best pair of CB ever

Discussion in 'Players & Legends' started by tony-soprano37, Jan 27, 2013.

  1. tony-soprano37

    tony-soprano37 Member

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    inspired by a discussion between 2 others here i decided to make this thread.

    for me its easy. scirea and gentile.
    they completed eachother perfectly. they won quit some trhophies together (also that should be taken in account).
    and each of them in his own field of play is considered top 5 all time.

    maybe some other contenders can be maybe inter milans picchi and guarneri or ajax vasovic and hullshof or liverpool's hansen and lawrenson. ac milans baresi and costacurta ??
    beckenbauer and schwarzenbeck ? real madrids hierro and sanchis ??


  2. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    Even though they played together, but NOT as a pair of CB.
    Gentile was a fullback at Juve, while Scirea and Brio were a pair.
  3. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [Is this only club level or do NT "CD" pairings count as well?]
  4. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    Well only a few games in 82 that Gentile LOOKED "like" a CB (for man marking Zico, Maradona )
    But most of time Italy NT in early 80s under Baearzot were playing 4 3 2 1

    ------------------------------- Zoff -------------------------------
    ----------------- Scirea (libero) -------------------------------
    Gentile-------------------------- Collovati ------------ Cabrini
    ------------------------ Tardelli --------------------------------------
    -------- Antogoni -----------------Oriali ------------------
    B.Conti ---------------------------------Graziani ---------
    ------------------ P Rossi ---------------------------------


  5. tony-soprano37

    tony-soprano37 Member

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    i stated that already but for italy they where a centre pair
  6. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    Since international level "CD" pairings as in as well: Neil Franklin and Billy Wright for England keep getting more and more under-appreciated as time marches onward. AFAIK I already did a "scouting report" and posted some links about them over at XT.org. I'll try to post a link to the thread(s) to save myself some work...
  7. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

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    Interesting that some Brazilian partnerships had good goals conceded records at World Cups (Aldair and Marcio Santos, Edinho and Julio Cesar). Of course, the midfield and forwards keeping the ball away from the opposition would be a help, just as it is for Spain currently.
  8. babaorum

    babaorum Member

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    Is it according to you the best English CB pair ?
    What do you think about the Bobby Moore and Jacky Charlton one ?
  9. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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  10. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    I also had drawn Italy NT formation in 80-82 and Gentile was 90% used as RB while Collovati and Scirea as CB
  11. babaorum

    babaorum Member

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    Yes that's what I was trying to ask sorry for the misunderstanding :)
  12. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [No worries then, mate...

    My original statement was more along the lines of Franklin & Wtight being under-appreciated as England central defenders; but they would be up there for the top/most effective England "CD" tandem of A-T...

    I take it that YDK much about Franklin (no insult implied or intended)? Jack Charlton would probably one of the first to admit this: the gulf in class between Charlton and Franklin as a ("W-M"-type) centre-half is probably about that between Nicky Barmby and Didi or Johnny Haynes as a (potential) midfield play-maker IMHO.]
  13. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    Who would be the best partner with Bobby Moore ? or any?
  14. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [Are asking about the reality of his own England career or in a "time travelling" England A-T XI/squad?]
  15. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    Maybe both secenarios just for fun
  16. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [Moore's actual England career:

    Brian Labone of Everton only missed the '66 World Cup Finals because he was getting married (imagine if your future wife cost you a WC winners medal)...

    Peter Swan of Sheff. Wed. would've almost certainly had a MUCH longer England career at centre-half if it wasn't for the "scandal"...

    Ron Flowers of Wolves would've been an intriguing "CD" pairing if it had been utilised more often: it was done in the reverse best order (IMO) w/Moore wearing the No.5 shirt and Flowers playing-off of him as the "deep-lyer"/supporting central defender.

