Phoenix FC stadium thread

Discussion in 'Phoenix FC' started by Orlando Rays, Aug 7, 2012.

  1. Orlando Rays

    Orlando Rays This is your world.

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    This is a burning question. Pun intended.

    Since one of my biggest interests here at BS is stadia, I'll kick this off with some of the potential places Phoenix City could play.

    Obviously the ideal is University of Phoenix Stadium, since, well, it's got the roof. But that would be a huge investment, even bigger than the Citrus Bowl for Orlando (minus incentives). It would take big money and huge balls to even think of it.

    So, where else can they die of heatstroke en masse play?

    Excluding high school stadia, there is Sun Devil Stadium in Tempe. It can host a 67-yard-wide field.

    There's Reach 11 Sports Complex to the NE. It has practice fields and a main stadium, though it doesn't have much seating yet.

    You could also use any of the spring training baseball stadia in the area. I seriously doubt they're all being used during the summer. The one in Glendale can pull off 110x70, and I saw at least one other that could do similar.

    Any other ideas?


  2. Killersheep

    Killersheep Member

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    You're thinking WAY too big. The most likely scenario would be a converted baseball stadium like they did in Tucson. Likely candidates for that would be

    Peoria Sports Complex - this has been rumored to be the spot. Obvious problem is that it is way out on the Northwest edge of town.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&...FlshUNHjFef62gWatYCgCA&sqi=2&ved=0CMABEPwSMAA

    Phoenix Muni Stadium - nice central location, problem is there are no amenities anywhere near it.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&...&ei=XlwhUOatDcXL2QXREw&sqi=2&ved=0CKMBEPwSMAA

    Hohokam Stadium (Mesa) - a little east, the light rail will end a few miles from it in a few years. A few bars are in very close proximity.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&...GVwhUPaWDuXY2AW08oCoAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CMUBEPwSMAA

    Outside of baseball reworks

    Phoenix Greyhound Park - Great location, right off the lightrail. This was the spot that Starky wanted for the Monsoon. Unfortunately it is marked for airport expansion.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&...j1whUPyDDuSY2wWe3ICoBw&sqi=2&ved=0CLoBEPwSMAA
  3. redfury1881

    redfury1881 Member

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    Yep, no way UoP and Sun Devil are even in the conversation. And high school stadiums are a no-go. Can't sell alcohol there.
    Muni would be nice, central location and can get there by light rail but not much going on around there.
    Still backing on Peoria being the stadium. The owners like the surrounding area. Very busy. A lot of restaurants and bars around it. They hope to get a good walk-up, walk-around crowd. "What? A concert and a game for $10-$20? Sure. Why not."
  4. Orlando Rays

    Orlando Rays This is your world.

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    The beer thing is why I immediately set aside the high school stadia.

    Taking my own look, Phoenix Muni looks like a great place. On the bright side, you could always build amenities. The location is on the opposite side of Sky Harbor from Downtown, so teams could stay around Sky Harbor and be equidistant from both. (Also, in a situation where FC Tucson also got a USL Pro team--which I suspect may happen if they want to plump up a Western Division--teams could stay in Phoenix and bus from there to Tucson.)

    Peoria Sports Complex: You could convince Peoria to convert one of their multitude practice fields into a small soccer stadium, like what they appear to be doing in Tucson. And it's not like it's in the extreme NW. There is Sun City West, El Mirage and Surprise further out from it.

    HoHoKam has a great shape for a soccer field down the first base line. And if they can tap the fans who come out for Cubs spring training...


  5. Killersheep

    Killersheep Member

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    The owners group has mentioned that the USL would work with the schedule having most of the home games early in the season and later at night (7:00 PM) to reduce the heat issue. It is going to be an issue regardless, but the are at least trying to address it.
  6. Orlando Rays

    Orlando Rays This is your world.

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    I would think 8pm would be desirable. And most matches are around 7pm anyway. Not scheduling at 7pm is the exception.
  7. redfury1881

    redfury1881 Member

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    Can't really build around Muni. There are already set businesses there. And the empty lot you may see is actually a city park, the zoo is also there.
    In regards to Peoria, for Valley residents Peoria is still considered pretty far NW. There are certainly challenges to whatever they choose.
    Tempe Diablo Stadium is also a good, central-like location. Though it runs into the same problem as Muni.
  8. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

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    Gotta love someone in Florida telling us what our best options are for a stadium. :)

    U of P and Sun Devil are non-starters. You know nothing about Reach 11, which can seat about 150 people now and which, while selfishly a great site for me, is unlikely to be used as the starting point for building something. Greyhound Park would be a great site, but the airport issues make it unrealistic for a third division team.

    Phoenix Muni is in a good location and has actually been bandied about in the past, but here's the thing: the relationship between ASU and the Cubs got frosty not long ago, and whether it's posturing or not, it's possible that the shared new complex just over the city line in Mesa might not be shared after all.

