Sorry, but wtf are you talking about? As a winger you have to pinch in to score. Ronaldo plays LM almost every game for Real and he scores a ton of goals by pinching in... and everyone in the soccer world considers him a winger. It's how most of the best wingers in the modern game play. Mr Martin explains it perfectly, but honestly it's pretty shocking that he needed to do so.
That's the beauty of a 4-3-3 though - you have 3 CMs to cover for the attacking mids (Dempsey and Donovan) thus reducing their defensive responsibilities. Donovan and Dempsey would both have some defensive responsibility, but not nearly as much as they would have as wingers in a traditional 4-4-2. Also the problem that you present with donovan having to cover weak side is exactly how the best 4-3-3s function. They often leave the long ball open, but close down all of the short passes and put intense pressure on the man with the ball. Watch Barcelona play sometime to see what I mean. You'll often times see the opposing team with a man wide open on the opposite flank screaming for the ball, but he has no chance of getting it because of the intense pressure that Barca applies immediately.
You've got to be consistent with the pressure and organization. Otherwise even with high possession odds are you're getting carved up on the counter as happened to Liverpool's 433 in yesterday's match against Villa. Having a workhorse the other side of Dempsey would be a minimum to get it work against a good team. There's also the issue of the centerbacks.
With the Jan camp roster in hand: ---------------Howard--------- --Cameron---Gonzo--Besler---Fabian--- --------------------Mr"X"------------ -----------Bradley-----Jones------ ----Zusi---------Dempsey------EJ--- 1. Howard still the man 2. Cam rocking it with the best defence in the EPL. No brainer 3. Gonzo - his chance is now 4. Besler - ditto 5. Fabian - the assist machine is a double threat with fellow switch hitter Cam opposite side 6. I just dont think we have our 6 nailed down. Really hard to say who is actually "current best moving fwd" 7. Zusi makes sense against bunkering counter attackers with his defense and shot fm distance 8. Jones is a rock in mid and brings experience of CL play for Schalke. 9. Dempsey can score from top of the box, with his head or at end of crosses. He's our cf. 10. Bradley has proved his worth at Roma. A lock 11. EJ is on a roll. Dont stop now, Eddie. I like this team.
Assuming Holden improves on his current reserve team play then I'd love to see a Bradley, Holden and Williams midfield soon.... ---------------------------Dempsey-------------------------- --E. Johnson--------------------------------------Bedoya-- -----------------Holden--------------Bradley--------------- ---------------------------Williams-------------------------- F. Johnson------Gonzalez------Cameron------Chandler ---------------------------Howard--------------------------- Howard: Still our #1. The Defense: Arguably the future for atleast for the next 4 years. Williams: His slick passing from the deep lying midfield position and his ability to keep the ball moving seamlessly when the team is in possesion in the opponents half is better than anyone else we have available. His defensive side was a bit suspect against Russia but he wasn't exactly getting much help from the rest of the midfield. I think he's proved that he can handle concacaf and work towards bettering himself along the way for the rest of the world. Bradley: Lock. Holden: If the reports of his play in the reserve games are any indication, sounds like there is a good chance of Holden getting his pre-injury form back. IF he was even to come close to that type of form I would love to see Holden and Bradley together in Klinsy's formation. (Have we ever seen this combo in the midfield at all??? I'm not sure.) Bedoya: This guy to me if a forgotten gem. His lack of play after tranferring to Rangers really hurt him but I love his wing play, the type of play that Klinsy's system seems to lack. He runs at defenders, gets to the byline or cuts in with a pretty nice left footed long distance shot, speedy and quick (Type of play that has Eddie Johnson back in the NT). Plus, we can't ignore his play for he NT the last time he suited up in the Golf Cup. Eddie Johnson: Eddie has been doing exactly what a winger should be doing in this formation taking on players streching the field and delivering quality crosses, oh yea and scoring occasionally. Dempsey: Dempsey does it all, in the air on ground, checks in to the midfield when necessary and can hold up play if needed. A man can dream, can't he?
To me EJ >>>>>> Hercules Gomez...I'm just sick and tired of his poor touch...yes he's good at garbage goals but that's really it...I think EJ is a much better athlete too. Positive reports surrounding Holden...even if he's 75% of what he was before he's a USMNT starter plain and simple...he's that good Bedoya? hmm not bad but I'd like to see him or even Donovan come on as a sub...Donovan isn't a starter but bring him or Bedoya on in the 65th as both are extremely fast esp. Bedoya. I think in the future Gatt can excel in this position...you saw the ability vs. Russia however he was still a little hesitant to take on defenders, however, it was only his first USMNT game, so that's to be expected. Still, I think he can be a star down the line
"Assuming Holden improves" isnt current. He isnt currently in the running for a spot on the starting 11 at Honduras, right? Or is he?
Well, our best XI would have Jones at DM, but since that isn't an option. And since Landon isn't playing: ----------------Howard------------- Cherundolo--Cameron--Boca--F. Johnson -----------Jones----Bradley-------- Zusi------------------------------E. Johnson -----------------Dempsey------------ ---------------Gomez---------------- Eventually, I'd hope to see this: --------------Howard------------ Dolo---Cameron---Besler---F. Johnson --------------Jones--------------- ---------Bradley---Holden------- Donovan----Altidore----Dempsey
-----------howard-------- dolo-------cameron-----gonzo-----johnson -----------dwill?---------- ----Bradley--------------------jones-------- ---------dempsey----------EJ--------- -----------Altidore---------------- Herc probably first guy off the bench, maybe zusi . If chandler comes into camp he gets cap tied.
