Pre-match: Brazil vs Argentina, 11/17/2010, Doha, Qatar

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Century's Best, Oct 12, 2010.

  1. celito

    celito Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    He was absolute garbage today against Madrid.
     
  2. berloha

    berloha Member

    Nov 10, 2007
    Club:
    TSG 1899 Hoffenheim
    I'd like to know what Ronaldinho's plan were today ? No way that he is Selecao material, in this form he would only waste a spot for a hungry, willing younger player...

    My god, was that bad against Real Madrid. I thought only Slowdorf was more annoying. But he isn't South American. Pato with an anonymous performance.


    Marcelo did not impress me either, what he brings for the attack is on the level of Bastos.
     
  3. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England

    Zagalo (I still spell it with one l'!) said recently (ish) that he - Ron G - had played only one good game for the Selecao (I can't remember which game he was talking about). Harsh but he does have a point. Think: when he has played well in the yellow? I can't think of many games - and he has played over 80 for Brazil.
     
  4. berloha

    berloha Member

    Nov 10, 2007
    Club:
    TSG 1899 Hoffenheim
    I dunno why R80 Gaucho is still on the list ? It is such a waste of time to invest anymore time in 'scouting' him. Mano better watches younger players who still have hunger to win titles.
     
  5. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    Why did we waste a perfect good callup spot for Ronaldinho? Our offense under Man has been fluid and mobile and Ronaldinho is the complete opposite of that.
     
  6. Catracho_Azul

    Catracho_Azul Member+

    Jun 16, 2008
    New Orleans
    Club:
    Corinthians Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Honduras
    Okay so I got what I needed to know from these Shakhtar kids... none of them are remotely ready to face a formidable defense. Playing Arsenal is much more different than playing Dynamo Kiev...
     
  7. Furnaccio

    Furnaccio Member+

    Feb 19, 2008
    New York, NY
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Colombia
    out of all of them - i think douglas costa could do well as a winger for the NT in due time.

    otherwise - i agree, i was hoping for a better game out of donetsk....i still think they can go to the knockout round of the CL. Partizan is basically done and braga will need to pull off a miracle to get through.
     
  8. Albiceleste2010

    Albiceleste2010 Member+

    Watford
    Argentina
    Jun 5, 2010
    Watford
    Club:
    Watford FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina

    Now now. ;) Probably Batista because he has the mafioso Grondona's backing but it could still be Sabella who is Bilardo's favourite.

    The shape our defence is in if Heinze and Dimi plays those Shaktar kids would have no problem at all. :(
     
  9. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England

    We have not yet - the squad has not been named! All will be revealed circa 2nd November.
     
  10. arun10

    arun10 Member

    May 31, 2005
    Maicon for Alaves and J.Cesar for Victor....
    Doesn't Brazil have better players than Ramires/Lucas for holding midfielder spot....? Whatever be the club form, Lucas was solid for NT in the past few games.But Ramires's form for country as well as club is mediocre at present.
    I would like to see Melo at Ramires spot..judging by the club form he has improved a lot from last year...
     
  11. Bakaman

    Bakaman Member

    May 8, 2008
    São Paulo, Brazil
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Right now I would prefer Hernanes or Elias instead of Ramires to be honest, he is not in top form right now. However, he brings a lot of energy and movement to our midfield.

    -----------------------Julio Cesar--------------------
    Maicon/Alves---Thiago Silva----David Luiz--André S.--
    -----------------------Lucas-------------------------
    ---------------Hernanes-----------------------------
    --------------------------Ganso---------------------
    ---Neymar------------------------------Robinho/Nilmar
    ---------------------Pato-----------------------------

    That would be our best formation IMO, if Ganso wasn't injured :(
     
  12. arun10

    arun10 Member

    May 31, 2005
    This looks like the strongest eleven Brazil can feild at present ...It all depends upon whether Ganso will be the same player when he comes back..
     
  13. brasil_forever

    Jun 8, 2006
    Ronaldinho is still the best passer in the game. his vision is unsurpassed also. if we are talking about forms a lot players do not deserve to be part of the team. robinho lucas. and why are you guys asking for maicon. his form is horrible. if it was not for ronaldinho in 02 Brazil would have never won so don't talk about he never played good for brazil. kaka in the other hand never do anything good.i think ronaldinho will fit well in manos system. bastos should never come near the team. we dnt need lucio and juan andre santos is doing fine so is lucas and ramirez.
     
  14. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    @ brasil_forever

    The thing with Ronaldinho is you really don't know what your getting with him. One game he is back to his brilliant self and then the next 5 he back to his lazy static self. So, why bother bringing him back? So, he can send in diagonal crosses all day.

    Not only is he in horrible form, his overall international career can be label as a flop, his current style of play would be a determent to the team and it predictable.
     
  15. leonidas

    leonidas Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    May 25, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    well flop is a bit much but he was amazing from 2001-2005. i would say overrated is the best way bc a 4 year good stretch on the national team is decent.

    but i too don't want to see him on the team. let's move forward. the only players from the previous generation who are worth bringing on are those who are still at their best. right now, that's maicon and julio cesar.

    even guys like fabiano have sort of fallen a lot.
     
  16. leonidas

    leonidas Moderator
    Staff Member

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    May 25, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    honestly, i would dump lucas. i know he's done decently for the national team but liverpool is just a mess right now. i would rather have sandro, felipe melo, or wesley to be honest -- although wesley is more in the hernanes/ramires position.
     