    Liverpool legend Emyln Hughes would've been a good choice to wear the No.5 shirt w/Moore later in Moore's England representative career IMO...]
  17. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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  18. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    " Ron Flowers, For Wolves and England (1962)
    [COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000]During the latter part of the 1959-60 season we met Yugoslavia at Wembley. During the course of this international I started out playing my normal attacking game. Then, with the pattern of play produced by the Yugoslav inside-forwards, I quite unwittingly found myself moving into the centre of the field. Without realizing how it may have looked from the grandstands, [B]I was a`cover' to our centre-half[/B] Peter Swan, and playing a game which did not altogether appeal to a half-back who enjoys going forward and having a crack at goal.[/COLOR][/COLOR]

    [COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#8080ff][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#8080ff][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#ff0000][COLOR=#000000][COLOR=#ff0000][SIZE=2][COLOR=#000000]A few days later, shortly before England met Spain in Madrid, Mr. Walter Winterbottom, the England manager, asked me if I'd stay around and cover the middle as I had done against Yugoslavia.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR]
    The Spanish forward line, brilliantly led by Di Stefano, gave my colleagues and me a hectic afternoon in defence, and I obeyed the instructions of Winterbottom. I'll admit the idea of a defensive role did not appeal to me. All the time I wanted to nip forward and join in an attack. But I won the battle with myself. I stayed in defence, and although we lost 3-0, Mr. Winterbottom seemed to be quite happy and we decided to continue this experiment when we played Hungary a few days later in Budapest.
    It was in this match that Bobby Robson displaced Ronnie Clayton at right-half-back, the first time Bobby had in fact played in this position for England, and quite a moment for us all, although few realized the part Robson was in future to play in our 4-2-4 system.
    It would be pleasant to be able to write that we clicked in defence, but this was not the case. England were beaten 2-0 by the Hungarians, and I personally hadn't much idea what our defensive system really set out to try to achieve. I never felt in the game and because of my unhappiness I began to lose confidence; and I'm telling the truth when I reveal at this time I began to wish that I was not being included in the England team."



    [Flowers is talking about playing as the "deep-lying"-type of W-H in the bolded text: he just calls it playing "cover" for Peter Swan at centre-half. Which was another common way to refer to the same role at the time.

    The quoted text is from the Spartacus profile that I posted on Flowers in No.17.]
  19. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [W/Moore in an England A-T XI/squad/set-up:

    Franklin would be tall enough and a DOMINANT aerial defender to play alongside/partner w/Moore. The only real problem that I could see is that Franklin and Moore might struggle over who whould get to be the "gambler" in passing and starting attacking sequences from the back IMO.

    The main "knock" on a potential Moore and Billy Wright "CD" pairing is that supposedly Wright wasn't tall enough to be an effective aerial "stopper" alongside Moore. Wright was an excellent aerial defender and he was battle-tested week-in & week-out against PROPER "aerial assault" No.9s/strikers at both club and international level: John Charles, Trevor Ford of Wales, Tommy Lawton, Nat Lofthouse, Stan Mortensen & the like. Wright was also a very under-appreciated controller and distributor of the ball as well: his more conservative short- & mid-range passing approach should also fit nicely w/Moore's more "swashbuckling" attacking style from the back.]
  20. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    interesting ... thanks
    RoyOfTheRovers repped this.
  21. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    Often more remembered as a great club manager; but often forgotten as a FANTASTIC both physical and ball-playing centre-half (as well as a highly effective team captain at both club and internationl level), Stan Cullis of Wolves and England:



    http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/WOLVcullis.htm



    http://www.thewolvessite.co.uk/scullis.htm



    http://www.friendsreunited.com/stan-cullis-wolves-1964/Memory/7d14ab99-de13-4fdb-86d3-a00c008b4b1c



    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/1324533/Stan-Cullis.html



    http://www.soccerhistory.org.uk/StanCullis.htm
    JamesBH11 repped this.
  22. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

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    good links Roy
    RoyOfTheRovers repped this.
  23. RoyOfTheRovers

    RoyOfTheRovers Member

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    [Thank you once again for the kind words, mate. :thumbsup:!!]

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