HSV 2012/13 - 50th Anniversary Season - A Glimmer of Hope

Discussion in 'Germany: Clubs' started by HSV-Jung, Aug 24, 2012.

  1. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Didn't watch the game on Saturday, I was thinking surely they would finally turn it around and pull off a win against Hoffenheim. I avoided all results, wanting to watch the game on Saturday night on HSV Total. But then while I was driving on Saturday afternoon, the gloating FFH radio host blared out the result (in a gloating manner, the BAs"§$%§), which pretty much ruined my day. I wasn't going watch HSV get run over by Hoffenheim for ninety minutes. Instead I watched Mission Impossible 3 with my son, lecturing him on what a brilliant actor Phillip Seymour-Hoffmann is. Ahh, strange days! BTW, rest in peace Phillip, I'm not sure whether I should mourn you or be mad at you for ruining what could have been many more brilliant movies over the coming decades over some drugs.

    Back on topic. It really is as bad as it's ever been. Something has to happen and if we lose one or more games from now, Bert van Marwijk will be up for discussion. This is as of right now the worst losing streak the club has had for over forty years. Five straight games in a row. I'm speechless.

    I keep thinking of an interview given by Sven Bender ("Iron Manni") a few weeks ago, when he said that his father always strongly imbued him and his brother with the notion that you can have a bad day or a bad game, but you can always run and you can always fight. That's what we have not been seeing with HSV over the last little bit. They did not put up a fight! And worse, their running stats are abysmal. And this is something that any coach can work on and any team can improve.

    On the other hand, Hannover just recorded a second win in the second game with Rudnevs, he scored both games. Good for him. I hope he keeps scoring, so we can hang his record around Kreuzer's neck to sink him as soon as possible. We could use this guy now. Who has ever given a 12 goal scorer (in his first season in a new league no less) away for two million, perhaps in 1960 when you could buy a Gerd Müller or a small third world country with two million. It just doesn't compute!!!

    @Wappy: With respect to Lam Zhi Gin, I think he's a good player, but they simply haven given him enough playing time to really develop. Whenever I saw him, I thought he put in a decent performance, but there haven't been any stellar showings either. I thought he should have been given more of a chance over the first half of this season, instead of playing Westermann as fullback. I think he could do quite well, at least I am hopeful of it. They will keep him in the squad, since he is about as homegrown as it gets, and with HSV's awful youth development record, the club is under some pressure to make as much as possible out of the few "homeboys" that we do have.

    Just to end on a good note: How about them lillies. Darmstadt 98 won again this weekend and is now closing in on spot no. 2, where Red Bull Leipzig is stalling right now. I'm still not sure that I want the club to progress to 2. Bundesliga, because they are decidedly too weak and poor to be sustainable in that league and such surprise progression has led to the demise of a number of clubs in the past (salaries go up, but then you're stuck with that, even if performance is bad). But it's sure nice to see them winning so often!
     
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  2. White/Blue_since1860

    Orange14 is gay
    Jan 4, 2007
    Bum zua City
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    430162418359353344 is not a valid tweet id

    Ouch.
     
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  3. Bluecrux

    Bluecrux Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Dude, you should be a journalist. :cool:
     
  4. FC Trout

    FC Trout Member

    Aug 24, 2011
    Helena, Montana
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    Maybe Lasogga didn't play against Hertha becuz they're saving him for the "big game" against Bayern? Mystery personnel package today. Of course, they all pretty much stink right now
     
  5. Bazi

    Bazi Member+

    Jan 15, 2009
    Wuerzburg (Germany)
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Wasn't he just coming back from injury?
     
  6. Footy Magoo

    Footy Magoo Audaces fortuna iuvat

    Mar 23, 2009
    ♫ Flugelville
    At least HSV doesn't have to worry about Magath coming in.
     
  7. Billy South Philly

    Jan 28, 2013
    Newtown Square, PA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    van Marwijk fired. Slomko in.
     
  8. Völler's Mustache

    Aug 19, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    On the bright side, we got Slomko!

