- Vancouver: if we can ever find a way to put down some grass there...not the day before, but at least 4-5 days in advance and pay for it, then no excuses. - Montreal: we could always schedule a game there, either the Panama game or the Cuba game but have Toronto standing by in case it doesn't work. Like you said, BMO Field is the only operating SSS in the country. We've got 7-9 months to go before the games so we can "play it by ear" as Stephen Hart likes to say. If Saputo's not ready, you change the flights the week or two weeks before and go to BMO. - Moncton: Not sure about the practice facilities, but they can always fly in the day or two before from Toronto or Montreal. Even in Toronto, if the players are gathering at Nottawasaga Inn, they only bus to the hotel in Toronto two days before.
Not sure what the issues would be with Vancouver and Moncton (other than turf and both are more difficult to get to from Europe) but I am not sure about the logistics of selling tickets to a game in Montreal that you can't guarantee will happen and then, on two weeks notice, moving it to Toronto and hoping people will show up!
Sticking up for Toronto Gerry Dobson February 3, 2012 Before talking about Jonathan De Guzman, I have to weigh in on the topic of the Canadian men’s team playing all of its matches in 2012 at BMO Field in Toronto. The usual conspiracy theory is rising up once again; that this is a CSA/Toronto thing. Let me tell you right now: that idea is naive, wrongheaded, and just plain dumb. The simple fact is that coach Stephen Hart and the players want the games played in Toronto, and if that's what they want, that's good enough for me. The Canadian men's team owes Montreal, Edmonton and Vancouver (or Toronto for that matter) nothing. Somehow the idea has grown that Toronto is an awful place to play because home support will not be there and the games should be moved around the country. Blah, blah, blah. That is so much balderdash. Why should the games be moved around the country? The bottom line is to give the team the best chance to qualify. Let's talk about home team support around Canada, because I've been there, and it makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it, and the players can relate these situations over and over again where it was so deflating to step onto the pitch and be greeted by overwhelming away support. And it’s happened everywhere. July 16, 2000. Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton. Holger Osieck and the players were beside themselves with anger when greeted before the game by a steel drum band trackside which was approved by the local organizing committee that day. They thought it would be a good idea to welcome the visitors. That welcome proved fruitful as Trinidad and Tobago beat Canada 2-0 in a critical World Cup qualifier. August 18, 2004. Another huge contingent of away support helped Guatemala to a 2-0 victory over Canada at Swangard Stadium in B.C. I remember chatting after the game with some away supporters draped in Guatemalan flags. They admitted to being born and raised in Canada and yet referred to us as "you guys." September 6, 2008. Honduras beat Canada 2-0 at Saputo Stadium in Montreal where Honduran supporters outnumbered Canadian fans by 2-1. Craig Forrest and I were actually taunted in our broadcast location from Honduran fans below. No doubt they were born and raised in Canada, as well. I was also at Varsity Stadium in Toronto in 1993 when an overwhelmingly pro-Mexican crowd cheered the visitors on to victory before a demoralized Canadian team. I would like to think that was a different era, however. When Canada played Jamaica in their first meaningful qualifier for 2010 at BMO Field, there was plenty of Jamaican support but it was actually a pro-Canadian crowd. Atlantic Canada? Who knows? But Hart is from Halifax and is adamant that the games are played in Toronto. So don't give me that tired old argument about why games should be played in a certain city. I'm sick of it.
I'm exagerrating there, but let's say they find out a month before that it's a no go (worst case scenario). You might not be able to get local youth clubs to come, but the hardcore fans will be there. When it comes to TV commercials, you can buy time in advance and adjust any graphics you need before you send in your video. I don't remember the CSA ever advertising any games more than three weeks before anyways.
Yes....you could do all of that....but why? You have a stadium here...that is ready able willing and removes the prospect of rescheduling/re-locating the match. So, have all 3 in Toronto, package them, sell them as events and move on. It is not a slight on Montreal....it just did not work out this time around.
Psssst... Gerry, check this out: http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2012/ex/bgrd/backgroundfile-44376.pdf http://app.toronto.ca/tmmis/viewAgendaItemHistory.do?item=2012.EX15.11 The TL;DR notes is that the CSA has signed a letter of intent with MLSE that it plays a certain number of games at BMO Field. It was initially set at 6 games, but after recognizing that the CMNT does not play enough home games every year to meet this arrangement, they've set at a minimum of 16K tickets sold. So the arguments about too much travel, too many time zones, the quality of the turf, or feeling at home? All bullshit.
just because an agreement on BMO field was reached, doesn't mean that alternate location concerns aren't valid, it can simply be that the contract wasn't properly thought out, in the sense that 6 national team matches at BMO per year is unrealistic. the reality is: 1) players still don't like playing on turf 2) vancouver creates a traveling ordeal for our european based players, which is most of our team. it turns a non-stop or 1 stop flight into a two or three stop flight which can take 18-20 hours total. professional athletes have ridiculous schedules and pretending that the CSA or other associations don't or shouldn't take that into account is just naive. if travel is such a non-issue, why does new zealand only play a couple games a year? i agree with the person who mentions moncton, or anywhere in the maritimes. that should be the next explored territory.
