The tie-breaker is easy. John O'Brien only played 32 games for the USMNT. John may have been better "at his peak," but that basically lasted from 2001 to 2002. High impact for most of those 32 games, though. As a point of reference, Ricardo Clark is at 34 caps and Kyle Beckerman is at 33. Due to injury, the lack of games he actually played for the USMNT makes him hard to include on a Best XI. John also played less than 100 games in his career in club football. When people talk about the greatness of John O'Brien (and I'm not going to argue that point), they're basically remembering a few games played at a highly in a short window. Bradley is gonna blow the guy off the field in terms of contribution to the USMNT, if he hasn't done so already. Bradley will get to 100 caps for the USMNT at about 27 years old.
Not disagreeing with any of that. But (for me) it wasn't between JOB and Bradley -- it was between either of those two and Ramos/Reyna. Of course the impact / contribution argument is obliterated by my Llamosa pick -- who had criminally few caps, even though I realize he was only eligible late in his career. The fact is I just thought he was light years better than any of the other options. I love Balboa and Dooley and Lalas, but I think the gap in sheer quality is so severe that Llamosa gets the nod. This also leads to my quiet head shaking at ballots including Burns or Agoos or Caligiuri. Great troopers one and all, but there has to be some sort of technical baseline.
Lalas FTW I am collecting my thoughts regarding my omission on the #USMNT All-Time Best XI and I shall address this travesty on @ESPNFC today.— Alexi Lalas (@AlexiLalas) December 20, 2013
It's hard to imagine, but John O'Brien is only 36 years old right now. He's been off the stage for so long that people probably assume he's in his 40's. The guy is a year younger than Pablo Mastroeni, who only just retired. He's 6 years younger than Brad Friedel................. As far as a healthy JOB in 2006, it was impossible. The guy played only 12 league games in the club season after the 02 World Cup, and then his career was essentially over. We didn't know it at the time, but it was. After 2003, he never played more than 4 games a year. It was over.
Things that surprised me from the vote tallies. http://www.ussoccer.com/news/articles/2013/12/131220-mnt-best-xi.aspx Who were the 4 people who voted for Tony Meola. I am surprised Ramos and Reyna got 42 and 45 votes considering they are not hands down the best to ever play at the CM position for the USMNT. Hugo Perez only got 3 votes. I thought he was the best player of his era and he only got 3 votes. I am a big JOB fan, but the fact that he got 2 votes and Beasley only got 1 surprises me because Beasley has played over a long period of time. JOB was brief and really only a 1 WC player. The 1950 team members either got a pity vote or were not even considered. On principle, you shouldn't have former players voting on this.
In Sorber's case, it was almost certainly Bora Milutinovic. He named Sorber as his '94 MVP when he was still our manager.
I'm surprised Jamie Trecker made it onto the voting panel considering how much the USSF (not to mention Big Soccer) hates him.
I have no problem with the "official" US Soccer selection. Those 11 players are all quality and all have a legitimate case. I am surprised that Friedel beat Keller 25 votes to 14. I expected that vote to be almost a toss-up. I'm slightly surprized Agoos beat Lalas by 2 votes for 7th defender. Why is Mastro listed as a defender? For the US he was a midfielder for 2 Cups! Brian Quinn gets 1 vote but Eddie Lewis none? Lassiter gets 1 vote, the same as Bruce Murry? And Josh Wolff gets none? Onyeywu got 0 votes??? Zero? And if Harkes had kept his jeans zipped, he would have finished 6th midfielder. Complete Voting Results for All-Time Men’s National Team Best XI: Goalkeepers: Brad Friedel 25, Kasey Keller 14, Tim Howard 13, Tony Meola 4, Arnold Mausser 1, Frank Borghi 0, David Vanole 0 Defenders: Marcelo Balboa 35, Eddie Pope 33, Carlos Bocanegra 25, Steve Cherundolo 25, Thomas Dooley 20, Paul Caligiuri 18, Jeff Agoos 16, Alexi Lalas 14, Frankie Hejduk 9, Harry Keough 6, Pablo Mastroeni 3, Fernando Clavijo 2, Tony Sanneh 2, Mike Windischmann 2, Gregg Berhalter 2, Desmond Armstrong 0, Jimmy Banks, Brian Bliss 0, Mike Burns 0, John Doyle 0, Mike Lapper 0, Oguchi Onyewu 0, Werner Roth 0 Midfielders: Landon Donovan 52, Claudio Reyna 45, Tab Ramos 42, Clint Dempsey 25, Michael Bradley 20, Cobi Jones 12, Walter Bahr 6, John Harkes 6, Hugo Perez 3, Adolf Bachmeier 2, Rick Davis 2, John O’Brien 2, Al Trost 2, DaMarcus Beasley 1, Ed McIlvenny 1*, Joe-Max Moore 1, Brian Quinn 1, Mike Sorber 1, Chris Armas 0, Chris Henderson 0, Eddie Lewis 0, Preki 0, Ed Souza 0, John Souza 0 Forwards: Brian McBride 45, Eric Wynalda 43, Earnie Stewart 16, Billy Gonsalves 7, Jozy Altidore 6, Peter Vermes 3, Joe Gaetjens 2, Archie Stark 2, Roy Wegerle 2, Roy Lassiter 1, Clint Mathis 1, Benny McLaughlin 1*, Ed Murphy 1*, Bruce Murray 1, Kyle Rote Jr. 1, Willy Roy 1, David Brown 0, Brian Ching 0, Aldo “Buff”Donelli 0, Frank Klopas 0, Bill Looby 0, Bert Patenaude 0, Josh Wolff 0 - See more at: http://www.ussoccer.com/news/articles/2013/12/131220-mnt-best-xi.aspx#sthash.ptW46ggM.dpuf