    On the down side, EVERYTHING ELSE.
     
  9. FC Trout

    FC Trout Member

    Aug 24, 2011
    Helena, Montana
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    Glad it is not Magath. Of course, we'll see how he does with Crapham. I mean Fulham.
     
  10. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    What a difference a game makes, 93 little minutes........

    Wow, talk about a breath of fresh air. I must admit I was really quite downtrodden after the Braunschweig loss. Here you have the team with the most dismal outlook on remaining in the league for perhaps the last ten years and they roll over our club like a hurricane. The fact is, van Marwijk still did nothing to change his strategy or approach, at least not visibly.

    And then there was all the Magath crap. Here's what went down. The most telling detail is two things that Magath mentioned in his statement on his facebook page:

    • He thanked several supervisory board members in particular, most importantly Jürgen Hunke.
    • He stated that he felt the HSV+ initiators were unsupportive of his prospective engagement and did not want him.
    Here's what this spelt out for many Matz Ab commenters and what made most sense to me. Hunke, the worst guy when it comes to the future in the club and the guy who will sell his soul to cling to his post, realized that Kühne likes both, HSV+ and Magath and was undecided. He likely saw Magath as a last chance to possibly kill HSV+ and so he started talking to Magath and tried to convince everyone on the supervisory board. Ultimately, it remains uncertain which four or five members remained steadfast, but I believe in retrospect we owe them gratitude. Eventually, while being unable to achieve the requisite 2/3 majority (8 out of 11) to sign Magath as chairman of the board and sports director and trainer, they had a majority to take him on as president only. Magath declined, wanting full power or nothing. I'm glad we were spared this, as a trainer his methods are doubtful and I don't think either Schalke or Wolfsburg would ever sign him again as both trainer and sports director (uncommon in Germany, while this is regular practice in the EPL, where the manager is both the trainer and the manager (i.e. responsible for signing and selling players)). Giving him yet another position, would not have been a good idea, at least I think so. And it shows that while Magath professed to be willing to give up a lot to take on the management of his "old love", he was really not willing at all to compromise in any way. BTW, the HSV+ initiators were quick to respond and say that they were quite willing to work with Magath in principle, they just didn't want to provide him with any assurances come summer. On a final note regarding HSV+, the extraordinary members meeting will be held on May 25, 2014, the future of the club will be decided then. In the meantime, five of the eleven members of the supervisory board have resigned, due to all the back and forth over the last weeks, the unceasing indiscretions and so forth. Just imagine what happened to Rodolfo Cardoso the week before: This is a man who was a great player for HSV and who identified with the club 100%. He was the trainer of the second team for years and stepped in both times as interim trainer for the first team when Oenning and later Fink where fired, doing quite well both times. Unfortunately, he's been chronically unsuccessful, the second team always being dangerously near to being relegated, even from Regionalliga. While all the second teams of the Bundesliga clubs play Regionalliga (the second teams of BVB and Stuttgart even play 3. Bundesliga), being relegated would also mean that HSV would lose out on signing many interesting prospects from smaller North German clubs, who would then prefer the Werder or Wolfsburg academies) and so it was decided about two weeks ago between Kreuzer, the board and the supervisory board, that Cardoso's contract would not be extended come summer. This is understandable, but then the "§"%!$§ing mole had to come and spill the beans to Bild Zeitung. And then Cardoso learned the news from Bild together with the rest of Germany, one day before Kreuzer had a chance to speak with him in person. This is no way to treat a man who has worked so long with the club. It reflects horribly on the clubs ethics and professionality. Whoever it is, the mole has no idea how much harm he has done to the club. And the newspapers are no better: One day the get this juicy bit of info, likely pay for it and gleefully publish it the next day. And the day after that they bring another piece, yet again ridiculing the club for its indiscretions. What a farce!
    The good thing is that the mole is very likely among the five who resigned. Also in terms of expertise, the resignations are a good thing, considering you want people who have either football, financial or business expertise. The resigned members are these:
    • Ali Eghbal: This is the only guy who will be missed. A beverage entrepreneur and true fan of the club. Most importantly remembered for his speech to the members meeting during his candidacy for the board. He started the speech in a business suit and stripped down to a fan outfit over the course of his speech. Obviously a stunt, but this guy seems to have had his heart in the right place.
    • Manfred Ertel: Former chairman, Spiegel editor, huge opponent of Hoffmann and huge opponent of HSV+. This guy was in bed with the Supporters club management and the Chosen Few.
    • Marek Erhardt: An actor and all-around idiot. Placed there by the supporters club management. Former stadium speaker. For many insiders the guy most likely to have been the mole. Staunch opponent of HSV+.
    • Björn Floberg: A Hamburg attorney. Comes through the ranks of the supporters club management. One of the biggest and vocal opponents of HSV+.
    • Hans-Ulrich Klüver: Businessman, also staunch supporter of the supporters club management and opponent of HSV+. This is also the guy who almost got into a fight with an usher last summer. He came to a game without his card and the usher did not want to let him in. Klüver just yelled at him that he was a member of the supervisory board and tried to force his way past the usher. This guy was also tipped by some to be the mole.
    With the exception of Eghbal, I say good riddance to all of these guys. Now the only bad apple left is Hunke himself, he will hold onto his position until he is forcefully removed. The other six members will have to stay on, because they are needed for the supervisory board to have a quorum. They will likely be replaced on May 25, although I wouldn't mind Meier, the current chairman, to stay on. He is the CEO of the company operating the port of Hamburg. Obviously lots of business and financial expertise and he comes across very professionally in interviews, while at the same time not appearing to seek them out. That's how a supervisory board is supposed to operate, we're not supposed to even notice them.
    Anyway, long post. I'll chime in later with another on Slomka's start. Back to soccer then.
     
