There are only two that I can think of with the f-bomb, but it only takes one spoonfull of sugar in the gas tank to kill the engine. I particularly like the one about being a defecating bird though... I pretty much like all the Ultras stuff, with the exception of the two f-bomb chants... Not that I can't deal with profanity, but rather they seem rather mindless compared to the other work the Ultras do. Seeing that great Tifo directed at "Daddy Merritt" and his flock of sheep made me think "Ha, no body ********s with the Might Ultras", you don't even have to bore me with a chant at that point.
Not speaking for the Ultras, but it seems to me that if everyone in the stands did that -- sang along with the non-profane chants -- it might unavoidably have a salutary impact on the chants. A process of "natural selection" in favor of those that are loudest and most wide-ranging. If everyone sang along with those chants you like, and not with those you don't, over time you would find the less widespread profane chants being cycled out of use. The Ultras have taken control in a vacuum created by the failure of most other Quakes fans to get involved. They sing the songs they prefer, and a few are profane. Yet, as I've mentioned before, at every game, and early on, the Ultras chant, "every body," inviting the entire stadium to join in a non-profane cheer. These have had limited success. If your six-year-old can get involved, there is really no excuse for the rest of us.
That's my favorite, too. I would consider getting it etched on my tombstone, if my ashes aren't strewn on the pitch.
Props to you for taking a pro-active stance on death with your son. In fact, if one was so inclined, they could crusade against this chant too, as they'd rather not deal with explaining death to their little ones quite yet.
Thanks... One of my favorite web sites too. I take it you don't agree with the notion that my poorly chosen metaphor was meant to communicate?
It actually took quite a while, longer than I thought it would, before someone mentioned the issue of freedom of speech. Unfortunately, it doesn't apply, especially is this situation. This is a generational issue, to some degree, but I think it also is an issue of conflicting behavioral standards. Like it or not, there are significant numbers of people who still personally do not use this type of language and they certainly do not encourage it's use by their kids. That said, they understand that for the most part the rest of society these days doesn't see things the same way, so they put up with it, when they have to, if they want to engage in certain activities. Telling people who do not care for your personal choice of words to either deal with it or leave is fine if you are in the privacy of your own home. The stadium is also a private facility (just not yours) and everyone in attendance is there as a guest. I'm pretty sure that limits any single guest's ability to control the access of other guests. I believe it is the right of the facility management to restrict the behavior of all guests. Somehow, I think the parties need to get this worked out so that those who object don't have some of this being shouted directly behind them (which I thought was the purpose of the "family section"). On the other hand, part of the problem is that some have to get off the nonsense that everything is, or has to be about them, and realize that whatever they do, personally or as a group, it doesn't happen in a vacuum. I don't think there is much question that the league wants the supporters groups. The supporter groups make the atmosphere so much better, for those at the stadium and for those who see it on TV. However, organized chants containing profanity cause more than just some issue with parents. The league is faced with negotiating TV contracts. The TV networks, in the past, have faced issues like fines from the FCC for inadvertent obscenities, which were accidentally broadcast during games (NFL). Like it or not, that is likely one of the major issues with MLS and Garber.
Anna asked me one of those questions that I had no answer for the other day. While watching the final LA v. Houston, she asked why we didn't jump when "who's not jumpin?" is being sung. "Because we like LA?" NO! The only answer I could give was, "I don't know. So I guess we're going to have to jump the next time they sing it." It's her, and my favorite. Agreed that the we need to participate more. I usually do, as Ned will attest, but not enough.
As I've mentioned before, the law in California, at least in certain circumstances, recognizes a right to free speech on private property, like a Cupertino shopping center to which the general public is invited. This line of authority arguably might include a private sports stadium in which fans are generally encouraged to unfurl message banners and cheer their team. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pruneyard_Shopping_Center_v._Robins
So we can't swear at the stadiums but its ok on the forum? I wish someone would ban that loser Warmth! https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/sacramento.1714458/page-8#post-26867121
Yes, I am somewhat familiar with the Pruneyard case, as well as a couple of other cases involving people displaying signs and distributing literature on public sidewalks at shopping centers. My understanding has always been that the Constitutional guarantee of free speech generally applies to political speech but it is not quite so clear regarding other forms of speech. I am not a lawyer, so I don't pretend to know the law (in fact, I probably know just enough to get myself in trouble if push came to shove). I think all of the court cases that I can recall involved some sort of political activity. I would be happy to know of a major court ruling upholding the right of a person to randomly use profanity on private property. Granted, maybe a chant could be considered an "artistic" endeavor, so perhaps self expression could be a defense? There is still the issue of a third party, such as a TV network, having the ability to subject the property owner/manager to fines for obscenities, which would seem to matter at some point.
Thanks, interesting read. Now I know who to blame for all those irritating solicitors that are often encountered in front of stores.
I don't have a problem with my children hearing profanity in that setting. They understand where we are and what to expect. They hear it at any other sporting event that we attend. I'm a strong believer that it is my wife's and my duty to parent my children. But if the idiot comish wants to do something about it, it better be across the board. I would expect random fans to be held to the same standards. And players and staff should be fined for it. Otherwise I would view it as censoring a particular subset of the people in the stadium for no other reason than who they are. But we all know that will not happen.
