Talking about clueless, R9 isn't near Messi in overall dribbling, nor is anyone else that matter, but I thought this was about speed? There R9 has some claim if the speed is about straight line kick the ball speed, but I think Walcott is even faster in that.
Meassi could not do 20% of Ronaldo technical moves and those were applied at highest speed... from Brazil to Holland to Liga to SerieA to copa and WC ... now Messi? Keep your Messi within the "BARCA system circle" LOL
Messi can go past players in any situation, R9 can't. This is better dribble than anything R9 produced, ever , and I could post examples all day long. Yeah keep repeating the delusional Brazilian drivel, it's a nice way to waste your life.
You never watched R9 at his best so DO NOT comment = its so nonesense and invalid though Messi never had faced any (as half good) as Maldini, Thuram, Nesta (at peak) Desailly, Blanc, Hiero, Stam, Canavaro , Ferrara , Costacurta ... Keep posting the same clip (of Messi) against B class DF and keep them INSIDE BARCA system LOL
Why do you keep this up? You probably started watching football 20 years later than me, you obviously have read how good somebody was from a book. It's pointless to have a conversation with such an illogical and ignorant person like you. Have fun.
When will Messi fanboys stop converting every thread into a joke? Messi is the fastest dribbler, better than Eusebio/R9, pre-injury R9 isn't near Messi in dribbling...ROTFLMAO! Messi this, Messi that...Give it a rest already. Let's see what he does in the WC. Then come and blabber. If he does well, everybody will acknowledge him as a great. If he doesn't, all this Messi talk will evaporate.
It's James, the resident fanboy of Brazil who converts these threads into a shit. I gave my opinion in this thread, nothing more and then James got sand in his vagina and started the blame game, as he usually does. R9 pre or post injury isn't as good dribbler as Messi, or can you show me a dribble which is as good as the next 5 dribbles with which I will respond to it?
Messi's dribbles do not look as good to everyone as they do to you. Messi is indeed one of the best dribblers ever but there have been other players who have been as good, if not better, including pre-injury R9.
Completely agree, those of us who had the privilege to see Ronaldo would agree that, as far is dribbling is concerned, he was better than Messi. Although Messi has other attributes which are better.
Well I saw him play almost weekly, and I don't agree. So it's not about of priviledge of seeing somebody is it?
That's exactly what I said here ... If those fan boys had the chance to see/watch Garrincha/Pele/Cruijff/Best/Maradona and R9 (pre injured) they would not be so "thrilled" with Messi right now. ( he is so good but not like "never seen" before) Like if someone never heard/used of Apple windows (back in early 90s) they would say Window 8 (20years later with all top technology put in after all) is the best??? LOL I always say and agree Messi is among the best dribblers (TOP10) in history - YES is he the best dribbler ever or up there with Pele/Maradona? NOOOOOOOO
You are killing yourself with that Windows 90s vs. Windows 8 comparison, James. I bet Bada Bing saw Ronaldo play week in week out for Real Madrid and then he saw Messi dribble the crap out of Reinartz, Toprak, Lago, Túñez, Pina and other such splendid defencemen and thought to himself: wow, Messi is the greatest ever, sooooo much better than Ronaldo and everybody else. Bada Bing, regarding examples, why don't you post some where Messi is seen dribbling past defenders of the caliber of Maldini, Nesta, Thuram, Desailly, Blanc, Canavaro , Ferrara, Costacurta etc.?
Um, because he isn't? One can say that he is the fastest. But that would be a very subjective statement.
Haha to be honest I have not yet gotten the window 8. (I meant "real WINDOW" in Apple McIntosh computer in 90s using UNIX - never crashed, not the crappy window in IPM PC of old days = reset or power up is your best HINT)
But a discussion of fastest dribbler (not fastest player) is in a subjective field... I quoted Ronaldo because he is one of my favorite players, but Messi in dribbles, owes nothing to it (if it is to slip up top). Do not bother because others members talk about Messi.
[quot"Lucas Gomes, post: 27084518, member: 224174"]But a discussion of fastest dribbler (not fastest player) is in a subjective field... I quoted Ronaldo because he is one of my favorite players, but Messi in dribbles, owes nothing to it (if it is to slip up top). Do not bother because others members talk about Messi.[/quote] Yes, it is a subjective domain. That's why I said one can say Messi is ... however, that would be very subjective. If the issue could be solved objectively, then one would not be able to say X is this and that unless objective data would suggest so.