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  11. Billy South Philly

    Jan 28, 2013
    Newtown Square, PA
    Club:
    Atlanta
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I need a drink after reading that. All that FO drama. sigh
     
  12. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Here's my take on Slomka. In Germany he has a nickname "der netter Herr Slomka" (nice Mr. Slomka), for always keeping his calm and for his seemingly perpetual smile. After Saturday's game, there were commenters in the news who said he simply smiled away the problems of the team. I thought he was a good choice. Three years ago, Hannover was at least as far down in the dumps as Braunschweig is now, following Enke's suicide the team was lacking any form of spirit and then Slomka came in. We all know that the team was not relegated and one year later they put up an impressive display on the European stage. What most people forgot, including me, is the fact that Slomka actually didn't record a win with Hannover until his seventh game. In this situation that would have been disastrous for HSV.

    He came last week and in his first interviews conveyed nothing but positivity. He spoke about how the team had a lot of quality and simply needed a spark to be able to "manifest their horsepowers on the tarmac" as he put it ("die PS auf die Strasse bringen"). He spoke positively of what he saw during training and only hinted at some changes that he might effect for the game.
    He brought Raijkovic and Jiracek, two guys that were more or less completely written off by both Fink and van Marwijk. Two guys with aggressive capacity that would have looked good on any team with it's back against the wall. And it worked out: Rajkovic made the Bundesliga team of the week on Kicker and Spox, while Jiracek scored a goal and was attested a very good game. Adler excelled, as did Jansen and Westermann (Westermann was supposed to be benched, but the night before the game Diekmeier came down with the flu and Slomka opted for Westermann to replace him instead of Lam). Badelj played very well, as did Rincon. Arslan, who caught much flack over the last little while, was seen by many as man of the match. After the game Slomka said it was extremely hard work and he felt hoarse, yelling at the players to track back. That's exactly what you have to do to coax a "stupid" guy like Arslan to keep his head in the game and that's another thing that van Marwijk did not do one little bit of. It's not his style, he was always silent on the sidelines. Calhanoglu and Lassogga both scored beautiful goals and did quite well all game long. It was a change in attitude and tell me what you want, it was a bit of everything and certainly some luck also (apart from goals, BVB was superior in every single statistic), but I think the most important factor was Slomka's positivity. Just like Mike Tyson says: Exhale the negativity, inhale the positivity! I'm theriouth!
    What a relief, what a breath of fresh air! What a worthy and beautiful way to send off Hermann Rieger, the Bavarian masseur who had found his way into the heart of every HSV player and fan for decades (he died last week at 72)! Let's hope the team stays focused. I hope Slomka can find a way to integrate Buoy and even more importantly John. They have a lot to add to the team, but they have to be integrated. Over the last few games they were both part of the problem and van Marwij didn't see this. The same goes for Lam and to a certain extent Tah. He's done excellently for his age, but people forget he only turned 18 two weeks ago and he still goes to school every day. It was too much. I think many will see these four (John, Buoy, Lam and Tah) as the losers of Saturday's game, but I don't see it that way, although they will certainly get less playing time in the near future. I am hopeful that Slomka can make the most of their great talent.