If you check out Appendix E of the contract, you'll see that the agreement is incentive-ladden. i.e. the more games played at BMO, the more revenues into CSA's coffers. And you know what? I have zero problems with that. The CSA is not the richest sports organization in this country, so they are more than entitled to get the best deals they can get out there. But why not state this publicly? Why make bullshit excuses? Just come out with a public announcement stating, look, we made a deal with BMO, in which the CMNT will be our home turf until 2027, end of story. Instead, we get all this bullshit about timezones, air travel, turf, fan support, etc. And for Gerry to label this as "conspiracy theory" is ****ing insulting. There is a contract right there that proves the special relationship between the CSA and the city of Toronto! My conclusion to the CSA? Don't take us for a bunch of idiots.
well gerry's always been in over his head with covering football, i try and pay as little attention to him as possible i've been curious why sportsnet doesn't pay a legitimate english (or other european) commentator/host/writer to come and host soccer central saturdays with craig and cover champions league, the canadian national team, etc. surely they can offer a luring wage..i mean, sportsnet shells out a lot of money for fringe analysts, yet this is a true full-time thing and we get gerry! the humanity!
You mean Appendix B? I'm sure there are similar agreements that the CSA has with other stadiums or they can negotiate them if they haven't already. Besides, there were two other indoor stadiums where the CSA could've put the women's olympic qualifier but they chose Vancouver. Could it be all about the nickels and dimes? Who knows. But remember in 2010, there were two home games that we played. One was in Toronto and one was in Montreal. They could've played both at BMO if they wanted since TFC was on the road at that time, it would've saved money on travel and they could prop up their revenues. But they didn't. Gerry's always been a good in my books. The guy's been covering soccer and doing as much as he can to promote it even before we won our Gold Cup in 2000. Is he over the top? To soccer fans like us, maybe. But to casual TV channel flippers, you gotta do something to get people excited. No one complains when Ray Hudson does his usual living and dying on every play as a commentator so I don't see what the problem is.
Yes, Appendix B, sorry about the typo. If you're aware of them, please present them or admit that it's conjecture. As for the terms of the agreement, remember that initially it was specified that the CSA must play 6 games a year at BMO Field - and outside of the WCQ, the CMNT does not even play that often on a yearly basis. I reject the notion that it has such agreements with other stadiums, such as Saputo, BC Place, or Commonwealth. I suppose, but the more I listen/read Gerry, the more I feel that his knowledge of soccer is limited to English and Canadian soccer. His knowledge of other countries appear woeful to me. The same is true for Craig Forrest. I don't deny his knowledge of the game, at least as a GK, but I remember during an Arsenal-Marseille CL broadcasting last fall when he stated that Arsene Wenger is the greatest French contribution to the game of football. I just had to laugh out loud at the utter ignorance behind such a statement. I also get really annoyed when those two are commenting live games, and they start denigrating either the referees or the opposing team. I find that they can go overboard with their derision.
I don't have any issue with the games all in Toronto my issue is if say down the road they spread the games around i fear that some in Toronto would cry foul i hope i am wrong but that's the feeling i get.
Totally agree. Nothing wrong with Gerry except for his recent blog concerning Toronto where he is full of poop. I, for one, don't want to hear the stereotypical English announcer (how many times can you use the word "clinical" as a descriptive) or adding extra syllables with the word "pressurizing" (use the word pressuring) Sad to say I heard Gerry say it the other night. Even worse is that gawdawful Latin gollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll call. Thank heavens he doesn't do that. Gerry has learned from his mistakes as well. He once miscalled a goal because of a bad viewing angle (ball hit the side of the net). He now waits a split second to confirm it is actually in the net. He also doesn't call a game over before it is finished, something Craig does sometimes and should know better. I believe it was against Ecuador with Bobby L (my memory could be wrong) where Canada was ahead in the final minutes and Duzzi and Dobby called it over. Ecuador scored (twice?) and later won or tied (IIRC) Gerry never made that mistake again and is cautious until the end. I don't know why a commentator would risk looking stupid in case a team made a comeback. Are you listening Craig?
I'd rather they have a knowledge of Canadian soccer than someone like the condescending Cathal Kelly who doesn't. I find them very fair when dealing with the opposition and referees and in Concacaf that takes a lot (to be fair) with all the shenanigans. I normally can't stand condescending "auld country" writers and commentators but I do like Nigel Reed. He has become a citizen and has immersed himself in the Canadian culture and doesn't give the "auld country" is better approach. He uses normal Canadian language (mostly soccer instead of football) and I appreciate his effort in integrating in our culture.
Dobson and Forrest are still too English-centric though. They seem to believe that the world's best players and teams are in the EPL. The case in point, at least in regards to Forrest, was his statement that Wenger is France's greatest contributor to football. How can someone calling himself an expert in the sport even think that.
