Italian Ultras: your opinion?

Discussion in 'Italy: Clubs' started by sportfriend, Nov 23, 2008.

  1. sportfriend

    sportfriend Member

    Jun 24, 2006
    Canada
    1-2 weeks ago was the one year anniversary of the death of Gabriele Sandri... which gave me the idea to start a thread like this...

    i will refrain from writing anything here because i side 100% with the Ultras - before i get insulted, i want to just start a civilised discussion.
    this is not all about Mr. Sandri but a discussion about Italian Ultras in general...what is your opinion?

    P:S Riposa in Pace, Gabriele
     
  2. NickyViola

    NickyViola Member+

    May 10, 2004
    Boston
    Club:
    ACF Fiorentina
    I have no problem with passionate fans. I do, however, think that the stadiums should be a place where families can go to enjoy their local clubs without the threat of violence. When people stop taking their young children to the matches we lose a generation of soccer fans and I think that is really tragic.

    I am also against the clubs being held responsible for the things that the ultras do. It obviously leads to blackmail and extortion.
     
  3. MilanOnlyMilan

    Oct 24, 2005
    Lithuania
    These guys in the stands are the best feature of italian football for me, allways filling their curva in bad or good times for the club, and creating wonderful atmosphere, which can be matched only in a few countries. Personally i can hardly watch football matches without atmesphere, even if Milan is playing in that match. For me it is allways a pleasure to watch football Argentino, for example, even if football quality is not the best, passion in the stands absolutely compensates that.
     
  4. Duck Manson

    Duck Manson Member+

    Feb 8, 2005
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    As long as there are sections for families and children and Ultras has it's own sections it's a good thing. I'd rather have it like in Italy then in England and Spain where it's become like going to the movies. There's more noise at a Cagliari game then at Camp Nou or at Emirates.
     
  5. sportfriend

    sportfriend Member

    Jun 24, 2006
    Canada
    theres more noise and atmosphere at some Serie D matches than most EPL haha

    that was a f*cking excellent post @duckmason :cool:
     
  6. Foggia

    Foggia New Member

    Jan 30, 2009
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I am glad that some of you think so, not with the thoughts manipulated by TV and the mass media, journalists and those of the cock!
    now the football is no longer a sport, it's just business, since they entered the football advertisements, the salary and wages billionaires, money and whatever, but especially with the pay-tv, football has lost its charm and above all you try to blame the ultras, and violence as the only problem with regard to empty stadiums. and instead of ticket prices, which increase more and more (even the curves, which are the popular area of the stadium, but at present I do not think it is more an area popular with its price), the many digital channels at a low cost to watch the games from the TV, does that attract the viewer, which nowadays is more and more comfortable, unfortunately this is also another problem that fits into the new society that surrounds us, where no one lives over the road but it was always more comfortable and to avoid the trouble to get things ...
    ultras movement is something that if you do not live there and you're inside, you will never be able to understand everything. there are many things that you do not tell the ultras, and unfortunately in these televisions are only a few negative aspects about the violence and cazzate varie ...
    unfortunately think that the best way to do both of the stages of the shopping centers (office, busniess, merciandaising, etc. etc.) what that football is absolutely not! where everyone is seated and still, no banners, no smoke, no drums, no nothing! which leads to destroying the moviemnto ultras ... but they do not spring easily and continues to move forward, but there are also many warnings that many children are taken unjustly ...

    and then the stadium is a place where you go and see the game, is not a cinema or a theater (style america or united kingdom) would be too painful for our way of seeing the reality of football ...
    _______________________________________________________________

    Sono contento che alcuni di voi la pensano cosi, e non con i pensieri strumentalizzati dalle TV e dai mass media, e quei giornalisti del cazzo!
    ormai il calcio non è più uno sport, è solo business, da quando sono entrate nel calcio le pubblicità, gli ingaggi e gli stipendi miliardari, soldi e quant'altro, ma soprattutto con le pay-tv, il calcio ha perso il suo fascino, e soprattutto si cerca di incolpare gli ultras, e la violenza come unico problema per quanto riguarda lo svuotamento degli stadi. ed invece i prezzi dei biglietti che aumentano sempre di più (anche le curve, che sono il settore popolare dello stadio, ma ora come ora non credo sia più un settore popolare con i suoi prezzi), i tanti canali digitali a poco prezzo per far vedere le partite dalla TV, non fa altro che attirare lo spettatore, che al giorno d'oggi è sempre più comodo, purtroppo questo è anche un altro problema che si inserisce nella nuova società che ci circonda, in cui non si vive più la strada, ma si è sempre più comodi e nell'evitare la fatica per raggiungere le cose...
    il movimento ultras è qualcosa che se non lo vivi e non ci stai dentro, non potrai mai capirlo in tutto. molte sono le cose che non si dicono degli ultras, e purtroppo nelle televisioni vengono solo detti alcuni aspetti negativi riguardanti la violenza e cazzate varie...
    purtroppo pensano che il modo migliore sia fare degli stadi dei centri commerciali (soldi, busniess, merciandaising, ecc ecc) cosa che il calcio assolutamente non è! dove tutti sono seduti e fermi, senza bandiere, senza fumogeni, senza tamburi, senza niente! il che porta a distruggere il moviemnto ultras... che però non molla facilmente e continua ad andare avanti, però ci sono anche le molte diffide che molti ragazzi si prendono ingiustamente...
    e poi lo stadio è un luogo in cui bisogna andare a vedere la partita, non è un cinema o un teatro (stile america o inghilterra) sarebbe troppo penoso per il nostro modo di vedere la realtà del calcio...
     