    The next five games are against Werder, Frankfurt, Nürnberg, Stuttgart and Freiburg. Those are all direct opponents in the fight to avoid relegation and I still think HSV can beat them all, if they play as a team. Eight or nine points out of these five games should bring the club to safer shores. Saturday's game will see the 100th derby between HSV and Werder and Werder fans have already plastered the city with posters reading: "„1. März – 100. Derby – Scheiß-HSV!“ and trainer Robin Dutt has heated up the kettle further by publicly stating that he feels strongly and is glad that he is with the right Northern team. Oh what I wouldn't give for a victory on Saturday. Nur der HSV!
     
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  13. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Meeh, derby loss. Another headache. I didn't see the game, but apparently at least it was a good fight and Hamburg looked to be in control for good portions of the game. The goal at 20 minutes was unlucky and for the rest of the game HSV chased the equalizer, without ever coming really close to getting it.
    The bad thing is that after another, apparently really good game, Raijkovic is out with a torn cruciate ligament. This means the season's over for him. Two good games and that was it. All the best to him for his recovery and here's to hoping Slomka will remember him come the start of next season.
    It's seems like when a little luck is called for, Bremen always keeps the upper hand against us, oh what I wouldn't given for a win on Saturday. Oh well, now it's on to Frankfurt, Nürnberg, Stuttgart and Freiburg. Again, if we can win several of these, we'll be sitting a heck of lot prettier.
    Oh yes and by the way, more Kreuzer outrage: He was asked about Slomka leaving the two winter additions John and Buoy off the squad for Bremen and in summary, his comment basically was that, yes, John is a disappointment and he expected more, but Buoy was only thrown in to top the deal off anyway. What manager in his right mind ever says that about a player on his own squad, no matter how bad he actually is? I'm lost for words.

    On a positive note: If you haven't already seen it on the "Surprise Call-Up Thread" in the national team forumf (where i posted it), Lasogga has been called up by Löw for Wednesday's fixture against Chile. Klose will be there, too and it's still possible that he will start, but there is no other designated striker and thus I would be that Lasogga will see at least some playing time on Wednesday. Let's hope he makes the most of it.
     
  14. Alex_K

    Alex_K Member+

    Mar 23, 2002
    Braunschweig, Germany
    Club:
    Eintracht Braunschweig
    Nat'l Team:
    Bhutan
    Yeah, three points behind 15th place with 11 games to go is pretty much impossible!
     
  15. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Please remember that I was talking about the situation after Matchday 20 here and I truly thought that it had been a long time since a team only had acquired 12 points after 20 matchdays and I was talking about the pure points outlook, not the comparison to the other teams out there that were also doing bad. But I must apologize. I just checked and last year Fürth actually only had 12 points after 20 matchdays as well. I'll readily admit that Braunschweig's outlook is better now, but I wouldn't bet the farm on them making the cut once May rolls around (albeit the same goes for Freiburg, Hamburg, Stuttgart and Nüremberg, if you ask me).
     
