That was called for WHY, exactly? Name-calling because someone disagrees with you? Thus the "I thought it was the Pinto." Forgot about the Vega. So thanks. Nobody "knows everything" about anything. I don't agree with your interpretation of the episode. Many other people do not, either. I expressed my difference of opinion on an internet message board. Your decision to see that as either a character flaw or a personal attack is not my problem. And you are contradicting yourself--on the one hand you admit that white flight to the burbs was in full effect, yet on the other hand you think that a bunch of affluent white suburbanites in the middle of downtown NYC wouldn't be concerned about being trapped by urban rioting. Which is it? These are all valid points, but I'm still not sure that detracts from the fact that a lot of people would have been shocked by the news and very very worried about the consequences. And we do know that Don, for example, was a liberal. And being a liberal at that time didn't preclude having racial prejudice--heck, it still doesn't. I'm sure I don't need to tell you that. I'm sure that was your parents impression of Americans, and their experiences were genuine. And seeing your country from an outside perspective can be enlightening. But that's still anecdotal evidence, as are your own memories. Not that they aren't valid, but there's plenty of evidence that many white Americans were shocked by Dr. King's assassination, and that fear of urban rioting was widespread. The latter was probably the decisive factor in the 1968 Presidential election. Reality is complex, and I thought that the muted, ambiguous reaction of many of the characters rang true. The outburst, yes--but that doesn't mean he didn't believe what he said. His situation just affected how it came out. Fair enough. That's your interpretation. I can disagree with you without name-calling.
Apologies, but my comment was a sarcastic observation that typically I have never seen you express doubt or acknowledge you did not know something when responding. Red, you weren't even alive in 1968 or if you were alive you would have been an infant. Suffices to say we have a difference of opinion. I stand by my own personal observations and further note that I take exception in your describing them as anecdotal.
Yeah, that's you not me. I've posted thousands of times over the past 13 years, and I'll wager the vast majority of regulars wouldn't agree with you. I wasn't alive during the Civil War, but I'm pretty sure slavery had something to do with it even though the vast majority of white people were racist. Sorry I was only a toddler when King was assassinated, but my parents and relatives also told me stories about what people were like then. If you can quote your parents, I can quote mine. It has been my personal observation that you "take exception" to lots of things that most people would have a hard time perceiving a slight in. "I don't agree with you" is not an attack. "I don't remember Vegas having the same problem Pintos had" isn't "I'm always right." "Anecdotal" isn't an insult. It simply means that you were--by your own admission--making your point based on stories your parents had told you and your own memories of the time period. Everybody makes anecdotal points from time to time. I was just pointing out that there's plenty of documentary evidence to suggest that the King assassination did have a strong effect on many white Americans at the time. My parents knew quite a few right-wing Protestants who were shook up by JFK, after all.
I know, and it's weird. But I really thought the issue he raised was worthy of discussion, so I brought up my own take on it. But of course, this somehow revealed a deep moral flaw that only Alberto is perceptive enough to see.
Anecdotal: Based on casual observations. They were not casual observations. Didn't take it as an insult. Merely your way of reinforcing your point by making my comments casual observations. Thanks. Also there was no need to be so condescending.
I get the feeling something big happened last night. Demos earlier comment about how pathetic Don was this season is clearly part of the narrative arc. Last night he tried to reassert himself, and in the end it collapsed. And so did he. "Man with a plan" indeed. Still mulling over what I saw.
Move Forward. I love that recurring theme. It's what Don told Peggy after her child was born; and I believe Don said the same thing to Lane before he killed himself. I'm now wondering if he actually used those words, but that was certainly the main idea. I wasn't exactly thrilled with the episode, because the Dom-Don thing was pretty irritating. And I didn't think (forget her name) the other woman would be so quick to acquiesce so completely. But I'm super glad how they pulled out of that, which made sense. And the Draper sad puppy face was a nice bit of acting by Hamm, after his uber alpha poses during the entire episode. I'm also quite liking belligerent glasses guy from the other firm. He's very promising. And the Pete D-bag quotient just keeps going through the roof. You know, I guess the whole Fake Identity thing is over. And I'm kinda surprised the character of Pete hasn't tried to bring that up again -- even just to be spiteful as he's feeling dicked over, like "Well that's not even his real name..." Did Don come clean to Megan about that before they got married? Seems so unimportant now. Plus: Striving Bob: Hero? Serial Killer? Soviet Spy? Clearly he's going to be a lynch pin in the season.