I haven't shepardized (i.e., researched all the annotations of) the Campbell shopping center case (Pruneyard Shopping Center v. Robins), so don't know if any subsequent decisions have specifically involved the use of profanity on private property. However, the U.S. Supreme Court has, in another case emanating from California, upheld the F-bomb as constitutionally-protected speech. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cohen_v._California. ("In his opinion Justice Harlan famously wrote 'one man's vulgarity is another's lyric'.") The significance of the Robins decision is to extend within California free speech rights enunciated by cases such as Cohen to the private property, quasi-public realm, which arguably includes sports arenas.
1. Colin definitely participates. 2. Colin with his kids at the games is creating another example of generational transfer; years from now I think he and his kids will look back fondly on the shared experience, fun, and bond of attending Quakes games and being Quakes fans together. (John Jussen is another guy who is doing that with his kids, and I know that John remembers going to NASL Quakes games when he was a kid). My voice does not hold up well at all at game so I am not always very vocal, but I participate in "Everybody...", "Let's go Earthquakes", "Earth......quakes!" and try to clap as much as I can during other chants from my midfield seats. It is difficult for me to hear and understand all of the words to longer Ultras songs (?) chants from where I sit, and I avoid the chants with profanity that I do hear hoping their nonsupport (as Don suggested) might have some effect (but obviously unsuccessfully). However, if there is a song that might have some crossover appeal to all the fans it could be "Please don't take our Wondo away". If plans were made with other sections of the stands ahead of time (and words provided) for the whole place to stand and serenade Wondo, I think a lot of people would participate and that might lead to other songs at other times. But other songs have to be simple and short, easy to sing and remember.
I know the Ultras created some very professional looking 5x7 glossy song cards last season with the lyrics for four songs, none of which are profane: I have the heart of an Ultra, The blue and the black in my veins. And I will forever support you. I'm Quakes for the rest of my days. San Jose Earthquakes, You are my team, Until the end of time. And when it happens, I'll still be singing, For you up in the sky. My heart is black and blue. It's beating just for you. I'll represent, Until the end. Every day. Every night. I'm thinking of you. Always bleeding black and blue. I would do anything. Whatever it takes. Always representing the Quakes. Ole, ole -- ole San Jose, You're the drug that get's me high. Ole, ole -- ole San Jose, I'm an Ultra until I die! I suspect only a limited quantity of lyric cards were initially produced, and the Ultras would doubtless object to any form of subsidy for mass production, but seems to me MLS would do the larger fan base a favor by funding the production and distribution of non-profane song-sheets stadium-wide on opening day. Encouraging widespread singing with the Ultras would be far more constructive than the commissioner's threats of punishment.
I think the emphasis should be on next season, 2013, so we can do it without cards when the stadium opens. As for simple and fun, my vote would be my favorite, "Who's not jumpin" because even the non-Quakes fans hate LA and can jump in place.
I'm interested to see exactly how much more forbearance MLS can expect from the best, and most forgiving fans in the league. We have already been spit on, shat on, and had our faces rubbed in it by that mook Garber and we've (or at least many of us) come back to support the insultingly crappy expansion team he grudgingly granted us after unceremoniously and totally unjustifiably acceding to the demands of AEG to transfer our championship-quality team to Houston. Calling the Quakes fans out in this way was unnecessary, prejudicial, and just makes him look bad. I'm afraid that if he tries to give us too much more of his "special treatment" he's going to drive a lot of fans away. I wish there was some way to get him this message, but I'm afraid UPS has a firm policy on shipping rotting fish...
Do we really need song sheets for that one? "Who's not jumping, he's from L.A., hey, hey." [Note -- stand and jump while chanting this one]
I agree that Don Garber was impolitic to single out Quakes supporters in his comments about profanity, which is a league-, and professional sports-wide phenomenon. His remarks were offensive in that regard, especially considering that he missed an opportunity earlier in his visit, at the stadium groundbreaking, to congratulate the fanbase for all their efforts in navigating the local political process to make that day feasible. The Ultras came out in force for the various city council meetings and never once did MLS or the Quakes front office ever say, "thank you."
Is it possible to put the words on a crawler on the jumbo-tron? Does anyone remember "follow the bouncing ball?" - (uh-oh, I'm showing my age)! The bouncing ball would, of course, be a soccer ball, or maybe the Earthquakes logo. I think something like that might get the rest of the fans to sing along. And wouldn't it be awesome for the entire stadium to join in?
That's because they hates us, my precious. Not to wax too conspiratorial, but most of Gerber's comments about us are negative and insulting. He gives us crap over our supporters groups, but never says anything about the el-lay fans (how about their tifo with bunches of inflatable Judy dolls in the stands?! Damn funny that!), or the shittle fans who are very foul mouthed and much more numerous, or other fans who are more vulgar than the Quakes fans. We just had a killer season and Supporter's Shield run, but not much mention of our team on MLSsoccer.com. We just got passed over for some end of the season awards that in any sane universe would have accrued to us. (Bernardez should have gotten either defender of the year or new comer of the year, and Gordon was clearly come back player of the year, if not decade.) I'm sure that many other MLS clubs feel hard done by the league too, and in many cases their perception is no doubt warranted. Basically, the league and Gerber in particular, are in love with el-lay, NYJ, and shittle and not much excited about the rest of the league, which is just stark staring crazy for a single entity league. But hey, they don't take my e-mails any more. GO QUAKES!! - Mark
I have very, very low expectations of Don and his relationship with the Quakes. This is the guy who couldn't remember Wee Man's name at the trophy cermony after the 2003 MLS Cup.