Ha. They have been in the finals for three out of the four last years! Sometimes you can't make this stuff up.
make what up? they were elite (when Cronaldo was there). They havent been elite since. That is what I disagreed with.
Wow, a Wanye sighting. Though I agree with Prince. For Man Utd's standard of excellence during Ferguson's reign, they've been decidedly subpar the past 2-3 years. They've still got a good chance at winning the Premiership this year, but I think that says more about their level of competition than it does about their dominance.
Well, you and Prince are right that they have been worse in the post-Ronaldo era. I still think a lot of that (especially pertaining to your point moreso than Prince's since his focused purely on CL football) is due to you all comparing them against themselves. This isn't one of their strongest teams, but their team still is really good. IIRC, Ronaldo left prior to the 2009-2010 season. ManU won the league and were runner's up in the CL in the 2010-2011 season and may win the league this year. If you do not compare them against themselves, you probably would think that type of record is far from subpar.
But a team that carries all the advantages that United do with them must be held to its own standard, no? I mean, if it comes down to your requirements, Arsenal's competitive record is in the upper stratosphere of European football, but few Arsenal fans would say that they haven't been 'subpar' of late.
thats cool, but they arent an elite team in Europe right now and havent been for the last few seasons. You have to compare them against themselves and elite teams because that is their usual standards. And in 2010-11, they had a very easy run to the CL Final. I didnt say they were shit or terrible or Liverpool, that would be absurd. But they are not an elite team right now in European football. exactly
I can't say I follow. My point was that objectively, ManU have done pretty well. The last time Arsenal were in the CL final was in 2006 (or thereabouts). The last time Arsenal finished in the top 2 in the league was 2004-2005. Objectively, those results do not infer "elite" as of late. Compare those to ManU's and you will see my point.
I guess I'm curious what your standards are for the 'elite' teams right now in European football. Who would you consider up there above Utd?
Well, who do you consider "elite" right now? Juve's had a great season, an Invincibles for italy, yet they didn't even play in Europe at all this year. Despite Messi's numbers, there's something less than stunning to Barca, and Pep knows it, which is why he's leaving. Real Madrid has put the ghosts of the last three years of Barca beatdowns, and they're probably the best team in Europe right now, but you know, there's that little problem of having been beaten rather convincingly (in my book) by Bayern Munich. Dortmund is clearly the class of Germany the past two years, but they didn't get out of the first round of the CL. There are a lot of holes in everyone's resumes this year....
No Ramsey please, no Gervinho, and no Gibbs! Yes Santos, yes Ox, and yes Benayoun. They better win, cuz you know Spurs are going to win!
officially correct. they've dropped down the uefa club coefficient rankings this season to 29th. but........ officially incorrect. they topped the uefa club coefficient rankings last season and are the top ranked team over the last 5 seasons.
