Ballon d'Or 2012 Thread...

Says a Ronaldo-hater who claimed to be done with conversations comparing the two.

 

The adornment for Messi in 2010 was nowhere near the level it has reached today. There was a journalist on Skysports saying you have to feel sorry for Ronaldo for having more goals than games, breaking records and becoming an excellent provider and team player while at Madrid but he's constantly overshadowed by Messi. I tend to think this is the thinking of the majority. That no matter what Ronaldo achieves, Messi is just that little bit better.

 

I never said Ronaldo couldn't lead Portugal deep into the tournament. I said doing so while being top scorer would be unlikely considering the competition. I believe it's possible though. A lot depends upon how the rest of the team performs, or else I'm afraid Ronaldo could simply be marked out of the matches.

I paraphrased, what you said is that you're done caring what people think about Messi anymore. You said you are just going to enjoy having the privilege to watch him play. This contradicts your coming in here saying the Messi-haters have escaped the clinic. Seems you still care just a lil bit.

Acknowledging that he has done something useful every once in a while doesn't disqualify your hater status. I've given Messi his due before as well.


*I agree with the rest of your post.

 

Correction, the most meaningless stat is the almighty "successful dribbles" that is from you Messi fanboi's.

The press were the ones talking about Ronaldo having the away goals record.

 

Here's a few articles that mention it.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/apr/12/cristiano-ronaldo-atletico-real-madrid

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/soccer/04/11/ronaldo.madrid.ap/index.html

http://www.goal.com/en-ie/news/3922...stiano-ronaldo-losing-is-not-in-my-vocabulary

 

No, they say he became the first player in history to score 20 away goals which is the accomplishment. Other players have "scored a lot of away goals." He has the record. 23 now I believe.

I can't speak for what Celito meant by "consistency" but an awful lot of creedence is given to playing away from home in hostile environements. Nobody gave Madrid a chance at Camp Nou. Most teams play much better at home and consistently scoring on the road says a player is just as good away from home as they are at their own stadium with a friendly atmosphere and familiar conditions. You never imagined Chelsea was going to go to the Camp Nou and knock out Barca right? Away goals is given priority in tournaments for a reason.

In theory, yes you're right. All of those goals could have been against relegation sides in 8-0 blow outs but we both know better.

Football has become too reliant upon stats these days for me anyways ever since Messi vs Ronaldo came along. Or at least since people started comparing Messi to Pele and Maradona when none of these things were even recorded. It's like following baseball anymore. Now people are tracking successful dribbles, key passes, shots per goal, away goals, consecutive games with a goal, most hat-tricks per season etc. etc. etc. I think most of this stuff is just over-blown non-sense that doesn't add up to much difference in the final result.

 

lol. Nice semantics.... It says you can't allow people to disagree that Messi is the bestus. You saw a countering argument and had to respond that we have "escaped the clinic" for not believing Messi is the greatest. We're even crazy for thinking so according to you.

I feel the same way about Messi.When I feel he deserves credit I give it. "Every once in a while" he does something that can't be directly tied to playing for Barcelona and I credit him for that. Every goal and assist doesn't require a breakdown of his genius as you'll like to portray. I do agree though that Ronaldo only beats Barcelona personally with him scoring the goal to win a trophy "every once in a while." Good analysis Yonko.

Yes, amazingly, you took off your Barca boxers for a minute and proceeded to type out a sequence of words that I happened to agree with.

 

Since you want to chime in with your bullshit I'll respond.

How do you know that this isn't the catalyst for "three conscecutive liga's" to come? His first year was with a completely different team and a different manager. His second season was the first year playing with many new players and Mourinho. It takes time to develop chemistry and understanding. Or your "critical thinking" doesn't allow for time for a team to develop? Messi has been with the same ole players minus a few fill-ins here and there playing in the same ole system year after year. After having two seasons of playing with the same players Ronaldo has outplayed Messi this year head to head scoring in the last four clasicos while Messi has not. Madrid even dominated Barcelona a few games this year which was unthought of being able to happen. This could very well be the beginning of a new era.

