Very true, but it helps having the 2 top ranked signees on your team. More commits have come out, so we will know how everything turns out pretty soon i guess. New commits set to join lots of Top 100s
Now that they are posted, it is interesting to compare the final player rating products of ESPN Rise and Top Drawer Soccer for 2012. Overall, there is essentially agreement on who the top players are this year, but there are some significant exceptions. The two lists agree on who 8 of the top 10 players are. And it's really not that far off either, as top 10 for TDS, Bryanne Haeberlin and Maya Theurer, are on the ESPN list at 12 and 16 so it's pretty close. (How many of us would be able to tell the difference between a top 10 player and a top 16 player anyway!) And looking at the exceptions from the other direction, top 10 ESPN players Anny Smith and Lauren Bernard are at #12 and #15 for TDS so it is really all in the family. But after the top tens, it starts to diverge positionally, but not much as a group. 44 names are common to each top 50 list indicating that there is solid agreement at this level too. But positionally within the top 50 listings there is now more spread then just the 6 or 7 positions of the top 10 lists. For instance, Sarah Molina appears at 20 in the ESPN list while she comes in at 47 on TDS and McKensie Karas who is 50 on TDS is 24 on ESPN. But there is remarkable agreement too. Ashley Meier is 22 on TDS and 23 on ESPN, and Gabbi Galanti is 18 on ESPN and 19 on TDS. There are the exceptions outside the top 50 list. Jasmine Paterson, Courtney Raetzman, Jordan Hatler are all solidly in the TDS list at 23, 28, and 35, while ESPN lists them at 61, 62, and 98. But the biggest shocker is Indi Cowie who ESPN lists at #11 who is nowhere to be found on the TDS list. (Not even listed on the last available version of the TDS regional lists, which would put her out of the top 400 more or less.) While there are several explanations as to why this may be, it points at a real divergence of point of view. Cowie is internationally known as one of the top women's free-stylers in the world, has played one summer as part of the Scotland U-17s, and has already enrolled at UNC so surely TDS is aware of her, but she obviously does not fit their protocol. (As a post script, my own rating system does not take into account these top-100 or 150 lists, but it is interesting to see who the "professionals" have chosen.)
I am pretty excited for the Morehead State Women's recruiting class...players from top clubs in Cincinnati, Wisconsin, Texas, even Lori Chalupny's sister! Since 2008 this program has really come a long way and gives the kids up in our area something to get excited about!
I'm pretty excited to see them play too, but surprised to see it posted by someone here, maybe we should start a morehead soccer thread.
If you are excited about Morehead you must be excited about Kentucky's top 10 (according to soccerhunter) ranked class too. It must mean women's soccer is doing well in the state of Kentucky.
The 2012 incoming class at Morehead numbers 14 players. Which means if everyone comes back for the 2012 season they will have 33 on their roster, with only two of them being seniors. So for the 2013's even before they sign there will be 31 players left. As the parent of a prospective collegiate player, I'm curious what this say's about the program. Would it seem that this coach is looking to clean house of some players? And what would this mean for the 2013's. Also, it seems that across the board quite a few programs have not published their list of LOI's and also quite a few have not listed their spring schedules. Is this typical? When are most lists in? I would assume spring schedules should be set by now. Thanks.
Re: Morehead cleaning house...I doubt it. They have always had 28 or so players on the roster. Like most D1 programs, some do not travel and rarely see playing time, there are always 2 or 3 with injuries... so even though it is a smaller D1 program, it is competitive within the squad for playing time. As for starting a thread, it is probably too small of a group with enough interest in just Morehead (even though it is my all time favorite place to take the grandkids! Going there is very "user friendly, soccer AND basketball!) but someone mentioned how highly ranked the UK class is also and maybe a thread that supports all the I 64 corridor might be worthwhile...UK, Louisville, Morehead, even Marshall? Open to any ideas you all might have. I will support any thread you come up with and read it, and sounds like at least a few others will. Sounds like a few of us attend these various schools' games. It is definitely fun to have so many choices and like I have said before on this board, these smaller schools are a better fit for some kids. A student athlete who might get lost at UK or WVU might just love the small classes at a Morehead, and with the soccer improving, it opens up some terrific opportunities for these young women. And the graduate school success of their alumni is very impressive! and ps..Cant resist...fun to see little Murray State in the national basketball rankings and listen to Dick Vitale go on about how "no planes fly here!"