The problem is that lately Messi fanboys have been derailing every thread with Messi this Messi that jargon. The issue is that there is a feeling that the opposition Messi plays against and the ones faced by earlier greats are not drawn from the same reference population (in terms of ability). So, highlighting Messi's achievements against the likes Torpak, Lago, Pina etc. and implying that he is the best at everything based on that evidence is foolishness, especially, since earlier greats have performed against higher level of opposition (e.g., Maldini). Unless, Messi does it against that level of oppoaition, I don't think it is right to derail every thread claiming Mess this Mess I that and mocking others who do not think so.
Just for your wonder: 1-Ronaldo took on 5,6 DF at CENTER pitch fom 60+yards = 10seconds to score. 2-Messi 3 DF + GK at the right side pitch from 55yards =11seconds 3- Maradona vs England, 4DF + GK at right side pitch from 60yards = 10seconds No brainer to see its more difficult to dribble right at center (than from the wing) and Ronaldo got more DF to beat at longer distance and did it shorter. Ronaldo dribble faster than Maradona >= Messi
These videos do not prove anything... and goal from Messi was as difficult as the goal of Ronaldo (this is obvious). There are other situations Messi dribbling players at center. Messi in all his games dribbles several defenders using his speed coupled with exceptional ball control, and this discussion is that the thread suggests. He does this several times, in an amount greater than Ronaldo in his peak (game by game). I'm not saying that Messi> Ronaldo, just that the argument that the argentine is best is valid. There is no absurdity in saying this and no numbers/statistics to prove unlike. A discussão é subjetiva. I understand ... Also happens not to those who like to know that Messi is already in the reign of football along with other geniuses. This kind of behavior of people is common When there is a top player so to others (like Messi is currently). What it can not generalize!
Nice way to bullshit again. You understand we can see the videos? R9 beat 4 players, Messi 6 including the goal keeper when possession, so it's not even close the same quality. And nobody disagreed about R9 being one of the fastest when kicking the ball straight line speed. But the question was do OP mean speed, or speed. Straight line kick the ball speed or who is more faster controlling the ball, adjusting into situations, changing direction etc. where Messi is easily the fastest in history. 6-7 players beat in couple seconds 5 players in ultra narrow place in about 2 seconds. 5 players in ultra narrow place in about 2 seconds 3 players beat in near full speed, with control and precision that R9 never could do R9 was one of the fastest when talked about straight line speed, but he's not as fast at controlling the ball as Messi, well nobody isn't.
Where do you think so called "Messi fanboyism" comes from? When a person like Roy Hudson who is 70 years old has been referred to as the biggest Messi fan boy ever comments on Messi being the best hes ever seen what does he gain from it? Or could it be simply that Messi is really fvcking good and this creates people to be fans of his? Think logically here buddy. And this thread is whether or not Messi is the fastest dribbler in history thats perfectly believable its not like people are claiming hes the best defender ever. At least Bada Bing posts video evidence. Any one that has watched ronaldo fenomeno as I have from his prime would be able to draw the simple conclusion that Messi has control over the ball with every dribble where as Ronaldo often didn't so can this be attributed to dribbling speed or just his speed in general? I believe its the latter. Point in case: Minute 7:28 in this video, how can these be called dribbling speed when he kicks the ball meters ahead of himself? That is general speed, other wise Usain bolt can kick the ball the length of the field and chase after it and claim to be the fastest dribbler ever.
Exactly, for example these people, from 20 to 90 years old, from players to managers, from teammates to coaches already say Messi is the best ever. Dennis Wise Albert Lugue Patrick Kluivert Ruud van Nistelrooy Willem van Hanegem Ronald de Boer Josip Simunic Harry Redknapp Juan Antonio Anguela Luis Suarez Miramontes Enrique Orizaola (90 years old) Enrique Dominguez Hugo Sotil Mircea Lucescu Diego Simeone Antonio Cassano Ivan Helguera Domenico Criscito Albert Ferrer Osvaldo Ardiles Bernd Schuster Gary Neville Gary Lineker Joey Barton Miku Ray Hudson John Terry Adriano Galliani Ruud Gullit Graeme Souness Terry Venables Wayne Rooney Tom Huddlestone Arsene Wenger Michael Owen Roy Keane Rudi Voller Jose Luis Chilavert Gerry Armstrong Carlos Bianchi Peter Schmeichel Julio Alberto Gabriel Milito So it's not about the "priviledge of seeing somebody" or "fanboyism" is it? It's about an subjective opinion and ability to objectively argue about it.
Peter Schmeichel actually rates Cristiano Ronaldo higher than Messi and he also thought Javier Hernandez would upstage Messi in UCL final in 2011. lol