It's an interesting formation with the respect to the pool and the results. With Donovan out indefinitely that wing forward spot opens up a bit with Altidore, Gatt, Shea, and Pontius being possibilities. For the time being, I'd prefer Altidore there. He isn't a true winger per se but isn't really a natural center forward either. In basketball terms he's an isolation player. His best bits come when the ball is played into his feet followed by a move being executed. He has improved this Eredivisie season with his movement off the ball however. But he's still excels in isolation. -----------------herc/boyd --------dempsey-----------altidore ----------jones----------johnson -----------------bradley
This lineup brings up a good option in Johnson in to our attack, assuming you mean Fabian. I think Fabian would do better on the left side but Jones is a natural lefty. Things would be so much better if Jones would man the "6" and Bradley would partner with Fabian but Jones just doesn't want to play that role, too bad. This formation will also put Chandler in the LB position which I also like.
For the next qualifier this is what I'd like -----------------------------Howard --------Dolo-------Cam------Boca-----Johnson --------------------------Jones-------------- ------------Bradley-----------------Zusi----------- ----------------------Dempsey--------------Johnson -----------------------Altidore----------------------- By the summer into the fall, I'd like to see something resembling the following ------------------------------------Howard ------Dolo(TC inform)---Cam------Gonzo/Besler------Johnson --------------------------------Holden*------------------------------ --------------------Zusi-------------------Bradley--------------------- ------Donovan*------------------Dempsey ----------------------------------Altidore The latter formation is of course heavily dependent on whether Holden can capture some semblence of his pre-injury 2011 form and whether Donovan wants to come back. Give Johnson freedom to make the left side his ***** and let Zusi and Donovan give their defense headaches interchanging while also allowing for Dolo to overlap also...
Curious as to how folks think this group compares to the 2010 team? The back line you are basically replacing DeMrit & Onyewu with Cameron & FJ. Assuming LD is back for 2014 & Jozy plays up top, then the guys who played regularly in 2010 that won't be back Torres/Clark/Findley get replaced by some combo of Zusi/DWill/Jones/Holden/EJ.
(edit: and Howard at GK) Without Donovan. If we had Landon he would start over Eddie. Jones could also start over Eddie and we play 3 CMs, and I dont mind Gomez starting over Jozy. Gatt or Besler could earn a spot in the starting XI soon too....at CB Boca and Goodson have been bad lately and Gonzo hasnt played yet so who knows.
You should see something like ur line up against Honduras but Jozy will be dropped in favor of JJ as otherwise we cud easily be overrun in mid.
Two months later my feelings haven't changed much, still not happy to be relying on Kljestan, Boca/Dolo, or any LB other than Johnson (Castillo, Lichaj, etc.)....
The backline will be considerably more accomplished with Castillo, Chandler, Parkhurst, Brooks, Gonzalez, Johnson, Ream, Cameron, and possibly Shea vying for spots. Ditto central midfield though to a lesser degree. A much improved Altidore will be there, though still no real replacement for 2009 version of Charlie Davies.
Thought it was time to revisit the thread with Honduras game behind us. Quoted my last and would make the following changes: 6. We dont have a dedicated 6 , as I feared. Thfore, I drop him and the 433 and pull our cm's back into defence into a 4231 using the extra spot to insert Jozy up top as target forward. 7. I had Zusi there as a bunker buster and defender but new formation will require different skills so I put Donovan there. 11. EJ stays for now, I think Shea off the bench is where I am right now for that position -----------------Howard-------- ---Fab---Gonzo----Besler---Cam-- ------------Bradley----Jones---- ---Dono------Dempsey----EJ--- ----------------Jozy-----------
Going to let my imagination go for just a minute. Gonzo and Besler appear to play very well together and look like they may be the pairing moving forward. Which leaves the question of what to do with Cameron So can you imagine going in to the June qualifiers with a starting 11 like this ----------------Jozy----------------- Fabian-------Demps---------Dono ------------MB------JJ------------- Cam----Besler--Gonzo---Chandler ----------Guzan/Howard----------- I think that would finally be a line up that can defend and attack consistently while also having the ability to possess. It also would give you all kinds of options on the bench and ways to change things up based on how things are going.
-----------Altidore----Lando----------------- -----------------Dempsey--------------------- Fabian------Jones---Bradley-------Chandler/Dolo -----------Besler--Gonzo--Cam--------------- ---------------Guzan/Howard-----------------
The thing bout this is a 3 backline the cb needs to be use to it you don't just put them in the fire. I could live with it for a test in a friendly or for the gold cup but never for qualifying for first time in the system. Also it would have to be chandler over dolo in that system.
No I understand, it is a difficult formation to play if you aren't use to it, but it I think it kinda plays to some of our strengths and it sure does look good, haha. It'd be cool to try it out in a friendly. Good forward thinking wing back play from johnson and chandler, three towering CB's and best of all it allows for LD to play as a fwd and wreak havoc on an opposing backline. No longer would he need to constantly track back to defend.
I really like this lineup, save for the fact that I don't think Jozy will ever give us much up top. Therefore, I'd do this: -----------------Dempsey-------------- EJ-------------Donovan--------Fabian -----------------Jones------------------ ----------------Bradley----------------- Cam----Besler-------Gonzo----Chandler I don't think Donovan can give Jurgen the kind of defensive work he wants on the flanks at this point. I actually think EJ has been useful there. Donovan may work better on the top of this instead of Dempsey, but I'm not sure.
---------------------Altidore ---------------------------Herc ---------Dempsey---------------------fjohnson -------- -----------Jones------Bradley ------ --Castillo ---------------Besler-----Gonzalez-----Cameron ----------------------- -----------------------Guzan a lop-sided 4411 not too different from what featured yesterday. Castillo attacking. Cameron being more conservative. The deep mids shift to cover for Dempsey. Herc providing defensive cover in midfield. Johnson providing attacking width both ways.