  16. Alex_K

    Alex_K Member+

    Mar 23, 2002
    Braunschweig, Germany
    Club:
    Eintracht Braunschweig
    Nat'l Team:
    Bhutan
    Yeah, but then it was 6 points behind 15th - which isn't that huge of a difference either. Either way - it's just that there is some kind of meme going on on Braunschweig's situation being uniquely hopeless.

    Points after 20 matches:
    2005
    Freiburg 15
    Rostock 13
    2006
    Köln 14
    Lautern 14
    2007
    HSV 15
    2008
    Duisburg 14
    2009
    Gladbach 13
    2010
    Hertha 11
    2013
    Augsburg 14
    Fürth 12

    After the 20th matchday there is almost always one team, sometimes two, that's got between 11 and 15 points. And since the most important aspect isn't points total but the distance between the club and 15th place, those teams with 15 points were actually quite often further behind safety then Braunschweig was on md 20 (e.g. in the very first example Freiburg was already 7 points behind 15th, Rostock 9 - compared to Braunschweig's six).

    Anyway, the season has been a huge success for the club already either way, so we aren't too concerned.
     
  17. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    1-1 against Frankfurt. First half was not good, HSV much better in the second and I think the penalty shot was deserved, although some Eintr8 fans may not agree. First Zambrano pushed Zoua down and then now matter what you're doing with the ball, if you've got your legs between the legs of the attacker and wiggle them about crazily, that guy's going to fall and you will see a penalty coming. At the same time, Zoua was abysmal, he tried hard but this just goes to show all the more clearly that he just doesn't bring what it takes to the table. He's a nice guy, but he's no help in offense, not even as a back-up. This means we have to pray Lasogga comes back quickly and stays fit until the end of the season. Otherwise we're screwed. And I do hope they fire Kreuzer in the summer, once the new management is in place, if for nothing else, then for selling Rudnevs.
    Apart from that some very decent performances from guys we haven't seen in a long time, Mancienne and even Tesche. Also, Ilicevic is fit again and was one of the best on the pitch, perhaps the best man for HSV. People tend to forget that Bayern was thinking about getting him just six months before he came to HSV. It's just that he's pretty much always injured, plus Fink never had much faith in him. If he gets his playing time, he may yet prove to be a critical asset, I'm sure that Slomka will let him play more in the future. The defense was not as bad as it could have been. Anyone who's read more than five of my posts knows that I am a fan of Michael Mancienne and believe he's mostly gotten a rough deal in Hamburg, he just needs more playing time. As abysmal as out list of conceded goals looks, that's one list that HSV is number one on for the season (53 goals conceded, more than ever before at this point in the season), I think we actually have a very decent crop of central defenders with Westermann, Tah, Djourou, Mancienne and Raijkovic (Sobiech can go sell hot dogs, he'll be more use to the club that way). I know this sentence may call for someraised eyebrows with some, but what do you say about a guy like Raijkovic, a man who has basically not played in two years, was demoted to the second team in the interim and who club executives have been telling nothing else but that he's unwanted and he needs to go find another club. Then he gets one chance at a starting spot and he makes the team of the week on Spox.com and Kicker (both not really HSV friendly). What do you say about a guy like Mancienne who's hurt for half a year, then gets thrown in, has two or three not so good games and then cast out like dross. The last time this guy played consistently, he formed a very solid defense together with Westermann for over half a season. Looking at the table during the first game of the second half of the season last year (against Nürnberg in January), HSV was fourth in the conceded goals table. This is a good player! Why cast him out like that? I say this is on Fink and it's on van Marwijk. Anyway, he looked decent on Saturday although you could probably make a good argument that the goal scored by Madlung was mostly on him.
    Jansen will remain out for six to eight weeks, so Westermann is the best we got as right fullback for a little while and Diekmeier wasn't much to look at either, but he's just coming back, give him time to find his game. Apart from that, if people can keep playing like this, with van der Vaart, Jiracek and most importantly Lasogga coming back, I think we could do pretty well against Stuttgart, Freiburt and Nürnberg.
    Oh and there good new, too, at least on the front where no news is good news, there have been absolutely no management scandals at the club for over two weeks now, that's gotta be some sort of record. No wait, I forgot Kreuzer's interview about John and Buouy, never mind. Nur der HSV!
     
