Gold Cup - July 2013

I thought he was on Germany's U20 side.

 

He's been playing for both but odds are that he plays for the US. Ramos is very optimistic he's there for the US at the U20 World Cup

 

New and improved guesstimate at Groups:

USA, Belize, Costa Rica, Cuba
Portland, Salt Lake, Hartford

Mexico, Martinique, Canada, Panama/Guatemala
(Atlanta, Denver, Dallas.)


Honduras, T&T, Haiti, El Salvador
(N.J., Houston, Miami.)

 

Has Klinsmann commented on what sort of squad we're bringing yet?

My recollection is the last time we competed in the Gold Cup in a Hex year without participating in the Confederations Cup, we took a fairly strong side -- Keller, Cherundolo, Beasley, McBride, Onyewu, Donovan, Pope, Mastroeni, Dempsey, Conrad, etc. I'm not sure why everyone is simply assuming that we're going to blow it off this time.

 

B team. I'm guessing the squad will mostly be players who would have played in last summer's Olympics and a few veterans.

 

Younger players who aren't established with the senior team. My guess is that means players like Corona, Shea, Agudelo etc.

 

and you could throw in the likes of a holden, who you hesitate to risk in thr hex

 

Ah, well that explains it then. I must have missed that announcement.

Interesting contrast between Arena and Klinsmann then.

 

No "announcement" yet.

A lot of assumptions being made

Klinsmann has talked about a certain rotation of the squd between qualifiers and the Gold Cup...........as its a very busy summer for the USMNT (and we also have a U20 World Cup and a U17 World Cup to hopefully keep an eye on).

But it remains to be seen what the squads will look like. And we do also need to be mindful that the MLS season will be in full swing. So for instance, we're not going to take 4 players from the same team to the Gold Cup (for instance say................Morrow, Wondolowski, Beitashour, and Alan Gordon from San Jose)

 

I don't think the concerns of MLS teams will matter much during the Gold Cup. During the last Gold Cup, the Red Bulls had 5 players taken, Salt Lake 4, Sporting 4, and Houston 3. Granted, this wasn't just because of one team taking four players, but ultimately the Gold Cup is a FIFA date and coaches can and should take the players they want.

That's not a bad roster, but personally I see this Gold Cup as a great time to test a lot of MLS guys. Most of our top squad plays abroad, but they won't be here, so I expect to see more MLS players, not fewer. For instance, during the 2011 Gold Cup, 6 MLS players were on the US squad. But during 2009 Gold Cup, we had 15 MLS players.

I know this is inconvenient for the league and its teams, which is why I think it should take a couple week summer break during the Gold Cup's opening rounds. Use the time for early US Open Cup matches (when most teams don't play their full A-teams anyway) and international friendlies.

 

Here are the quotes I recall seeing on that topic. I agree that we're likely to see a good number of MLS guys.

http://www.tropigol.com/2012/10/17/klinsmann-plans-to-have-2-teams-in-2013-qualifying-and-gold-cup/

 

Agree with all of this.

The only (slight) difference is that the 2011 GC had a Confed Cup spot on the line, while this one in 2013 is relatively meaningless. JK might have said (or there could have been other indications) that he may limit his Gold Cup call-ups to no more than one per MLS club.

(And yes, that doesn't account for how other Concacaf NTs will call their players, and yes every coach/NT is within their rights per FIFA to call and have any players they want.)

 

As FlipsLikeAPancake pointed out above, we called up many more MLS players in '09 (no Confed Cup slot) than we did in '11 (Confed cup slot). Much of the US second tier/up-and-comers play in MLS, so while I don't necessarily want to lose multiple players from my club team (Pontius, Kitchen, Hamid?), I think JK should call the best squad he can after he rests whoever he wants to rest from the A team.

 

It's possible that coaches can take whoever they want............but they normally don't.

Usually there's a dialougue going on between the USSF staff and the MLS (and Euro/Mexico) coaches throughout the the year. You want to maintain a positive working relationship with the clubs.

The Supporter's Shield does mean something to MLS clubs now that a CCL place is on the line. And if you take 5 players from a single club this time............the management at that club won't be pleased. And they'd be less likely to release any players for future events. (In the manner that Hertha Berlin seems to be unwilling to release our youth players for non-FIFA tournaments now such as U20 World Cup qualifying]

 

Yes, but there's also the possibility that the "Jan camp" was/is some form of JK's "C" team to feature MLS and other on-break players, while the summer Gold Cup will be JK's true "B" team to feature mostly UEFA-club players who are in their off-season but not among the "A" squad used during the June WCQs.

Regardless, the 2013 Gold Cup (and perhaps the 2015 Gold Cup) and how the rosters are created for each, might give us some more insight and points of comparison for JK relative to his predecessor.

 

I mostly agree. I'm just not sure how deep the UEFA-based "B" pool is and how much of a squad of 23 you can fill from it. It'll be interesting to see whether he dips to "C" guys for the Gold Cup just because they play in Europe and are off (Frank Simek played the last time we won the Gold Cup -- might not hurt to give him a call. ) or whether he calls the strongest B team he can, which would seem to me to be MLS-heavy.

 

Sure there's a dialogue, and if a player isn't likely to feature, then yeah he might be left behind. But I don't think the situation is analogous to Hertha at all. Hertha doesn't care about the US team, and doesn't want players like Brooks flying across the world to play in youth qualification, because there's no upside for Hertha. For American teams, not only are they generally more cooperative and patriotic about the US team, but there also are very real incentives for them to cooperate. If I'm an academy player, why would I sign with an MLS team that blocks me from playing with youth national teams? Furthermore, having players play on the national team increases their exposure and transfer value.

 

(I get what you're saying, in some ways about the patriotism and whatnot), but outside of that, why would your analysis only apply "if I'm an academy player" in MLS, yet not "if I'm a young player in Hertha's system" (or any foreign club's system)?

Why would I sign with Hertha if "that blocks me from playing with youth national teams" (and my potential in to or aid toward the senior NT) and why would Hertha (for example) not want the benefits that could come from YNT appearances and the potential for increased exposure and transfer value?

Yes, they're not completely analogous (the Hertha and MLS situations), but that is perhaps more so for the the travel demand of UEFA-club players back to Concacaf, relative to MLS-club players closer to Concacaf locations. (But other than that the club v country dynamic isn't all that different, imo, simply because a player plays for a club outside of his NT's home/region.)

 

Because Hertha doesn't need that exposure. Anyone scouting Hertha probably isn't going to care whether that player plays for US youth qualification events or not. But if someone is scouting an MLS team, they'll probably wonder "why isn't this guy in the US national team setup?"

 

I understand that.

We are getting very close to an MLS club denying USYNT callups............by the way.

Last U20 cycle DC United was publicly reluctant to let Perry Kitchen leave for U20 qualifying/world cup, as he was slated to have a role on their team. They did let him go to qualifying, which isn't a FIFA event, but they didn't seem thrilled about it. [It's a CONCACAF event, so teams aren't required to release players.]

This U20 cycle, it's possible Luis Gil may be in the same position with RSL.

 

Would RSL really insist Gil not go to qualifying though? RSL's season debut is on March 3rd, the last day of the CONCACAF U20 tournament. But I'm sure they can work out an agreement where Gil will be released from the squad after the quarterfinal on February 26th, because winning that game qualifies the US for the U20 World Cup, and that's all that really matters.

 

My gold cup first XI



--------Agudelo
Shea--------------Gatt
-------Corona-Diskerud
--------------Kitchen
Castillo-Besler-Gonzalez-Lichaj
----------Hamid/Johnson