One more Kentucky Soccer recruiting observation...Murray State coach has struggled and has more languages on the field than the United Nations...a disjointed team if one is being kind. This year it is mostly Ky, In, Tn players...only one foreign transfer from Lindsey Wilson. Hope they put something better together. Hatch GK...do you know anything about UK's 2012 GK..she already enrolled. Very big need for them IMHO. I frankly was surprised to see only one for 2012.
nothing much more than what the UK website says about her. She was a member of the region 2 team for a number of years and played for a successful club team with two of the others in the class, I have seen that team play and they are good. She has played at a pretty high level, hopefully that bodes well.
"The 2012 incoming class at Morehead numbers 14 players. Which means if everyone comes back for the 2012 season they will have 33 on their roster, with only two of them being seniors. So for the 2013's even before they sign there will be 31 players left. As the parent of a prospective collegiate player, I'm curious what this say's about the program. Would it seem that this coach is looking to clean house of some players? And what would this mean for the 2013's." Midwest fan: I am the parent of former SEC as well as NAIA players. (Now grown) Make sure your daughter "fits" wherever she goes in her ability and "fits" in the school enviroment, whether it is urban or rural, etc. Even Georgetown College (DIII) has 30+ on their roster. Don't think that because Morehead, or any other DI school is smaller and not as elite that it is less competitive. There are elite players at all these schools, just not as many as at the bigger schools. Austin Peay has 2 Columbian Internationals. Morehead just picked up Lori Chalupny's sister. Their GK who graduated in 2011 was a top Region IV player who has international experience. A recent defender played side by side with WNT Lauren Cheney. These players could play most anywhere and chose their respective schools for various academic, financial, and family reasons. As a parent, I can tell you that DI is not for everyone. Both my daughters played a lot and both are now Doctors. The one who went NAIA had no lesser experience than the decorated SEC player. But she would have been lost at UK. College rosters will vary from 22 to 32+...it is your job to find out why, ask the coaching staff their goals and philosophy, talk to players who don't play much as to what motivates them to remain part of the team, and see where your daughter fits in.
I've been wondering what's going on with the 2012 Transfers situation. In 2011 cbg listed 105 transfers; the year before 88. We're most of the way through April now, and only 30 have made the list for 2012. Were last years in May and June? (I can't remember.) Or are schools simply not announcing transfers this year? Any one have any intelligence on this?
Most students/schools announce their transfers after the current academic session has ended. I know there will be significant changes/transfers as in the past.
I recently overheard that three USC (Southern Cal) recruits were not approved by admissions. Dad was saying players had good GPA's...3.8. Dad said that the Coach said it had never happened before.
Could explain why USC has yet to make their 2012 signing announcement while other Pac12 teams made them in February.
I've been waiting...... ......for some colleges to post their classes. (Among a few other schools, UNC hasn't announced its 2012 class yet. It will happen fairly soon. The reason given is that they are waiting until all of the committed players have jumped through all of the admission department hoops before they announce. This might be especially time consuming for some foreign players, and UNC has at least one coming as far as I can tell.) Also, I just haven't seen as many transfers as I have been expecting. It'd be nice to get the final rankings up with all of these factors taken into account as much as possible. But the bottom line at this point for the 2012 class is that there will not be much change in the pecking order, although there could be a few surprises regarding individual transfers or foreign players. According to cbg's list, 2,467 players have signed up so far for 2012. There are yet 123 players on cbg's 2012 list that aren't yet associated with a college, two of which are listed as having US national youth team experience sometime in their careers. If I can find the time, I'll have to go back and see how may ended up on the 320 D-I teams. (Some of the college teams on cbg's list are not D-I. This has to do with his methodology of identifying the players to track both from lists of national, ODP, tournament, etc teams and also from announcements from clubs and colleges themselves.)
Well this is the time of the year that each college has their women's soccer teams check in on campus and begin training. As with most years this will be very interesting to see where, if any, any transfers have taken place, any surprise internationals, and how each team stacks up. As in the past I would expect the ACC to continue its domination. What surprises can we expect ?