  18. FC Trout

    FC Trout Member

    Aug 24, 2011
    Helena, Montana
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    This team is going down to 2. Bundesliga. Lotsa reasons why, but mostly because they cannot friggin' win
     
  19. HSV-Jung

    HSV-Jung Member

    Jun 15, 2010
    Frankfurt
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    The day of days is here, the day when the fate of the club will be decided. It's tonight or never. I'm wearing a HSV jersey at work today and obviously in the cafeteria this morning, tonight's game was the topic of discussion. I'm the only dedicated HSV fan at my work in Frankfurt, but there is a lot of sympathy. Nobody outside of Bavaria really wants another Bundesliga record and standout characteristic to be passed over to Bayern. Plus most people feel that HSV does belong in the Bundesliga much more than Fürth does (Henry Kissinger excluded).

    I can see that just as I, most people on this board with sympathies for HSV have been too depressed to speak much about it for the last two months. I cannot believe that after the great win over Leverkusen, we did not manage to even tie a single match. It could really still have gone quite well if (if only) we had beaten Hanover, but we lost and it really went downhill from there. Well, it happened. This is real and we are where we are.

    As I see things, HSV has no excuses tonight. Pretty much everybody that could be expected to be fit, is. Most importantly this includes Lasogga. On Saturday he scored again and that is one of his great qualities. Once he's matchfit, he comes right back and scores. Other players need weeks or even months after being matchfit to find their top form, after they come back from injury. Perhaps it's because Lasogga is injured so often, that he has the experience to know exactly what to do to be right back from day one, but whatever he does, it's working. He scored against Mainz on Saturday, just as he scored in every game coming back from injury this season, just as he scored pretty much every game he played this season, period. We need him to score tonight, more than once if possible, because they need to settle the score tonight. HSV has not won an away game since sometime last fall on Oct. 27 against Freiburg. For Slomka it's even longer. His last away win was with Hanover against, ta dah, Fürth on April 27, 2013, over a year ago. For me this just means that all my hope lies in tonight's game, because if they can't do it tonight, the chances certainly won't be much better on Sunday.

    So the heat is on, the stage is set. Now please just go ahead an do it, deliver a victory tonight, if possible by several goals and without conceding any.
     
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  20. Berchtesgaden

    Berchtesgaden Member+

    May 18, 2011
    Milwaukee
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Good luck today. I am hoping you guys win big and then HSV+ gets passed.
     
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  21. FC Trout

    FC Trout Member

    Aug 24, 2011
    Helena, Montana
    Club:
    Hamburger SV
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    0-0. 90 minutes until....Hello, Aue!
     
  22. Bluecrux

    Bluecrux Member+

    Nov 10, 2006
    San Jose, CA
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Congratulations on retaining the dinosaur.
     
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  23. unclesox

    unclesox BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 8, 2003
    209, California
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Who says dinosaurs are extinct?! :D
    Congrats HSV.
     
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  24. Borussia

    Borussia Member+

    Jun 5, 2006
    Fürth near Nuremberg
    Club:
    Borussia Mönchengladbach
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Glückwunsch zum Klassenerhalt.

    I think that many HSV fans often got close to heart attacks after the 1:1. ;)
     
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  25. Rosebud

    Rosebud Member+

    Aug 5, 2012
    Chicago, IL, USA
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Now's probably not the time for me to bring this up as I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, but am I the only one who actually thinks that getting bounced down would've been good for the club? Would've let them tear down that idiotic clock and start forming an actually identity that goes beyond "hey we haven't sucked complete balls enough to get relegated!" which seems to have the club trapped with small dreams and nothing to build towards.
     

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