Sorry to say this, but as a CMNT fan going back nearly 40 years, this latest crop of underachieving prima donnas haven't earned the right to call the shots about where they play. The CSA allowed them to choose where they wanted to play the last time and they wanted to play on the turf in Montreal (Honduras), result epic fail. Since the Olympics, Vancouver seems to have a love affair for things Canadian but the players don't want to play there because of a couple hours of extra flying time and the artificial turf (the same conditions for both teams) Ironically, we played one of our best qualifiers in Costa Rica on FieldTurf during another failed WCQ campaign. Moncton is a two hour drive from Halifax, Nottawasaga Inn, is what, an hour and a half from BMO? Nottawasaga Inn has better training facilities than Moncton? For God sakes, the Moncton stadium is on a university campus, they don't have proper training facilities? Hell, the NT once trained in a public park in BC. Moncton's stadium is also turf which the players should like. While I give the Toronto hardcore fans credit for showing, in a market of 5 million people Toronto can't fill half the seats of a 21,000 seat stadium, while I venture to say tiny Moncton pop 120,000 could sell out the same size stadium. But they may not get the chance to prove it. Winnipeg (which would have great support) will have a beautiful new stadium in six months but it will have artificial turf so they won't want to play there either. I don't know why these new stadiums in Canada even bother to consult FIFA or the CSA about FIFA approved artificial surfaces if the NT whines that they don't want to play there. These whiners just want to play in T.O because for many it's home and they can party after the games, like the last WCQ. Sorry for that sarcastic last parting shot. The last I heard (from Josh Simpson) was that there was a new resolve and the players were just going to shut up and play (no excuses). I wish they would.
Well, he played in the Premier League and you and I didn't so I guess that gives him the right, though he many not be right
I might be but why i get this sense is some fans in Toronto wanted the womens world cup moved so Toronto could host some games.
What? I don't understand... You're saying that playing in the EPL gives him the right to call himself an expert while displaying complete ignorance?
I am speculating here but this is how I look at it: Without the CSA's committment to playing games in Toronto, there wouldn't be a stadium. They saw Toronto as a lucrative market, so they agreed to the original deal to play six games. However, even with the deal, they still decided not to play exclusively in Toronto. In fact, for the WCQ for South Africa, three of the four games were not played in Toronto but elsewhere in stadiums that ironically enough, had grass. With the new deal that only requires the CSA to sell 16,000, IMO it allows for greater flexibility. While there might not be an existing contract with BC Place, Saputo or the Moncton Stadium, this gives the CSA room to negotiate one or make deals on a game by game basis. For example, if we were ever able to land an opponent like Germany we could leverage a better deal elsewhere. But if it's a country like (no offense) Panama, there's probably not going to be a lot of bids from other cities to host it so Toronto provides a nice fall back. But that's all assuming that the CSA is going for money over what the players and fans want. Peter Montopoli says in this interview that they're looking to host at least two CWNT games this year. He also went out of his way to say those games probably won't be in Toronto which could mean several things 1) he knows the annoncement about the men's games would piss people off 2) they're not gonna milk the deal with Toronto for more money even though they will likely achieve Tier 3 or of course 3) even if the women want the same luxuries as the men in Toronto, the CSA still won't do it which shows maybe they do have balls beyond governance reform. Oh and don't get me started about Cathal Kelly. I still have no idea whether or not he even likes sports.
that is an entirely unfair, misleading statement. BMO field was more than half full for all the recent qualifying games, which i might remind you, featured opposition nobody really wanted to see. there will obviously be more people next round, and the CSA ticket promotions with youth soccer clubs is working because there's no way they get more than 10,000 last round without it. RE: dobson. the thing with gerry is he just seems like a fan, which makes him boring and pedantic to listen to. isn't he a tv host converted into this role? it sounds like it. he lacks technical and strategical knowledge, which doesn't often surface as an issue since that's typically where the analyst commentator interjects, but sometimes when he does try and offer something in that vain, it's either a poor assessment, a vague generalization, or simply doesn't make much sense. and i know i'm not alone because sometimes craig has no idea how to respond to some of the things he says. he also has this REALLY annoying trait of repeating or partially re-wording a good point by craig RIGHT after craig says it himself. happened multiple times at the recent women's CONCACAF olympic qualifying.
The biggest fail of that match was the lack of support from Montrealer's for Canada's national team. AFAIC, they lost the honour of hosting any matches this time around.
Totally agree, but until Toronto starts to get even close to a sellout, Vancouver, Moncton, St John's, Edmonton and Winnipeg should be given a chance. Another poster said Toronto will turn out for big games and not St Kitts and the like. Well, give the Atlantic provinces a chance and they'll turn out for the St Kitts and the like teams. If not, they had their chance. Toronto has been gifted all of this, by default, for not coming close to selling out and nobody else being given a chance, save Montreal, who failed.
oh and back to the brothers thing, if JDG2 ends up playing for canada, it's possible that at some point over the next few years, (though unlikely), we could see TWO sets of brothers in the starting 11: julian, jonathan, issey, and paris. HELL, HOILETT HAS A BROTHER.