Ronaldo has won Madrid a trophy that they hadn't won in 20 years and the league which they hadn't won in 4 both coming from goals he scored against Barcelona which is considered the greatest team ever. Was he supposed to come in and immediately dethrone Barca of every trophy? All things in due time. Remember not long ago everyone was saying he had a curse and couldn't score against Barca. Let alone have 6 in the last 9 and win the league with his goal at the Camp Nou while Messi was invisible.

Furthermore, If Messi is such a great teammate/leader explain why Eto'o and Ibra were pushed out? Why is it that they both had their best seasons of their careers after leaving Messi? Why does Villa and Pedro go months and months without scoring? Villa was once a world class striker who is nothing more than average at Barca. Cesc hasn't improved over his Arsenal form. Who is Messi making better with his playmaking and leadership? Xavi and Iniesta are great with or without him so who is he lifting to greatness?

In contrast, Higauin, Benzema and Ozil are all having their best seasons with Ronaldo. Each year is better than their previous ones. Benzema has a personal high in goals and assists this year while Ozil has had his personal highs in assists two years in a row and Higuain has been outstanding with 25 goals in limited time. Looks like Ronaldo is the one making the players around him better.

As for the Champions league, Ronaldo scored the two goals in 15 minutes against Bayern that were enough to put his team through. Pepe commited a stupid foul that let Bayern back in and Ronaldo can't be to blame. On the other hand Messi was invisible again in both games against Chelsea and his turnover directly led to a goal plus blowing the penalty. Don't preach about Ronaldo "leading his team" when he did certainly more than could be expected. Messi was simply absent. As for the much avaunted "sextuple." please excuse me if I give a sh1t less if Ronaldo wins the Spanish & Uefa Supercup and the Club World Cup all in the same year. What a dream to win against Santos in a final...:rolleyes

You know these three consecutive league titles that you're using to tout Messi's greatness is something Ronaldo did in England plus one at Sporting and now one with Madrid. Ronaldo has been a champion in three different countries. And giving Messi credit for 3 Champions League titles is fackin hilarious.

Finally, an Argie bringing up what Ronaldo must do for Portugal to "challenge Messi" when 65% of Messi's international goals are from friendlies has some big balls.

 

Greatness or Ballon d'Or doesn't matter, you can't stand for people to not worship Messi.

So if Yonko hasn't seen it, it doesn't exist? Is that where you're going with this?

Every once in a while I appreciate something Messi does. Most of the time I attribute his achievments to playing for Barcelona. Like scoring 72 goals so far, On Madrid he'd have Benzema with 31 and Higuain with 25 to eat up some of those chances. We all know that there's no competition for Messi and when he has some, he ousts them. Ronaldo has 59 with two very greedy strikers in front of him. Again, Messi benifitting from the Barca gravy train taylor made for his game. Everybody on that team is working all game to put Messi through on goal.

"Spit Messi-hate?" You lost me? I only agreed with what you said about its up to Ronaldo to have a good Euro and it could work against him if he doesn't, I brought up the Euro in the OP and that Ronaldo could set himself apart there. I didn't need you to come along to point that out. I was just overwhelmed by the fact that you made some sort of sense for once.

Messi has had 7-8 penalties in a month? Two against Milan, two last week, one the week before and two again today? Messi has taken 17 to 15 for Ronaldo this year. Looks like Penaldo has been turned into Penessi.

Rememeber that these are all "meaningless goals" and he didn't score them when his team needed them. Barca has nothing to play for and Messi is just searching for personal glory after losing the League and CL. Sound familiar? It's what you Messi fanboys were saying last year when Ronaldo scored 11 in 4 games to end the year. I thought Messi was beyond such personal gratification?

Which brings me to another point that Messi has 5 games over Ronaldo. You going to count those along with the goal differential?

 

You're an idiot, I'm saying he could win the next two for all he knows so why judge his succes in twh two previous seasons before Madrid was stable and could actually challenge for the league?

 

Reading is fundamental. I said TAKEN.

Ronaldo's supposedly that greedy bastard running to the spot to pad stats. Messi's ran to it 2 more times.