FC Schalke 04: Huub Huub Hooray 2011/2012 Thread [R]

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Must be shocking news for any Schalke fan. Hopefully he'll get well again soon.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Hmm

I wouldn't mind that, but I don't know if it's realistic. I guess there can't be too many options at this stage.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

I don't like Flick. I think I would prefer Büskens or Tuchel but I doubt they are available. What about Franco Foda at Graz? What kind of football are they playing?

There aren't a lot of attractive options on the German speaking market.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

What about someone relatively young? It's not like we're going to win anything this season, why not bring in someone with a little less experience with fresh ideas? Someone who's flexible now, but will work towards a certain style of play in the future; someone who will build a "system"

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Watching Hamburg this afternoon put a smile on my face. Hopefully Schalke can display that kind of character and perseverance in our first match without Rangnick.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Amongst his worshipers he had many names: Eternal Otto, King Otto and Rehakles were only a few of them.

But make sure to get some embalmment oil.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Holtby for the win. He plays so much better when he's higher up field.

I still think that having both Raul and Huntelaar on the field simultaneously is redundant. Raul can be absolutely brilliant, so if I had to choose one it would be him.

Our holding midfield is still a weak point, and our defense was ridiculously poor today. We were lucky not to see 4-4 at the end of the day


I want to this at some point:

----------Raul-----------
Jurado---Holtby---Farfan
------Kluge---Papa------
-------Back four--------

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Stevens is your new coach (kicker). He will train with the team in some minutes and later a press conference will be given.

I hope the guy uses the offense potential of Schalke and does not only let them play his usual "we park the bus and in the offense we need luck (in your case Raul)" strategy.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

I'm not completely convinced. Not so much because Stevens is a bad coach but because of the style he lets play.

I had the impression that Heldt had a playing style in mind which Schalke should play in the next couple of years. Players and coaches would be bought so that they fit this style (or vision). Stevens does not fit it, so it looks as if this whole idea is dead already.

I guess Stevens will be able to stabilize our defense. If he has the players, he plays an attacking game. Seeing that our strengths are up front I think we will continue to play attacking football.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

This sums up my thoughts quite well.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Yup, the guys really took their foot off the peddle in the first half. The second half looked better when Papadopoulos (and later Jones) were holding down the defensive midfield. Jurado is simply amazing at times. He really should play more often. Draxler really fought hard tonight, I expect Huub will admire that.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

I don't like Heldt - he seems really nasty (and, what's worse, is not even a good manager). At Schalke, first there was the whole Magath affair, then he seemed to want to get rid of Raul (of course not openly - that's not his way - but by spreading rumors and winding Raul up until he leaves), and now he gives another "ultimatum" to an outstanding player.
This is not how you treat a man like Farfan (or Raul). This is how an abusive boss treats his minimum wage workers. In Farfan's place I would not put up with such a treatment. It would, at least, heavily count against Schalke in my deliberations about staying or leaving.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

There is a quite funny saying in Germany about Horst Heldt's qualities as a manager.

"Ein Held(t) im verkaufen, ein Horst im einkaufen."

Which means something like "A hero at selling but lousy at buying" but the joke gets somehow lost in translation I fear.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.

Heldt had nothing to do with Magath. Magath got himself fired by the way he treated fans, staff and the way he conducted business. It is not by chance that he got canned after the annual business report came in which brought to light more than a few shady deals Magath made.

Nobody wanted to get rid of Raul. At least nobody at Schalke. Bild wrote about problems without ever getting any substantial evidence or statements. And yes Bild was the only source everybody else just quoted them.

The critic about the ultimatum is stupid, too. Everybody does it. How long do you want to wait? Schalke has to make plans, too, they can't wait indefinitely. They want a decision in the winter break. Farfan had more then enough time to contemplate his decision seeing that the negotiations started in pre season. At some point you have to make your own decision.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

Do you accuse Magath of fraud? Then you are the only one. All that he has been accused of is that he should have consulted the board before buying some of the (least expensive) players. If true, the sums involved were small and it was all about misunderstandings about the scope of Magath's authority. (He was not only manager, but also board member, after all.)

You are right that Magath was fired because of "the way he treated fans, staff and the way he conducted business". He did not sycophantically pander to the egos of the fan club representatives and board members, he did not coddle the staff and players but demanded that they work hard, and he conducted business in a professional, non-emotional manner. That's the way he operates and has achieved his enormous success. And Schalke knew that before they hired him.
But Heldt was on the forefront of those scheming to get rid of Magath. He had fallen out with Magath and been sidelined by him long before fans or board members became disenchanted with Magath. He had the most to win and the least to lose by the fall of Magath. That makes me wonder if Heldt was not the mastermind of it all from the beginning.

Again, you are the only one who denies that Heldt said the things that were reported (not only by BILD, but also by proper media) - for instance that Raul had held negotiations with a club in England (which Raul then had to publicly deny), and so on.
Of course, the Schalke fans did not want to get rid of Raul. That's why Heldt could not openly demand a transfer. But the way he (and Rangnick) kept talking about Raul and stoking the media fire instead of quenching it was designed to make him leave on his own accord. That's obvious to me. Only when the fans made it clear how much they wanted Raul to stay, and when Raul refused to leave and the transfer period was (almost) over (so he couldn't have sold him anyway), Heldt had to change course.

