J de Guzman to play for Canada?

Discussion in 'Canada' started by feyenoordsoccerfan, Nov 30, 2011.

  1. feyenoordsoccerfan

    feyenoordsoccerfan Member

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    There are rumours that Jonathan de Guzman thinks about playing for the Kanuks. I think that would be a great decision for both him and Canadian soccer.


  2. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    From what I understand, he renounced his Canadian citizenship because the Netherlands does not allow dual citizenship and now he needs to get it back. The CSA can advocate on his behalf, but I'm wondering if the process could be completed in time for the next round fo qualifying games.

    I haven't seen his play of late, I assume that it's still pretty high since he's playing for a Primera club.

    I'm reluctant to take him back since he's clearly choosing Canada only because his chances of making the Dutch squad are slim, but of course if he adds real strength to the team we'd be foolish not to.
  3. deepm

    deepm Member

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    Here's a link to an article where Julian D.G. discusses both Jonathan and Hoilett considering playing for Canada:

    http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2011/11/30/de-guzman-little-brother-hoilett-considering-canada

    As much as I resented Jonathan declining to play for Canada, as well as Hoilett, you have to realize both of them are quite young and likely had big ego's that have influenced them.

    Hopefully they make up their minds soon enough. Jonathan needs to do it quick so he can get his passport back as well.

    Jonathan is playing for Villareal and has featured in the Champions League as well.

    Surely they will both be an aset to Canada. Canada will need all the firepower they can get to ensure they get to qualify for the hexagonal stage...and survive the Hexagon.
  4. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    I understand Hoilett and his decisions up until now. Playing in internationals does impact one's commitment to their club so you kind of have to have a bit of pull within your club to stay in favour. Hoilett's position with Blackburn has not been well established, so I think he deserves some slack for holding out on his international commitment.

    As for JDG the younger, most people would probably make the same decision that he did were they in a similar position. Nonetheless, making such a decision does come with a stigma with respect to the country you reject.

    We're in no position to turn him down should he decide to play for us, but do expect him to deliver big time.


  5. adrenaline11

    adrenaline11 Member

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    Someone from the V's board (Rudi) mentioned a possible reason for why JDG2 hasn't capped for Holland. The reason is that because we did the Dutch such a big favour by liberating their country that nobody from their government to the citizens to the KNVB have forgotten. That's one possible explanation of why they haven't chosen to run him out there for a game and cap tie him.
  6. cloak

    cloak Member

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    i think the fact that CSA and him already have his documentation "moving" in an attempt to get him citizenship is signal enough, there may never be a concrete announcement from him..if he gets it, there's no question he'll play for canada since 2014 is basically his only real chance at world cup qualifying even though he's only 24.
  7. cloak

    cloak Member

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    that would be a romantic, iconic gesture. it's also possible he's just not good enough to have been capped for arguably the best international team on the planet? (or even a B team they might pick from for friendlies, etc)
  8. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    The Dutch thank us with a pile of tulips every year, that's enough.

    I really don't think they would sacrifce a player they need for their national team over events of 60 years ago. Sounds more like a little Canadian ego-stroking than reality.
  9. cloak

    cloak Member

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    haha yeahh
  10. jec1

    jec1 Member

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    I think he'll play for Canada. Sometimes it's all politics.
  11. crazypete13

    crazypete13 Moderator Staff Member

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    Yep. I'd say it's more likely he's not good enough to warrant a cap, I mean that's the reason most people aren't capped for their country, no?

    BTW, The tulips just are just one symbol of very nice relationship between Canada and the Netherlands, and in fact the dutch flag is the only flag other than the flag(s) of Canada to fly on the peace tower in Ottawa.
  12. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

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    A more plausible explanation is that he's simply not good enough to ever get a cap with the Dutch NT. Not a knock on JDG2, The Dutch are one of the deepest national squads at his position.

    If the KNVB was so hospitable towards us Canadians, then perhaps they could allow him to hold dual citizenship? That is the legal holdup for JDG2 playing with the Canadian NT. For him to regain his Canadian passport, he would have to give up his Dutch citizenship. That means taking up an international spot at the club level, which would harm his career. Until then that gets ironed out, I wouldn't expect him to play for Canada.

    I'm more hopeful about Hoilett finally realizing he won't crack the England lineup.
  13. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    But since he's playing in Spain now, isn't he considered international already? Or does any European citizenship qualify as "domestic"?


    I think that he's long been well aware of that fact. He's largely been holding out so as to focus on holding his spot at Blackburn. If Hoilett's thinking of choosing another country over Canada, it's Jamaica, not England.
  14. feyenoordsoccerfan

    feyenoordsoccerfan Member

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    I donot understand the discussion about his dual citizenship. There is no law prohibiting him from having dual nationality. Is it likely that Canada doesnot allow it?
  15. crazypete13

    crazypete13 Moderator Staff Member

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    Yeah, I have a coworker that has a Dutch passport as well as another.
  16. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

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    In accordance with EU labour laws, anyone with a citizenship of an EU country can play anywhere within the EU and count as a domestic. That's why an EU citizenship is so prized by footballers from overseeas.

    Well, this season he's set himself as a key player within the Blackburn squad, so I think he's pretty safe there (if anything, he's hoping for a move to a bigger club in January).
  17. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

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    No, Canada allows dual citizenship. I myself am a dual citizen.

    Anyone know why JDG2 renounced his Canadian citizenship?
  18. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    I figured that might be the case, thanks for the clarification.

    He's probably finally ready to make his international commitment just now, hence why he didn't make himself available for the Gold Cup. I'm guessing that the CSA held off from capping him for the first round of qualifiers as it was deemed that they really didn't need him and decided there was no sense in pushing the issue.

    No doubt they'll want to cap him for the next round, so when that time comes the Hoilett question will no doubt be settled.

    The Netherlands does allow dual citizenship, but it is only allowed under some specfic circumstances, for example, Dutch born abroad or by marrying a Dutch citizen.

    My guess if that he didn't qualify under any of those special circumstances.
  19. Moaca

    Moaca Member

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  20. Moaca

    Moaca Member

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  21. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    So here's a question: how significant is it to our chances of making it to Brazil are the decisions of JDG2 and Hoilett?

    I think it's fair to say that getting neither of them absolutely dooms us, and if we did get both of them it would not amount to a sure thing of getting through.

    But how much does it change things, especially relative to the other three countries in our group for the next round of qualifying?
  22. Area 51

    Area 51 Member

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    With them, Canada gets second quite comfortably imho.
  23. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

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    Obviously, this doesn't help the defensive side of the lineup, which will struggle against Honduras.

    I'd say that having both of them in the lineup should ensure a 2nd spot in our group after Honduras. As it stands, I think we have a good shot at 2nd.

    Still, I'm not all that confident about JDG2 or Hoilett playing for Team Canada.
  24. cloak

    cloak Member

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    why? everything points to him wanting to play for canada rather than not playing for anyone. he will, or should i say, i think it comes down to if the government will fast-track his citizenship. but yeah hoilett is a complete wildcard, i'm not particularly optimistic on that front but who knows!
  25. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator Staff Member

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    Re Hoilett, just for interest sake I spent a bit of time lurking on some Jamaican forums to see what they're saying about him and I was surprised to see that their attitude, generally speaking was that they could take him or leave him. They seem to think that their squad is plenty strong already.

    It also seems that the JFF has made little to no effort to court him and secure his commitment to Jamaica.

    If that is indeed true, it certainly strengthens our hopes of securing him, although it still doesn't gurantee anything, especially since Jamaica has a significantly better chance fo going to Brazil than we do.

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