  7. Theopisa

    Theopisa Member+

    Pisa Sporting Club
    Italy
    Oct 7, 2008
    Venezia
    Club:
    Pisa Calcio
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Foggia, the ultras world as we intended it before, in Italy it's almost dead. On one side we have the police and government repression, with the Osservatotio, the DASPO, the forbidden away games for supporters of certain teams in certain games, the media all concentrated in smashing up the ultras movement.
    On the other side we have the ultras themselves who have changed a lot in these last few years. In many realities (ex. Milan) there have been huge fights, almost an homicide, people arrested, a historic group disappeared (Fossa dei Leoni) so another two groups could control the Curva Sud and have the monopoly of the ultras MERCHANDISE, which in a season can bring - obviously - A LOT of money. Some people from the Sud tried to blackmail Galliani (I believe it was in 2006) to get free stuff (tickets, free trips with the team etc), they threatened him, but being Galliani one of the few who knows all of Berlusconi's skeletons in the closet, they obviously stepped a bigger s*h*i*t than they thought, and they were arrested, making a few months "al fresco". A similar thing happened in Roma (Lazio side) during the Cragnotti presidency, and this is the main reason why Lotito is so hated by the curva Nord, because he stopped any relation between the club and the curva.
    In Roma (Roma side), during several games one or more away supporters have been stebbed outside of the stadium, it happens at least once every 2 or 3 games.
    What I mean to say, is that there are still many ultras groups that care mostly to just support the team with chants, banners (where possible) etc., but the unbrave gesture (like those Juve ultras hitting a father who tried to protect his son in Bologna with a stone on his head and sending him in to a coma) has unfortunately become very common.
    I don't know if you agree but there's nothing ultras in all this, to me.
     
  8. FNU

    FNU BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Mar 6, 2007
    Monte Vesuvio
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Pisa and Foggia supporters, interesting.
     
  9. Wolfbeatseagle

    Wolfbeatseagle Member+

    May 7, 2007
    The Bermuda Tetrahedron
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I had never considered it, but the suggestion that there are sections reserved for the family crowd is great.

    I don't think that's the issue though. Being able to watch all the games from your couch is what is killing the ticket sales, and the big clubs are still bringing in more fans than most EPL clubs. The stadiums just look more empty because of the vast difference in capacities between most EPL stadiums and Italian stadiums.

    Ultras are not necessarily violent. They are just devoted supporters. The thrill-seekers among them are the ones fighting. It's important to note that a small percentage of the Ultras have ever fought.

    Association theory also plays a part. You only need one bad egg to spoil a whole batch.
     
  10. alexp92

    alexp92 Member

    Jul 5, 2007
    i think it's a real shame to see the whole culture dying out in italy. seems like less and less displays are being done even. on the other side, seems like it's thriving in eastern europe.
     
  11. ArizonaFußballFan

    Nov 8, 2009
    Chandler, Arizona
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I love watching the crowds at Napoli matches that I have seen on tv over the years.

    I don't like any of the violence portion of any of it but when supporters show their support for their club and sing from start to finish win or lose, it is quite awesome!
     
  12. _Catenaccio

    _Catenaccio New Member

    Oct 27, 2010
    Ultras = a place where I was always happy,a place where I never had problems of any kind,this was my experience...today I m still an ultras (sembra impossibile che segua ancora te...) but I prefer follow a team in lower leagues (always a team of my city) because there are less assurdi controlli ... pure un accendino costituisce una minaccia ora....


    Comunque ,for those that understand italian ,voilà two videos about manipulation of Ultras phenomenon

    la bufala campana
    part 1
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUItACXfyT4"]YouTube - Tifosi e informazione - La bufala campana (RaiNews24) 1/2[/ame]
    part 2
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1H56gmTX00"]YouTube - Tifosi e informazione - La bufala campana (RaiNews24) 2/2[/ame]

    * importante,ciò non significa che gli ultras non compivano atti di violenza.
     
  13. Aztattooedsean777

    Aztattooedsean777 Tattooed Football Fanatic

    Liverpool FC
    Netherlands
    Feb 15, 2009
    Chandler, Arizona
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    passionate support is awesome, violence is not.

    I could only imagine how awesome this wonderful support would look like to the new supporter on tv who has never witnessed it live if Italian football didn't have all the tracks around the pitch making everyone seem so far away.
     

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