Now that the players are enrolled and practicing, it's time to lay out the final iteration of the 2012 class rankings. And this timing is important as there were big changes only a week before the practices began! The biggest being Lindsey Horan's decision to de-commit from UNC and play professionally in France. With Summer Green coming in later this fall (assuming that she does) the Tarheels will still hold on to the #1 spot, but not by much. The other game changers late in the process were transfers. While the Tarheels about broke about even comparing transfers out and in, there were some big winners elsewhere. BC grabbed a great keeper in national team veteran Alexa Gaul who departed Texas for her senior year. While Texas won't suffer on the keeper front since Angely Kelly hung on to rising national U-20 talent Abby Smith, the Longhorns are counting on their strong freshman class to offset the loss of skilled players Sophie Campise and Nina Pederson to Alabama and Cal respectively helping to bump up the Crimson Tide and Bears' class rankings considerably. USC collected 4 transfers and on balance strengthened their hand (particularly with Caroline Staley from Missouri) even with the loss of Shelby Church to Alabama. Florida State's stock rose even further with the addition of transfer Dria Hampton from Oklahoma to go along with their usual crop of highly talented internationals announced in July. The two-in, two-out transfers at Miami (Fl) are a significant plus for the Hurricanes As Tina Romagnuolo and Jesse Shagg are strong players. Maryland's two transfers will offer a small plus, and Santa Clara won't see any action from Morgan Malborough until next year. Some schools (like Texas) lost a little ground through transfers. (If I'm going to count transfers in, then it's only fair to count transfers out in the same class.) Overall, since I looked at this after signing day in February, the added numbers of players strengthened classes all down the list, which was especially true of the top ten. Notre Dame moved up to #2 by adding a few more strong players while Maryland held its own and Boston College jumped to #4 by adding scoring ace McKenzie Meehan and her sister and then hitting the jackpot with transfer Alexa Gaul. UCLA held on to the #5 slot even with a transfer out, and Kentucky moved up to #6 by continuing to add quality players to its monster class of 15. Stanford dropped to #7 when Hayley Washburn de-committed in favor of Harvard while Florida State moved up 11 positions to #8 by announcing a bunch of great internationals plus a solid transfer. The top ten rounds out with Washinton's superb class keeping the Huskies at #9 and Virginia at #10 after having added Makenzy Doniak. The next 15 (top 25) shuffle a little for the same reasons. No 11 USC just kept adding quality players (and transfers) as did #12 LSU. Texas dropped into a tie for #12 by seeing three solid players transfer out. Santa Clara moved up 5 places to #14 with solid recruiting (even though I'm not counting Malborough who is sitting out this year.) Cal hit the transfer sweeps to move to #15. Duke kept the same class as it had committed in February but fell comparatively to #16 while Harvard got national teamer Hayley Washburn to go with several other solid recruits to jump to #17, and Miami (Fl) found a similar strategy landed them at #18. Oklahoma State, like Duke, fell a few notches to #18 by virtue of standing still while Northwestern added recruits to move up to #19. By accepting transfers, Alabama moved up to #21 in a tie with Arizona State who made a similar move by recruiting two strong German players. Florida, Texas Tech and Wisconsin held on to drop a few positions since February, while West Virginia used a solid transfer to move up to land in a 4-way tie with those static classes at #23. The second 25 (top 50) has a few anomalies to note, but otherwise is the result of simple good recruiting. It is strange to see Penn State with a #28 class, but every team has its off years now and then. Clemson looks to be starting to turn things around (and we'll see more of this next year.) Shocking to see Portland fall out of the top 50, but like Clemson, they'll be back next year. And then there is that strange anomaly of Weber state with a strong class of 14 recruits coming in at #35 -all from the same club team! Once again with all of the disclaimers (this is all for fun and fan interest and you could possibly do better!) The final version of my 2012 class rankings: 1. -10.02 UNC 2. --9.50 Notre Dame 3. --9.08 Maryland 4. --9.00 Boston College 5. -- 8.97 UCLA 6. --8.60 Kentucky 7. --8.53 Stanford 8. --8.45 Florida State 9. --8.35 Washington 10. --8.15 Virginia 11. --8.14 USC 12. --8.92 LSU, Texas 14. --7.67 Santa Clara 15. --7.48 California 16. --7.33 Duke, Harvard 18. --7.30 Miami (Fl) 19. --7.20 Oklahoma State 20. --7.15 Northwestern 21. --7.10 Alabama, Arizona State 23. --6.87 Florida, Texas Tech, West Virginia, Wisconsin 27. --6.83 Va Tech 28. --6.77 Penn State 29. --6.67 Boston U, Princeton, Purdue 32. --6.53 Rutgers 33. --6.33 Oregon 34. --6.30 Vanderbilt 35. --6.20 Arizona, Clemson, Georgia, Illinios, Miami (Oh), Ohio State, Weber State 42. --6.15 Colorado, Creighton 44. --6.10 Auburn, College of Charleston, Michigan State, Mississippi, NCSU 49. --6.05 Akron, Baylor, Georgetown, Oregon State
Didn't know whether to post this in roster size or 2012 recruiting since we are talking transfers also. At least 2 of the best players from last year's WKU class are not listed. Anyone know where they landed? Leslie Chinn, Katrina Ott.
