurt here? It's not that long ago that EF was in a huge mess financially.
Mainly agree with W/B but I'll try to add some color on those three teams in case it helps. Hoffenheim: - regarded as one of the plastic clubs with Wolfsburg and Leverkusen. Probably the most hated of the three. They are like an EPL sheik/Russian oligarch club. Runs totally counter culture to the German football structure. Less hatred though because at least Dietmar Hopp is a German with a youth connection to the club/area and not some random foreigner. - for all the crap their fans take I think they are pretty good. Consistently sell out their home matches and have decent traveling contingent. They make a fair amount of noise too. - But their stadium has issues. They have been known to play an ear piercing siren noise in the away fans section to try to shut them up. Apparently this was one rogue employee who did this and not a club sanctioned thing so it might have gotten a bad rap. The other issue with the stadium to me is anytime Hoffenheim scores they play this horrible medieval music. I dunno who came up with it but my god is it tacky. - if you are a new fan of the bundesliga then Hoffenheim is a logical club to support since they are the new boys to the top flight and it's unlikely they are headed anywhere downwards because of their financial backing. - No real rivals. They try to act like Stuttgart and to a lesser extent Freiburg are because they are from the same German state but these two sides fans basically ignore Hoffenheim fans as nobodies. - The stadium is in the middle of a bunch of cow pastures and fields. It is located between several more populated areas though of mainly Heidenheim and Mannheim. It attracts fans from all over that area. Despite the seemingly agricultural setting it is a club slightly towards the wealthier football fans. Hannover: - Have been really good lately but this is likely a blip. They have always been relegation scrapers in BL 1 and somewhat of an elevator club in past. If you are liking Hannover mainly because they are successful then I would be careful. Slomka will probably move on to Bayern or a larger club this summer. Him and the sporting director of hannover get along notoriously badly anyways. Hannover could be back to their relegation battling selves as soon as next season - Average fans. Big stadium and they mostly fill 80%+ of it. - Not been to this city so can't comment on it but does not have a great reputation. - If American the Steve Cherundulo connection might be a good one. He's a stand up guy. Getting old though. Might have 1-2 years left in him. - Plenty of good rivals. Biggest with Braunschweig who might get promoted to BL 1 this season. Wolfsburg is another sizable one. To a smaller extent Hamburg and Bremen. Eintracht Frankfurt: - This years surprise package. They basically cherry picked the best BL 2 players and have been playing exciting, vibrant Fussball under Armin Veh. Historically in last 10 years they have been an elevator club or mid table BL 1 side. - Huge stadium and always sell out. Very loud traveling fans. The stadium is extremely old and built in the 1920s. - Also have the worst fans. I'm sure plenty of nice fans but their ultras are violent thugs. They pick fights with opposing fans, storm the field when their team sucks, harass and threaten their own players. They are terrible assholes. - Frankfurt is one of the largest cities. A mega banking hub and airport. All of the bankers breed the mentality of elitist jerks. A very expensive city to live in with a huge gap between the ones with money and those without. - I dunno their big rivals. I guess Mainz.
I just thought about who is the best , and worst supporters in Bundesliga? I have just been to 3 BL stadiums, so i really dont know. But if im looking at TV / fan bases / average attendance, and what people say, i think it's like: Best supporters: Frankfurt, Dortmund, Schalke, Gladbach &Stuttgart Average / over average: Bayern Munchen, Hamburger SV, Nurnberg, Hannover 96, Fortuna Dusseldorf, Mainz 05 & Werder Bremen Poor / under average: Freiburg, Wolfsburg, Leverkusen, Hoffenheim, Augsburg, Greuther Furth. What does people say to that? Is it totally wrong? I would like to hear!
Depends what kind of support you prefer. Highest number of supporters globally I would guess. I know German magazines do a poll about this most years. 1. Bayern 2 Dortmund 3. Schalke 4. Hamburg/Gladbach/Koln 7. Werder? Maybe Stuttgart Most passionate fans. I dunno it is so subjective. The Westphalia clubs are probably tops. They live and breath football. Kind of like the Mid West or North East in USA. There isn't much to do in the area, very industrialized so fans are obsessed with sport. In Munich and Stuttgart you will find more "fair weather" fans kind of like Florida or California. There are other things to do besides just sport there. The lower attendance clubs don't necessarily mean less passionate fans. I think Freiburg fans are great but it's a small, college and tourist town (gorgeous area) so the stadium is not big. My general rule for how great the fans are: How quick are the fans to boo if their team is sucking or not living up to expectation? I'm not sure who has the best fans based on that question but I know of the many clubs who whistle, boo and jeer their players when they stink. Bayern and Stuttgart are very "fair weather" and So are the 3 plastic clubs.
There are probably few places in Germany where there's more stuff to do than in the Ruhr are. And if you include Cologne and Düsseldorf, which are in the same metropolitan area, it isn't even close. One example: the Ruhr area actually has some of Germany's most renowned theatres and opera houses.
Coming from "around that area", I agree fully! The times, when Ruhr Area was only grey industry with nothing else are over. You will have a hard time finding an area in Germany or even worldwide for that matter with more recreational and other activities available. Having that said, I am sure, Borussia Dortmund fits KickersFTW's criteria the most. Attractive style of play, passionate fans who always turn out in numbers, not just recently! The atmosphere in the stadium can is hard to match and winning all the titles in the past few years has annoyed the sh*t out of Bayern's officials and players!