    When the Cubs vacate HoHoKam in 2014, there's talk Mesa may try to lure the A's from Muni, which would either result in Muni being vacated or Phoenix - which has only one other spring training site in its city limits - paying to make renovations to upgrade it. If Muni is vacated (or even if it's not), ASU may follow U of A's lead and move into Muni - either as a shared situation with the A's or just making it into ASU's baseball facility. It's easy accessible from campus on light rail and is only 2.2 miles from the main drag in Tempe anyway. ASU baseball plays through May and often deeper (when they're eligible for postseason play, as they will be in 2013), so sharing it with a soccer team may not be the best situation for either side. If there weren't baseball options for Muni, I agree, good location, well-known, lots of parking, access from campus and downtown via light rail, east side of the Valley, all good things.

    Peoria - which I've heard, too, is the likely choice - is another selfishly good option for me, but baseball stadiums are problematic for soccer. There is Rookie League baseball going on there in June, July and August (I have no idea if they use the main stadium or not). As for the idea that "you could convince Peoria to convert one of their multitude practice fields into a small soccer stadium, like what they appear to be doing in Tucson," yeah, right. As if the Padres and Mariners would have nothing to say about that at all. Tucson's doing it because they lost baseball. The Padres and M's just re-upped with Peoria through 2034, and the deal requires Peoria to spend $48 million for upgrades over the next 22 years. They ain't convertin' nothing to soccer there full-time. That's not happening. Plus, as mentioned, Peoria's considered way out there for a lot of folks, even if people in Florida consider it to be right next door given Sun City and Surprise are farther away.

    And do you know who "the fans who come out for Cubs spring training" are that you think you can tap? Well, a lot of them come here from Chicago during the winter, first off, and a lot of the rest go because - newsflash - they like baseball. Has zippo to do with soccer. If you're going after baseball fans, I'm sorry, you've already lost the plot.

    As for other spring training facilities, Salt River Fields would be tremendous (for a baseball stadium). Right off the interstate, on the right side for a lot of the soccer folks and money folks in Scottsdale and Paradise Valley and easy to get to for most people east of 51 and south of the 10, even. Tempe Diablo's farther south, though also right off the interstate, but you'd probably put a psychological barrier there for anyone living north of Indian School Road (the same way people south of there probably would find reasons not to go to Peoria).

    And, remember, we're not talking about a team in a league that's a certain draw. It's not a given this will be a compelling product that people have to go see. This is a market that has proven it will turn out for the US and Mexican Nats and the Reto del Sol has done pretty well the last two years. But whether it will be a naturally fertile market for a third-division, likely under-financed team in a baseball stadium remains to be seen.

    And I haven't even brought up the weather yet. And the difference between kicking at 7pm and kicking at 8pm isn't that great here, usually. Play at 6 am, I'm totally there. I'm up at that hour anyway and it's much cooler.
    brandonesque repped this.
  9. AOPHX

    AOPHX New Member

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    Here's hoping the owners know what they're getting into, which doesn't really seem to be the case. Wherever the stadium is, we've heard they're hoping for attendance upwards of 6,000(!). For a third-division soccer team in this crazy, confusing market, don't think so. And their minimum hope is 3,000, which is also high.
    If they want that many, they NEED TO START PUBLICIZING THE TEAM NOW. Why has it taken so long to do anything? No social media, no new news. It's been quiet out here.
    Sorry for the gloom and somewhat doom, but it is pretty frustrating. Here's hoping once they do get the ball rolling again (finally) that it rolls all the way to the somewhat relative promise land.
  10. Killersheep

    Killersheep Member

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    All I can say about the wait, is IF they come out with something this month that is mind blowing by social media standards (meaning get's a lot of active users in a super short period of time) it's okay and it just means they were making sure they were getting it right. If we get some canned wordpress template with little actual outreach, I think we may have some serious problems. I have been mentioning to everyone at every bar I go to that we are getting a pro team next year, and in all of that I have yet to run into anyone that's heard anything about it.

    So hopefully they are just making sure they have the epic-ness in store for the end of the month.

    To get back to Reach 11, not only do they have a few concrete slabs for seats, but also they can't serve alcohol, nor can they charge for tickets. Maybe okay for scrimmage games and open practices, but that's about it.
  11. Orlando Rays

    Orlando Rays This is your world.

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    They're probably going off the attendance for the preseason MLS activity this year. Of course, that was in February/March, AND was in UoP.

    Also, remember, Orlando didn't really ramp up their publicity until November the year before they opened. We didn't even know officially we were playing at the Citrus Bowl until a week before the season opener. (Lease squabbling having to do with Florida Citrus Sports' reserved boxes.) And I think they did okay. :whistling:

    Be patient. It's alright to have faith for a little while.
  12. Killersheep

    Killersheep Member

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    To my recollection there was only one MLS game at U of P that was the Red Bulls against PUMAs (15K attendance). There was the Desert Diamond Cup in Tucson 8 games (5.5K - 8.5K attendance), Grande Sports World (Casa Grande) 4 games (50-100 attendance), Reach 11 (Phoenix) 3 games (100-200 attendance)
  13. Orlando Rays

    Orlando Rays This is your world.