OK Folks. help me out here. Katrina Ott, one of Woodford County's finest, arguably one of the best 2010 recruits out of the State of Kentucky, has been purged from the WKU websites. And no, I am not related, asking who might be lucky enough to get her this year!
Actually almost the entire 2010 class is gone as well as some 2011s. It is hard to see because their names no longer appear anywhere on previous rosters. Do other schools purge their previous year rosters of players who leave? That program has always had high turnover, but this is alarming.
Including this year, Kentucky has recruited 50 players in the last 4 years. I can only find a single transfer out on cbg's spreadsheets in that time (but it is hard to collect transfer data unless a program formally announces it.) Assuming that the roster is skinnied down to about 30-35 players, this means that with the 15 coming in that a total of 15 to 20 players from the previous three classes will have to go. Pretty tough!
I did a little research. Class sizes are getting bigger. As the pool of skilled players is expanding, so are the recruiting class sizes. From what I can tell, prior to 2005 it was extremely rare to see a class of over 10 and most schools were in the 6 to 7 range. I know UNC best, and for decades the average class size was about 7. This held true into the first 4 years of the last decade. From 00 through 03, the average was 6. From 04 through 07 the average was 8.2. From 08 through 11 the average was 8.75. ....Creeping up..... Florida was an "early adopter" of the big class philosophy (and Kentucky and some others close behind.) Florida has had a number of transfers out as to be expected (and their last class size is down.) Other schools ("because we can") have started signing larger classes. The philosophy seems to be trending toward larger numbers to see who might develop nicely and pleasantly surprise. 2012 is a banner year for large class sizes. Defining "10 or over" (including known transfers) as a "large class" there were: 19 schools with classes of 10 21 schools with classes of 11 13 schools with classes of 12 7 schools with classes of 13 (including FSU and UNC) 5 schools with classes of 14 (including Colorado and Maryland) 4 schools with classes of 15 (including Kentucky, Temple, UMKC, and N. Arizona) 2 schools with classes of 16 (La Tech and UNC-G) 1 each schools with classes of 18, 20 and 21 (including USC with 16 frosh and 4 transfers) That's 72 of the 320 D-1 schools or 19%. Will this trend continue? ... or will coaches begin to "see the light" as it might appear that Becky has begun to do at Florida.
Think it's a bad idea. A large part of making a great team is chemistry. With constantly rotating players in and out of the program I would think you start to dilute the probability that you create great chemistry. Also I would think players will start to get wind of those schools that are constantly bringing in large classes, realizing that they may have one or two years tops on a team. Iv'e always been of the opinion that development takes time and that many aren't there yet at 18, or some are at their highest level at that age and will not progress. The coaches must realize that and It's obviously a way for the coaches to compensate for the lack of ability to identify and recruit descent athletes and develop players by casting a bigger net to catch more fish and see what sticks. I think it only hurts the reputation and the nature of what collegiate sport should be about, but as has been said on these boards many times, for the coach and schools it's all about wins and being recognized as being perenially the best. I guess pretty soon we'll start seeing youth doing the same. Oh wait, they already do! At least in our area it's not uncommon for teenage youth teams to carry more players than they are permitted to field for a game, therefore routinely leaving multiple players home because they can only roster 18.
With three players on both the boys and girls side going thru it all at D1 and D2 I've developed a view--it really should be the player that needs to be smart and informed, and also realistic don't you think? And power to them to have this fortitude when they are 16 and 17 to make non-emotional decisions about what is the best for them academically and soccer.
