Exactly ICED, you will cowardly play semantics on a letter grading, instead of engaging in a discussion on the questions that have been asked. You are pretty good taking on the easier questions. Very smooth. You're struggling mightily on these tougher ones. That sounds eerily similar to Red Bull themselves. As we both know, they choke when the matches get tougher too. If you ever decide that you'd like to take a step toward intellectual inetegrity, I'll be here. Let's discuss. Until then you can continue childishly touting your silly letter grade refutes. Hans responsible or for Reams and Agudelos nat team appearance? Haaaaaa come on. How is that related to Red Bull? You are grasping at straws. Inside you know it. Deep down inside you know, ICED. Be a man and respond or let us just move on.
Ha whoa! Look man I don't know what you want from me, you've made your case and I've even said that I agree with some of it, and I've given you my reasons why I think he did some things well. I don't see how the way I've presented my case is in any way "childish", in fact you've been quite aggressive in this and other threads. Just because I don't repeat my argument every time you go on a tirade doesn't mean I'm stepping away from "intellectual integrity", it just means that you're obviously not going to be happy until I fully agree with you so what's the point? We disagree on a few fundamental aspects to critiquing Backe's time here, namely that you rate the quality of our squads higher than I do based on the inclusion of the DP's. You're entitled to your opinion, but that's all it is, your opinion. And the Ream and Agudelo comment was to address the constant criticism that Backe did nothing to nurture young talent, my point is that when there is actual potential there that he was capable of bringing young players into the professional fold and at a high level. What else specifically do you have against what I've suggested that Backe has done right? The losing big games thing is another thing I agree with and a big reason why I'm glad he's no longer the coach, although I think that really just ties to the issue I specifically listed earlier about not being able to reliable organize the defense. You don't make cup runs if you can't ever keep a clean sheet, plain and simple. That said, I also appreciate that he got us through the regular season with a fantastic home record, is that so wrong? I understand that for you literally nothing matters if you can't win a title, but I see it differently and I'm not going to apologize for it.
Your snarky little demeaning comments are childish. YOU started with those, not me. I try not to be 'agressive' here with anyone unless they throw the first punch (as you did). Try being a little more respectful next time instead of casting stones then refusing to back it up as you did up until this post. Again, that pretty childish. How old are you actually? Only child? And you dont want to repeat you argument everytime I go on a tirade, huh. You seem to repeat your excitment over RB's solid home record ad nauseum. Interesting how you don't balance that out with the rest of the story unless pressed.
Soler gets a B- (loses points for totally botching year 2) Backe gets a C- (He underacheived, but I have seen "F" grades (c.f 1999 and 2009) and that was not an "F" performance) Red Bull Corporate : F - for shoving Rafa down everyone's throats so they can stick his face on their fizzy drink cans and for firing Soler before the season ended while RBNY was still fighting for the playoffs and for making Backe a dead man walking - also not at the end of the season. That said, there is enough talent here that if the roster is not totally blown up (the only two guys who I would want completely gone are Rafa and Miller with Le Toux (showed my nothing) and Tainio (injured too often) not all that far behind). But since Red Bull Corporate is stupid they will. Idiots
And do you really think Backe HELPED Agudelos National team career along? Didn't Juan want to leave because he wasnt getting any real playing time with us? He barely used the guy..
Backe identified him as being ready for the first team and the age of 17 and gave him more playing time (considerably more in many cases) than any other young American prospect received at his age, there was a thread earlier in the season with actual numbers that I can't find at the moment. He was also very outspoken about Agudelo keeping his ego in check and not letting the hype get to his head, which apparently was to no avail as Juan's lazy effort in training is well documented. I think Backe did plenty to set Agudelo's career in the right direction, but at some point you have to hold the player accountable for acting like a professional and working hard to earn his minutes. Agudelo also had the misfortune of wanting to play the exact role that Henry played, which is probably why they made such a horribly ineffective tandem.
Right, by all accounts Juan didnt work hard. I get that agreed. What I dont really get is how Backe helped him? Last year we had Henry and Luke. This year was Henry and Coop. Backe never really sat one of these guys to play Agudelo, did he? Agudelo got garbage time or played when others were hurt. Is that not the case? If it is, is Hans using Agudelo as a last resort really nurturing young talent? For the record, I can careless about nurturing young talent on the A Team. I want to see the BEST talent on the field, young old or middle aged.
Well, isn't that the job of second string players, to fill in when the first string guys are tired or hurt? Giving an 18 year old the spot of second string striker like Backe did should be considered a fantastic opportunity, not one where the player is trapped into only being used as a last resort. Sure, there were some games in 2011 where Backe could have started Agudelo up front instead of Richards, but at that point the Henry-Agudelo tandem was so consistently bad that it would have been crazy of him to try it again.
In 2011 Backe was madly in love with Ballouchy. He would play him all over the field and I remember him starting as a supporting striker for many games which is absurd.. I also remember him starting Ballouchy over Agudelo in that said formation. I don't need to explain how bad Ballouchy was as a SS..
Absolutely, Ballouchy and Miller are the two guys that will stand as proof that Backe had a tendency to play favorites regardless of their form, although to be fair our bench was so bad in 2011 that there weren't many other options and Agudelo wasn't exactly lighting it up either. My point isn't that Juan played every minute he should have, just that Backe gave him more than enough minutes to prove himself especially considering his age.
