This winter there was "The Brazilian," our equivalent of the Man With No Name from the trilogy of Sergio Leone. Now there is similarly enigmatic news that there "could be some clarity regarding a player the team has been monitoring closely as a potential trade bait." http://blogs.chron.com/soccer/archi...ed: houstonchronicle/soccer (Soccer y Futbol) A player we've been monitoring where? Their bait, our bait? Potential trade bait? What does that even mean? You're either bait or not bait, right? You start trying to parse that sentence and your brain hurts. And is this even the same person as the mysterious "star who is known to talent evaluators in Europe and Latin America." Another fun one. It almost makes the ambiguity of "could be some progress with attacking midfielder JeVaughn Watson" sound definite by comparison.
I saw this today and was left scratching my head. But this quote is from Ortiz, not the FO. Not sure you can slam them for it.
He is being selective with language on purpose because things are happening behind the scenes that he obviously knows about, but his sources likely don't want out there publicly. The best transfers in the world are ones that no one sees coming. Take the Chicharito acquisition. No one knew ManU were interested until the deal was done at a good price for them. It's better that way for the acquiring club so that two things don't happen: 1) A bidding war with other teams 2) The club/the league isn't used as a pawn to negotiate a better deal with their original club or other suitors. With Watson, I think it's pretty obvious what he was saying: 1. Watson's people started with stoopid $$ demands when the team started negotiations. 2. Houston said not interested at their price. 3. Watson's reps have now come back to try to reopen the negotiations and both sides are currently talking. Ultimately, there will either be a deal with Watson or both sides will get to an impasse regarding price. Maybe that happens this week, maybe next week...he doesn't know. I know these things don't mesh with your preferred attack on the GM (everything he does is wrong/horrible) and ultimately deals may fall through for various reasons, but I will definitely say that I am happy to read that the GM is not content with how things are currently.
Why do you feel that you need to be made aware of every move the Dynamo are considering? Do you think you should have the final say in the decision? I realize these days on BS I'm coming off as a grouchy old man, but seriously this kind of stuff really pisses me off. Let them make their deals. That's their job. It's not a government, they don't have to be transparent. Dam this used to be my favorite website....
Heh, I feel that way often. This was my favorite website to visit from 99 until and through the 2002 world cup and I feel like it has become less and less interesting ever since. I use it more now just to keep track of yanks abroad and for the collections of news articles than as a place to discuss much. It definitely got silly to me when we got a Houston team forum (because of much of the discussion there) and the moderation has become way too nazi at times as well. Still a valuable resource, but you constantly get stupid threads like this. Now if this had been titled "Nostradamus is our Beat Writer" then I'd just smirk, likely check why, shrug, and move on...
The trade bait is the new news. To me it sounds like three things are keeping them busy: -Negotiations with Watson. -Due diligence on DP level player. -Someone in orange is on the trading block and the Dynamo are entertaining offers.
I can't help but feel that Ortiz just horribly misused the term "trade bait". I think he's trying to say the player is a target of ours. In the article where the renegotiation with Watson was first mentioned it said that Watson had new representation, I guess Watson didn't like the way his guys handled things the first go round. Hopefully his demands are more realistic this time.
It's not meant as a slam, it's really just giggle inducing at a certain point. Meant more as a joke, but I fear my POV has been made so clear that people just read it into anything I post. Kind of like a few months back I asked if anyone had seen the trialists in person and what they thought and I nearly drew back a nub that time too. It's a fair point that Ortiz is the writer but I'd still suggest it reflects a certain amount of mystery, secrecy, and even ambiguity emanating from the team such that our targets are spoken about in a sort of code. The Brazilian. The Star Who Is Known. Trade Bait. To me it is funny when one hand, other hand talk about Watson feels more definite. [As far as what is "stupid," when there is half a debate started about the nature and value of the approach, it's worth something.]
Dude, juve, weren't you quitting BigSoccer?? Mkay... Agree with brahma on this one. It's modus operandi for sports clubs to not give TMI away. Heck, they were silent about that Camargo kid in Brazil and still there were other teams finding out and bidding on him.
My guess is that even if Ortiz knows or was tipped off "off the record", if he prints something and screws up the deal he'll be cut off for good by Dom and FO. If it's not independently verifiable, he shouldn't go with it.
I don't understand the whole "keep it a secret" thing. The team holding the transfer rights to a player that a suitor is pursuing will make sure the whole world knows that the player is in the shop window. It is in their interest to do so.
Does it not mention in the article that the player will remain vague because of interest in him from other, european teams. and that putting his name out there might potentially cause a bidding war and drive up the price? seems to me you are desperately trying to find something wrong with our FO. again. for the bazzillionth time.
While the team holding his rights may certainly make it public; it is still not in the purchasing teams interest to do so (until it leaks) and even if the player is "on the block" you still don't want other teams to know you are the one bidding because it gives them insight into how much they need to bid. This is especially true for MLS teams because we work with a cap. Hypothetically example: other teams need only back into our available cap room to see how much we can offer a non DP. Even for DPs they can look at other DPs in the league for an estimate of how much an MLS team can/will offer. Makes it easier to bid against us. So you are right, if the players name becomes public it will be from the selling team - but why would MLS every want that to be public? People talk about rumors of other players and DPs that have come into the league - how many of them were announced by the league and team prior to reaching an agreement? No, their names eventually leaked and teams had to comment. This is par for the course.