Sorry guys, going out of thread for a minute, but does anybody know when - more or less - the Dec 15 features will be decided? Right now it looks every game is at 15:30 on Dec 15, but it's not a confirmed schedule. So I was wondering if anybody knows how long in advance they'll decide the pre and post games
Two things: Hannover's supporters are there when it matters, ie have had a decent record over hte last few years at home, but realistically the stadium is about 10 000 seats too big (otherwise we'd probably always sell out) and has bad acoustics, which doesn't exactly help. But 15 000 fans in Bochum in 2011 (last game to avoid relegation) or 12 000 fans in Copenhagen last year certainly are not bad. We also had the second highest attendance in last season's Europa League, which certainly is not bad by any means. As for the prospects: Kind is trying for us to become the new Bremen (and willing to provide a solid financial back up for that), and the Schmadtke and Slomka controversy has been overplayed by the media imo. There is no guarantee our succes will continue for even this season, but so far we did not turn into a relegation candidate again like everybody predicted. I would like to add that there has always been some kind of tragic to the club, sometimes slap-stick, sometimes real. Look up Robert Enke for the real stuff (and also how it changed the club when Miller, the 2nd goalie, also had a depression afterwards), or Leon Andreasen (but also keep in midn that Hanover decided to give him another chance with renewing his contract for this season). More slap-sticky is that our one and only season where we played a UEFA competition before 2011 we played the cup winner's cup and were kicked out... by last year's cup winners cup champion and fellow German Team Werder Bremen. So Before 2011 our only two European games have been played against a German team. Also, in 1996, the year of our 100-year anyversary, we were relegated into the 3rd division for the first time in the club's history. Fan friendships and sympathies exist with Hamburg, Odense, Millwall and St Patrick's, our biggest rivals are Braunschweig, after that Bremen, lesser rivalries are with Wolfsburg, Cottbus and Frankfurt.
4-6 weeks before..I guess It'll be announced around the first two week of November after DFB Pokal 2nd round took place and the next round has been drawn. The fixtures always depend on the teams which are still in "the cup"/have international duties.
Millwall?? I would try to keep that a secret. I wouldn't be shocked if Frankfurt and Millwall fans were sympatico since both are thugs, but 96 doesn't seem to have anything in common.
It's not as if Hannover didn't have its fair share of hooligans - these days its a bit more tame than back in the 80s, as wit most clubs in Germany.
It says so on Wikipedia, personally I haven't heard about it anywhere else so it is probably just someone trying to discredit us, should have checked better.
Right. There's been a time when the only remarkable thing about 96 was the serious hooligan problem. There's still some aftermath today. Even many younger Hannover fans won't recognize or even know about them, but the old boys are still there for special games like the EL games. Liege and Bruges didn't allow any free movement of Hannover fans before and after the EL games, most younger 96 fans didn't even understand why before; it was a nice occasion for some of the old hooligans to finally "proof their strength" at the European stage. Hannover was a boring, mediocre, surplus club with a serious hooligan problem before they got relegated, and didn't appear again for many years. They lost a generation of fans, but also the connection to the earlier dubious fan culture.
Bump lol. I did go with Dortmund. I been very happy with the choice. Already have some scarves and such(as well as watching the games on PS3 stream or laptop). Sadly my favorite scarf(and first one) I kept in my car(around my chair) was destroyed when someone plowed into me at 80 and obliterated my car a few weeks ago. I'm very thankful my friend and I got out as good as we did considering the car was completely crushed(ford mustang) I did find a nice G35 to replace the car but the scarf was lost in the crash.
firstrowsports on internet browser. That's how I watch a bunch of games from MLS, Bund, and some Premier league.
Being from America, especially fron rural West Virginia, my options have been limited in regards to following soccer. Heck, even our home-state team (West Virginia Chaos, not a college sport follower) get virtually ignored. For a long time I did follow the EPL and still do to an extent, but at the same time part of it gets frustrating. Not necessarily because I followed Arsenal (still love them), but because the league just seems too big for my tastes anymore. For the past couple of seasons I've found a new home in the Bundesliga for a variety of reasons, and the club I've been following has been (and still is) Bayern Munich. That is because I got to watch the USL final between Inter & Bayern live and even though they lost; their playing style really attracted me. The club really grabbed me as a follower. I'll admit that sometimes a voice pops inside of me wondering whether I should be following a team other than Bayern; considering that most fans from areas outside of Germany and Europe would naturally (with exceptions) notice Bayern first over the others. I'll admit I like plenty of other teams in the Bundesliga, but I also like Bayern still. I don't know; I guess I notice the stigma some people have with overseas fans typically cheering for the big club in the league, and I can understand that concern. Other legitimate clubs like Schalke, Dortmund, & Leverkusen and others like Stuttgart, Hannover, and Fortuna Dusseldorf get pushed aside; and that's unfair as these are good clubs for a variety of reasons. Not Bayern-level, but they shouldn't have to be. I'll admit I still do love Bayern, but that voice inside of me still persists.
The area around Kaiserslautern is the West Virginia of Germany. They are big rivals with Bayern though.