  17. berloha

    berloha Member

    Nov 10, 2007
    Club:
    TSG 1899 Hoffenheim
    To be fair, Lucas under Mano was better than Ramires under Mano in the last games. I think both will play and will be - for now - the best option.

    For the future Mano should test Jucilei/Luiz Gustavo and Sandro more.
     
  18. brasil_forever

    Jun 8, 2006
    lucas isnt doing decently is doing very good. thiago silva alves lucas andre santos robinho are starters i think. the fact is we don't have any body better than ronaldinho nobody in the world has his vision. if we are talking about form, robinho should never be in the team. maicon style doesnt fit mano system. the thing about ronaldinho is very inconsistent but i think for the copa america we can benefit from his skills
     
  19. Catracho_Azul

    Catracho_Azul Member+

    Jun 16, 2008
    New Orleans
    Club:
    Corinthians Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Honduras
    I doubt Luiz Gustavo will be in Mano's plans. nobody in Brazil knows about him.
     
  20. Catracho_Azul

    Catracho_Azul Member+

    Jun 16, 2008
    New Orleans
    Club:
    Corinthians Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Honduras
    what are you talking about???

    Your describing a Ronaldinho of past. If your talking about a current Ronaldinho..then what biest describes him is Sluggish runner, doesn't track back and cross after cross...ofcourse your passing is gonna look great if you attempt "Thousands" of passes each game.

    with all due respect...he's gone. Ganso is the architect when it comes to passing..no need for Dinho.
     
  21. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    We have got to stop picking players solely on the basis of their name, only performance counts. Irrespective of age what people have done in the past/what they have not done, those who deserve to play play.
     
  22. brasil_forever

    Jun 8, 2006
    Ronaldinho never tracked back not every body should track back. obviously you havent seen ronaldinho played lately. his vision is still outstanding. i only saw ganso 3 times he didn't impress me. so i can't really talk about him
     
  23. Denilson70

    Denilson70 Member

    May 29, 2001
    England
    I have seen enough of Ronaldinho to know that Dunga gave him every chance to prove himself but he was a mere shadow of what he was. If Mano names him then that is his choice but does he deseve it? I heard he was distinctly ordinary against Real the other night. Vision? Do not make me laugh - he spent 3 years in the Brazil team circa 2006 passing it square!
     
  24. Bakaman

    Bakaman Member

    May 8, 2008
    São Paulo, Brazil
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Enjoy! (WOOHO long post FTW, please bear with me :eek:)

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6cmplfTuus"]YouTube - Paulo Henrique "Ganso"- O Maestro da Vila[/ame]


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xznyBqjVvZo"]YouTube - Ganso toca por cobertura e acerta o travessão, André, no rebote, perde, aos 46 do 1 tempo[/ame]



    This one has a few repeated plays from the first one, but has a lot more assists made by him so it's worth it. The music is horrible tho, unfortunately:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcakaQc2GNk"]YouTube - Paulo Henrique Lima - "Ganso"[/ame]


    And if you don't believe that it's possible to rate a player out of highlights, and I sorta agree with that, here are two vids of two of our most important matches in the year, the Paulistão finals, with every touch that Ganso had during those games:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5j_w_1ALFpo"]YouTube - Paulo Henrique |Ganso| vs Santo Andre 2010 Campeonato Paulistão By Zouzinho[/ame]

    (just a reminder: since we won the first game 3-2, if the second leg ended 3-2 for Santo André we would still win the trophy... 30 minutes to end the game and the score was exactly 3-2 for Santo André ( one more goal and we would lose everything), and 3 of our players were sent off, so the responsability was all on Ganso's shoulders, so much that he reffused to get subbed)

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0AiUOHzvPk"]YouTube - Paulo Henrique |Ganso| vs Santo Andre 2nd leg 2010 Campeonato Paulistão Final By Zouzinho[/ame]

    Now my opinion, as a man that watches every match of Santos and Milan that he can:

    Ronaldinho's passing is very good, if he was called he would be our best crosser no doubt, but in our current formation, Ganso > Ronaldinho, simply because he plays better in the center. Ronaldinho had one very good game in Serie A in this position , but the next one vs Real Madrid he was atrocious, so I'm not convinced , I need to watch more of him playing in the center. Ganso played well 95% of the time he played there.

    Also, like it was already said, Ronaldinho doesn't track back, while Ganso does (and extremely well might I say, I bet he could play a Pirlo position very well, it would be a waste because he wouldn't get much closer to the goal but he would do well IMO). To aid that , we could try 4-2-2-2 with him up front with Pato, so his lack of defensive work wouldn't be felt much... But then he would probably park in the left position , like he has been doing for two seasons, and that :

    1) Makes it easier to mark him
    2) isolates the CF, in this case Pato, in the middle of a sea of Central defenders and Defensive midfielders.

    So I agree, Ronaldinho is lazy, not only because of lack of defensive work from him, but also for lack of movement to avoid being marked. This was crystal clear against Real Madrid, he was on Khedira's pocket during all the game.


    Conclusion: If Mano wants to test Ronaldinho right now, I have no objections, maybe he could surprise us who knows... But when Ganso comes back, he is the starter, no questions asked.
     
  25. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    This is what I loved about Dunga. No matter how big of a star the players was if they did not perform; they were not called up. If you are not going to play well for the shirt but play well for your club then GTFO. I hope Mano adopts a similar motto.
     

Share This Page