MLSNHTOWN, repped To look at it another way, if you find a great deal on a house what do you do: a) quietly negotiate with the seller, get a good price, complete the transaction, then tell your friends how you got a steal on this great house. b) tell everyone you know about how you might be able to get this really good house at a cheap price, then go negotiate.
The snags I see in some of y'all's theories: Discovery claims for foreign players; Allocation rank for US players; Salary cap that limits what we can spend; Us running off so many of the trialists and targets before they can sign a contract; Limits of MLS publicity/fan power....the fans didn't talk anyone into signing Oduro, nor do they usually impact holdouts or foreign signings (you either ask a reasonable price or not); Taylor and Palmer, our two big splashes of late, being openly-known trialists (Hainault was also trialed); Landin and Akinbiyi.
Maybe part of the reason for the confusing verbage is that English appears to be a second language for Ortiz. Maybe I am wrong but that's the impression I get. In my opinion, his writing style isn't very professional or talented. I can't tell what has influenced his writing style because I haven't seen much like it anywhere else. Having said that, I am still grateful that at least someone is providing Dynamo coverage in the Chronicle. I have to give Ortiz some credit though, as his effort has improved over last year.
I agree with you TXSN. Ortiz' article confirmed my suspicion last week that a trade is in the works with someone already in orange. Maybe all of the "i's" aren't dotted and the "t's" crossed in the deal yet. It will be interesting to see if it is complete by week's end.
Or that he, like many reporters, have to gather all info, prepare articles, transcribe quotes, and write everything in very little time coz the boss wants it now, could be, don't you think? Have you tried it? They do not have all the time in the world to write literary masterpieces, dude.
My brother was a newspaper reporter. I am familiar with the business. I guess we just have differing opinions of Ortiz's work.
I feel like, as a kid, juevechelsea never got that trip to disney world he was promised. now, he twists everything into a negative to avoid being hurt by anyone but himself. rep to brahma. i thought he was gone.
What I'd say is that writing skills and reporting skills can be two different skills sets, but also can overlap. If you have uncovered facts but fail to communicate them clearly, you're messing up part of being a reporter. I don't think anyone of us could definitely say from his piece whether "potential trade bait" involves someone in or out of orange, even if he meant to communicate it. That being said, if he was being handed actual names it'd be a bit different. Lot of people coming down on Ortiz, with some due, but on my end it looks like he's either given the goods off-record or provided similar code, so it's basically him trying to communicate code. In which case the Dynamo bear some responsibility for coyness even if he doesn't communicate the code clearly. If all they tell you is "The Brazilian" it's going to be "The Brazilian" when you pass it on to the reader also, unless you discover the identity through legwork. I will say that from a fan's perspective, I have trouble buying into it all until they give me a name. If, accepting the party line, it's so delicate a matter that we can't even discuss it without risking the whole shebang, that doesn't feel real reliable. Plus, if there are no names or amounts it's hard to hold people accountable, at minimum it's kind of a black box. Oduro was too expensive -- I recall some posters on here suggesting the numbers were eyepopping -- and then he was duly signed and on the roster for a couple weeks, which to me suggests they couldn't have been that far apart.
All due respect but when they imply they're onto something they can't tell you about, and then next thing you know it's Luiz Camargo from parana of the Brazilian second division, that's not quite as advertised. That sort of bait and switch is what you can get when no one on the fan end knows the target. Let's be real. And, again, the thread started out jokingly and has wandered serious, so the Disney World bit is unnecessary. I will go ahead and make the pointed comment that when I did the "naive optimist" thing and bought tickets to the first game full of hope, we got our head handed to us just like rational me had said all winter, regarding some of the problems I'd pointed out. So maybe rational me is the sharp one who watches his wallet and the optimist many of y'all want me to be would be stuck with a subprime mortgage and Enron stock (and 1 point from 2 games, lest we forget the hard facts....since no one's probably checking standings yet, I'll clue you in that we're tied for last in conference with C-bus).
1. Carmango was just an acquisition. Not a DP acquisition. The only person that is a bait and switch to is you. 2. If you thought we had our head handed to us in the first game, I disagree with your assesment of the game. 3. We still have problems. I don't know why you expect the club to be able to erase all problems the team had or may have had in one single offseason. As you say, the roster was filled with talent that wasn't worth it. The major problem you had with the team last year --- team speed in defense has been addressed heavily (Taylor, Sarkodie, and Freeman). Does it remedy all of our defense problems? No. Does it fix our midfield or forward problems? No. They are trying to make progress on some of the other fronts, but they have had issues (agents wanting too much money, bigger/richer clubs making moves for players). 4. They are still working. The club has a potential DP type target and are continuing discussions with Watson's people. Watson will help with MF if they sign him and who knows who the other target is whether it be F or MF. Shame on the front office for not dumping the entire roster and signing a plethora of young, fast, incredibly talented players all interested in playing in MLS. LOL. I have to say, I didn't miss arguing with all of your straw men.