Our bench was awful that year and we did lose a strength we had the previous year was depth.. We lost those "lunch pale" players who were average at best but served their role, players like Stammler, Tchani, Ubi, Borman,Talley, Wolly, etc, come to mind. We also did get screwed over with the Gold Cup but it's still not an excuse imo(didn't we lose like 6 starters?). I know Agudelo was on the GC roster that year so Ballouchy probably did start a few games there in place but even when he came back I remmeber Ballouchy starting a few matches over Agudelo. Agudelo actually played pretty well for his minutes and he would've been a much better fit at SS due to obvious reasons. As for LB I don't remember who we had exactly as backups but I do know that we had Mendes on the bench that season and he would've been a much better option at LB. Remember once Miller got hurt later in that season Mendes was solid at LB and gave the backline some discipline/organization. But ofc the Wizard starts Miller again and we know how he performed in the playoffs. However, Miller wasn't the public enemy that year and although we all knew he pretty much sucked he wasn't as catastrophic as he was this year. 2011 was just a bizzare and underachieving year. After that hot start to the beginning of the season we just crashed and made bizarre moves..
In you way to defend this piss of Shiite of Backe, you ignore the facts of things, Agudelo like Hertzog has been denied the right to develop, once you postpone game after game they participation they become convinced that they have not it, mentally and physically, destroying they capacity and the elementally ability that they born with, to play......
For me, I think you are way overrating Backe passion developing young talent. I never saw the guy going out of his way to nurture these young guys. On the flip side, I didn't see anything that showed he was against younger players either. This sounds like that silly 'woman' issue in the presidential campaign. Obama loves woman. Romney had notebooks filled with them. Much ado about nothing.
Are you forgetting that he ended our season last year when he hacked Beckham down in the box for a PK that put our chances out of reach?
To be fair first game of the season (or somewhere around then)I believe he sat Cooper to play Agudelo to reward him for working hard in training. Then Agudelo got hurt and Cooper kept scoring goals
Yes, he played him. I am not sure that I have ever said otherwise. Anyway, If you guys see that as proof of Hans as a nurturer of young talent, then that is how you guys see it. Maybe I missed something along the way that you guy caught. Who knows. Hans also sat Cooper for Le Toux. Was ans also a nurturer of french talent?
I meant that was an example of Backe trying to help him get time even though I personally don't think he deserved to play since Cooper had a great preseason. The mistake with the team is that Backe is more of a tactical and defense coach and his assistant coaches also reflect that (Petke a former defender). That probably explains why most of our revelations (Lade, Dax, Ream , Barklage) were on the defensive side of the ball. Agudelo constant complained how restrictive a tactically strict Backe was but most defensive coaches are like that. Hopefully our next coach is a little more offensively minded and free, leaving Petke to compliment him nicely on the defensive side of the ball.
I think you're being a touch overly critical. He gave meaningful time to Ream, Agudelo, Lade, and Meara. All in their first year with the club. He was also unopposed to giving meaningful time to journeymen such as Ballouchy and Keel (right or wrongly so). I don't think the guy had it out for any of the youngsters. I think that he (like every coach) simply had his favorites. "Nurturing young talent" is an strange way to put it anyway. If they were good enough in his opinion he played them. If not, he didn't.
Wait wait, I dont think he had it out for the young players either. That wasnt the point I was making. ICED was saying that seeing young talent through to the National Team was one of Hans's positive traits (please correct me if I am wrong. Iced) . I am simply saying that I didnt see that. I also didnt see him having it out for young players either. Like you, I think that he simply played the guys he wanted to.. Young old or middle aged.
Well...that's a grey area. There are absolutely some coaches who deny chances to young players to develop their national career for the benefit of the club (in fact, Backe did this a few times with Meara when he got called up by Ireland's youth squads). So in terms of Ream and Agudelo I don't ever remember a case (important international game or not) when he denied either of those 2 the chance to play. That is important. As to the level of importance...?
Hans sat Coop early on in the year for Juan. Correct. Are you saying that Hans also believed Cooper was the better player but was trying to bend over backwards to give Agudelo playing time?
Depends on which Backe you trust. At the start of the season the reason for Agudelo's start was that Backe was impressed with his increased effort in training. At the time of the trade for Pearce, the reason for Agudelo's start against Dallas was that Agudelo was whining up a storm and they wanted to give him a chance.
A) Hans played Agudelo because he rated him higher than Kenny Cooper at this time? OR B) Hans realized Coop was the better player BUT went with Agudelo because he wanted to give the younger player playing time in order to develop him?
My understanding of the situation is that Cooper was initially brought in for cover because they didn't know if Rodgers would be back and they didn't know if Agudelo would demand a trade and/or be away on national team duty a lot. As it turned out Rodgers didn't return. However, Agudelo really impressed in preseason and Cooper was still an unknown quantity. Thus Agudelo got the start for the season opener. He was largely ineffective and Cooper came on and immediately scored. I'm not sure what happened just after that. Either Agudelo got injured again or since Cooper couldn't STOP scoring Backe simply went with the hot hand.
I know.. I've hated Miller since the beginning of last season but it didn't take until the start of this year or for last year's postseason to start to see the type of player he is. I remember there was a poster(whose name i won't mention) who thought Miller was a solid LB..