The other guy with a great shot from our current team, but just hasn't played enough yet, is Fabian Johnson. (Though that might speak to the dearth of LBs. The next good LB we develop who brings both good offense and defense will be the first.)
So a few thoughts: --Were the voters required to stick with a single formation? Or at least to use a workable formation? Because then it makes a difference where some of these guys (like Dooley, Mastroeni, Donovan, and Dempsey) were listed. --Michael Bradley is the only omission that really surprises me. I mean last year, a comparable panel of experts/journalists voted him the current best US player. If you're using a 4-4-2 however, it might be hard to fit him in there. --Friedel beating Keller by that much is another surprise. I'd probably give the nod to Friedel as well, but those two battled neck and neck for that #1 spot for two full cycles, and Keller had the edge there for a good chunk of that. I realize that ultimately Friedel had the superior World Cup (and then the superior club record), but I also expected it to be closer. --It's kind of odd seeing our "Captain for Life" managing a measly six votes. I almost wonder how much Wynalda's revelations from a few years back have to do with that. I wouldn't have Harkes near our first XI either, but I remember the status he used to have in the US soccer community and just based on that I would have expected him to do better. --Three votes between Beasley and O'Brien is kind of shocking. The only two players on that entire list who have made deep Champions League runs. And both guys who I believe at one point or another Bruce Arena labeled "our most important player." (Also, I just hit ctr-F and "O'Brien's" name appears 15 times on the first page of this thread alone.) --Onyewu's legacy has really taken a hit in the past 4 years. If you had done this poll around the end of 2009 I can guarantee you that he would have had a lot more than zero votes, even though nothing around him has changed since then (e.g. there was no more recent defender on that list). --I just noticed that Arena coached all eleven of the players chosen. I guess not surprising given that he's the one person that connects the two eras represented on that list.
Only two differences from my choices: Bocanegra over Caligiuri, and Ramos over Jones. Bocanegra is certainly deserving, I just think that given that the majority of his caps were in central defense, that Caligiuri was the all-time best primary left back, not that that was necessarily a consideration in the voting. In the early 90's Caligiuri was earning regular appearances in the 2nd Bundesliga which, particularly in that era, couldn't have happened if he were as "technically limited" as one poster claimed. By the same token, some may have preferred two outside mids, Donovan and Dempsey, and two central mids, Reyna and Ramos. I put Dempsey as a central attacking mid and chose Jones on the wing, mostly for his sustained contributions over time: 15 G and 22 A in 164 caps vs. Ramos's 8G and 14 A in 81 caps. Ramos was silky smooth, and Jones anything but, but when they were on the field together, it just seemed to me that Jones was the more likely to make something positive happen for the USA.
Impossible, really, to compare 1916-1987 era players to the post 1988 ones. With Bahr having accumulated 19 caps, a phenomenal total for his era, and Stark with 4 goals in 2 caps, hard to argue with your choices!
I would really disagree with that last part. It's a luxury but if Rimando was average with his feet he'd still be number three atm.
There's an understatement. He led the US to its best finish in the Olympics (2000) and World Cup (2002), and he's the best player not named Donovan to ever wear a US jersey. Bradley has already outpaced Reyna and Ramos on the club level, and his national team accomplishments at the Confed Cup (2009) and World Cup (2010) should already have him above both on this list.
JOB was REALLY good but almost always hurt. The guy had serious talent and it looked like Ajax was just a stepping stone.