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    The MLS match is what I'm referring to, and really the only reason I can come up with for such an ambitious number. Hopefully they're cooking up some top-notch marketing.
  14. redfury1881

    redfury1881 Member

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    The owners seem like good guys and good people. But highly doubt they'll have top-notch marketing and potential for epic-ness. It is hard to wait for November. But we'll do and we are doing our part.
  15. WIZinPHX89

    WIZinPHX89 New Member

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    I'm a Sporting KC fan from KS that has moved to PHX and am pumped about PCFC.

    The minor league baseball stadium can work as I've seen with SKC while they were finishing their new stadium...and it was during that time that SKC built up their core group of supporters as opposed to when they played in cavernous Arrowhead Stadium. And I think that environment is a better fit for the league PCFC are in.

    My vote is for Peoria (mostly for selfish reasons...close proximity), but also because of the surrounding Arrowhead area that would offer a better overall experience than PHX Muni or Mesa. The ownership group should take a long look at the process of how SKC rebranded and built up the name in the community and how the success on the field followed.
  16. Roosevelt1911

    Roosevelt1911 Member

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    The news has brought me out of self imposed exile on these boards. This is the biggest bite at the apple since probably the Condors and Sandsharks/Thunder...

    I too think that it would be a mistake to play in the West Valley as the Coyotes can attest, unless it is strictly on a temporary basis (1 season, maybe two) until a more permanent site can be retained. The Peoria Sports Complex is a haul for me and I live in the Downtown area.

    I have always thought the Phoenix Muni site would be ideal, seeing what has happened with FC Dallas in Frisco and Colorado in Commerce, stadiums are better off closer to the denser populations, and nearer amenities such as public transit and bars/restaurants. Phx Muni is a short walk from a lightrail station which has several restaurants...and I'm sure that there would be plenty of room for tailgaters.(...There is also a strip club about a mile away where you can meet the referees after the game...seriously.) It has multiple points of egress to freeways heading to all points Valley of the Sun.
  17. Roosevelt1911

    Roosevelt1911 Member

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    What about using the ASU soccer stadium? At least in the short term...
  18. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

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    Because it seats maybe 1,050 people, has almost no parking and is on a college campus.
  19. Killersheep

    Killersheep Member

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    And from what I hear it's quite expensive. Although it would be a good place for the Monsoon to play next season. Parking isn't a problem with their attendance.
  20. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

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    They're never going to be able to be viable if they don't enhance the fan experience (the Monsoon, that is). Just putting themselves in a small box and saying "that'll be big enough for the crowds we get" isn't going to help. The Monsoon's biggest problem is they have no money. At all. And no vision. Hell, Reach 11 is adequate for their crowds.
  21. Roosevelt1911

    Roosevelt1911 Member

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    Wolves could add temporary seating and parking could be worked out. Packard Stadium is right across the street so there is parking within walking distance and a light rail station not too far away either...San Jose plays at a much smaller campus, as does LA, and the new New York Cosmos will also be playing at a college stadium...
  22. Roosevelt1911

    Roosevelt1911 Member

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    Lets not have visions of grandeur...3,000 would be good crowd at a match in Phoenix.
  23. brentgoulet

    brentgoulet Member

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    you make them look like a FC New York replica ;)
  24. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

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    POOF! Just like that.

    Have you priced temporary seating? Have you tried to negotiate with a major university to do that? And parking could be just "worked out?" Do you know that when you add more capacity, there are laws (that aren't optional) about ADA compliance and restroom facilities and such?

    And you think that the organization that launched without a website or social media presence, that went back - twice - on a name the team contest promise and which doesn't appear to have experience doing this or a ton of money, would be able to pull all this off in six months? You'll be lucky to have scarves in six months.

    It's not the size of the campus. Buck Shaw Stadium and Hofstra Stadium are, infrastructurally ( a ) much, much larger than ASU Soccer Stadium, which means ( b ) those things are already taken care of. You can actually park at Santa Clara. You can actually park at Hofstra.

    And if you think that because Cal State Dominguez Hills is a smaller university than ASU, that it won't be a problem, you've obviously never been to or seen the HDC and what type of access and infrastructure there is there.

    Light rail, great. If you live in Mesa, fabulous. If you live somewhere along the light rail, fabulous. If you feel like taking the light rail to ASU's campus, walking across Rural and then baking in the summer to watch DIII soccer on a college campus where you can't sell beer? Sounds like a fabulous recipe.

    (Not to mention that Packard Stadium is kind of in use in April and May - and often into June when the Sun Devils are NCAA-eligible, as they will be now - otherwise known as "the part of the USL Pro season where you'd put most of your home games.)

    And, again, saying "This is all the crowd you'll draw, you don't need anything bigger" completely dooms the franchise before it even starts.

    ASU's soccer stadium is a non-starter.
  25. Roosevelt1911

    Roosevelt1911 Member

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    Chill out Kenn...not worthy of a rant...I threw ASU out there to start a discussion...not to get bitch slapped. Reading your past posts on this thread you have either denigrated any proposed site or simply established it as a "non-starter".
    Except for Peoria Sports Complex because your being "selfish".

    You don't like the prospects of soccer in Phoenix, I get it. It's a tough sell. The owners suck, the Monsoon suck, the parking sucks, the weather sucks, everything about it sucks, sucks, sucks...

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