You do not give an ultimatum which ends in a month in the middle of the season. This has nothing to do with Schalke having to be able to make plans. The next transfer period starts in January, and Schalke would not sell Farfan or buy a replacement in the winter transfer period, anyway, but wait until summer.
Why then have this strange ultimatum in October, if not to catch him by surprise and leave him little time to line up offers in a time of the season where it is difficult for him to negotiate with other clubs?
It is true that Farfan could have made a decision before, but why should he have? There is nothing dishonorable or strange in not wanting to sign a contract in the middle of turmoil. If I were him, I would want to wait how the new coach and new board works out and what course the club will take after Magath. If the club does not allow this and puts me under pressure, I would leave.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

No, it was not a small thing Magath did. Magath had still 3 years on his contract with a salary of 5m per annum. He didn't get a dime of that sum after being fired.
Do you really believe he passed on all that just out of the good of his heart? There were serious irregularities, Tönnies more than hinted at that, which cost the club dear money. It is also not a minor infraction if he ignored the board. The whole setup is there so that the board can control the front office, ignoring them isn't something to you just shrug off.

Yes, Heldt had most to gain from Magath's sacking. But that alone is no reason to make him responsible the way you do. He was hardly 6 month at the club when Magath left that isn't enough time to built up that kind of influence, especially for someone sidelined.

The disenchantment with Magath started also much earlier, when the members shot down his request to get more independence from the board. Magath was majorly pissed off from then on and it showed.

Of course what about the way Magath downright blackmailed the board to increase his
transfer budget in the summer? An extremely classless act for a CEO and not something you do in a harmonious business environment.

The problems ran very deep and if anything, it is surprising that Tönnies and the board stood so long with Magath. Everybody else would have gotten fired much earlier.


No, nobody reported anything besides quotes from Bild. There was nothing substantial to base the whole story on. The Blackburn offer was turned down by him in less than a day without even starting negotiations. The whole story about Malaga was an utter joke and mispresented to the extreme.
There doesn't exist a single statement of Heldt, Rangnick, Raul or his agent about him wanting to leave. Only Bild kept on reporting of him not smiling, playing allegedly a different role, turning into a diva and such crap.


It's not as if I think Heldt is a flawless manager. I had reservations about him and they are still there but so far he is doing a pretty decent job at Schalke.

 

Re: You Rang(nick)? An FC Schalke 04 2011/12 Thread! [R]

That is your evidence?
There is an easy explanation why Magath did not sue: he thought it was not worth it.
He had enough of the media frenzy. He did not want to be on the front pages of all German tabloids and be ridiculed and vilified for being greedy and trying to ruin Schalke. He did not want crazy Schalke fans going after him.
He did sign a lucrative contract with Wolfsburg immediately after leaving Schalke. So I doubt that he would have had a right to that 5m salary. He would probably have had a claim for 1 or 2 million, but he knew that Schalke would make counterclaims for the transfer sums/salaries of those players he had allegedly bought without proper permission of the board (which has nothing to do with fraud).
He just wanted to work as a coach at Wolfsburg without the distractions of a never-ending highly publicized judicial mud-wrestling saga.

Of course Tönnies would say that (making very vague hints so nobody could nail him down on it). He couldn't admit the truth, after all, could he?

Magath was a member of the board. He was not just an employee. His condition for agreeing to come to Schalke was that he would have even more powers than he had at Wolfsburg (where he left when VW did not want to extend his already considerable authority there). It was only when Schalke wanted to get rid of him that they began to restrict his powers and doubt his transfers.

How did he blackmail them? What did he threaten them with? That he would leave?
But that reminds me of another reason Magath was dismissed: Magath was brought to Schalke to "win the Bundesliga title within 3 years". That was the official Schalke policy. Then, something seems to have happened. Tönnies made remarks that hinted that Schalke was deeper in debt than everyone had thought (and Magath even said that Schalke had given him a far too optimistic account of the financial situation when he signed there). Tönnies obviously had to change policy and give up the ambitious goals he had agreed with Magath. But he knew that Magath would never stand for it, so he had to get rid of him.

Is transfermarkt.de reputable enough for you? Here is the link: http://www.transfermarkt.de/de/scha...-zu-blackburn-rovers/news/anzeigen_70042.html
Everyone (except Heldt, apparently) knew that Raul did not want to leave. Raul had stated that many times and had made that very clear. So, why did Heldt talk to Bild about an offer from Blackburn and about the possibility of Raul leaving? He knew that interview would be all over the media and be a sensation. This was not naivety, that was calculated.
But this was by far not the only strange public statement by Heldt and Rangnick during that time. They could have easily made an end to all speculation, for instance by a joint public statement with Raul. They did not do that but started to talk about how Raul does not fit into the tactical system etc