It's also pretty ironic, because Don really can't move forward; he just has to keep moving to avoid being alone with himself. "Forward" is a direction, towards something. Don is forever just trying to move. See, while it was uncomfortable and weird, I didn't find it odd that Sylvia initially went for it. Dom overheard the fight; he knows where she's at emotionally. He saw a chance to pin her down while she's vulnerable and more than that wanting to 'disappear' from her own unhappy life. I don't know about that--Pete just seems so frantic and disshevled, I don't think he can keep straight who he's mad at and why; more and more he just carries on as if everything is a plot directed at him and everybody is in on it. Were he ever to sit down and focus his resentment on Don for an extended period, he might try that card--again. It didn't work before, though.
Belligerent glasses guy is Harry Hamlin and he has been terrific. Pete is extremely insecure and is riding the down side of an emotional roller coaster with his separation from his family and more from his father in law taking the business away. That bothered Pete more than having Trudy kick him out. Fun to see Pete so emasculated. Whiny and flying off the handle at everything. The story with Don and his mistress was ridiculous. What was Weiner striving for a tv rated version of 9 1/2 weeks? The storyline was one that Don took advantage of his mistress doesn't make sense. The woman is astute. It screams of Don being passive aggressive and toying with her feelings. Does Don do that to drive her away? The flight upstate was hysterical.
Pretty good episode (directed by John Slattery, BTW), though it was pretty eerie having both a small-plane flight and the news of Robert F. Kennedy's assassination in the same episode considering that RFK's nephew John F. Kennedy, Jr. (as well as both his wife and sister-in-law) later died in a small-plane crash in 1999. -G
Still having mother issues in each and every show, with Pete's being the star of this episode. Obvious parallels being drawn between him and his scumbag dad, and of course there was an earlier mention that Pete never really wanted to have a kid with Trudy. He never wanted to see her as a mother. Also worth noting that in earlier seasons, Don would cheat with women who were independent, artsy, career-driven, a little out of the mainstream. Women who were the opposite of Betty. Then he married one of those women, and now he's having a full-blown affair with a housewife who is suffering from empty nest syndrome - a mom, through and through. Complete 180. He's not cheating with any other women that we've seen, and earlier in the season had talked to Pete about understanding what he's giving up if he loses Trudy. I'm not sure how it's all going to tie together - let's remember Betty's maternal instinct kicking in from early in the season, and Roger's meltdown when his mom died, plus Joan's allusions to her son being the man in her life - but I'm convinced it is, somehow.
I also read somewhere that Pete's mother (father?) had threatened disinheritance when Pete and Trudy were contemplating adoption. I kinda remember this -- and now I'm remembering Pete being typically childish about who was to blame about their infertility. But if that article was right, it would mean he was at least open to having a child with Trudy. But it also points to Pete's parents being shitty people, which would go some way in explaining the Pete-ness of Pete.
If I recall correctly, They got the results back from the doctor and Pete is happy and relieved he is potent. Trudy is disappointed and angry at Pete for being insensitive to her disappointment. She starts to talk to Pete about adoption. Pete being the self centered prick that he is says absolutely not. He doesn't want kids.
Quick shout out for how terrible almost all the new fashion is. Peggy has always dressed pretty poorly, but Joan especially has looked awful in most outfits. Even Megan's "hot" outfit, when she wanted to get Don's attention, was pretty ridiculous. Don's other woman has been the only one wearing the era well.
The fashions up to the start of the mod generation were quite beautiful. All through the 50's into the early 60's they were great. Wide lapels on suits, ties so wide they could be mistaken for lobster bibs. Polyester suits and dresses, bell bottom jeans, elephant pants, Nehru jackets, loud vertical stripes, clunky platform shoes. Man those fashions were hideous.
No one does drug episodes like Mad Men. SERIOUSLY, WTF did we all just watch? The robbery had me at the edge of my seat. Was I drugged up too? Jesus! I can't believe that years later this show still surprises me. "I'm feeling a lot of Emotions too" -Don. Amen Don, Amen!