Ballon d'Or 2012 Thread...

If we think about (statistically) exceptional euro performances, we think about Platini84 and Van Basten88. But both were shaped by peculiar circumstances.

I'll take nothing away from Platini, he is a favourite of mine, but they were helped by a few conditions:

Belgium was severely handicapped by the suspensions of Eric Gerets and libero Walter Meeuws. Franky Vercauteren had problems with his knee, Luc Millecamps was injured, striker Vandenbergh was not fit.

Denmark had their problems too. Soren Busk, Jesper Olsen, Frank Arnesen and Morten Olsen played with injections. Especially Arnesen and Olsen were big worries throughout the tournament. Alan Simonsen broke his leg in the first match. The goalkeeper was a worry too. Denmark conceded six goals in a friendly with Holland. Main culprit was the goalkeeper. Troels Rasmussen was injured and they not really and adequate replacement.

Spain had problems with Gordillo, Maceda (suspended) and Goikoetxea. Their whole axis was gone. Also the sensational left-back Moreno was not fit and did not complete the final and was absent in some other matches too (against Germany for example).


The point is: three of the five opponents of France had some serious problems. This is the kind of luck a player needs. I do not mean it as Platini-bashing but it these kind of circumstances obviously help.


Van Basten in 1988 is a different story. He was helped by a tremendous support cast. The second best player in the tournament was Frank Rijkaard, who was just as him fresh (Rijkaard played rarely a match in 87-88). Both Rijkaard and Van Basten had not a tiring season behind their back.
Plus, Koeman and Gullit ran their socks off to help Van Basten. Koeman and Gullit were stars for their clubs as well but Gullit was after a stunning first season tired and Koeman had a fractured foot and was not fit. So, both found the mental energy to utilise their services as 'water carriers' - because both knew they themselves could not become the star of the tournament. Yes, they had the abilities to be valuable, no, they could not be great and/or outstanding.


The point is: Gomez (or any other striker) needs such kind of willingness too perhaps. It takes a unselfish Ozil to star. Usually, sides like Spain, Germany, Holland, France etc. possess many more 'stars' who all want to eat a bit of the pie and coaches are - rightly so - tempted to use those attributes. It doesn't happen very often that star-players play an subordinate role, with the intention to let another star player shine, and that is the luck that Van Basten had - and repaid their confidence obviously.


In sum: favourable circumstances might be key.

 

Again folks, Gomez has to get into the god damn starting lineup first before this can even go up for debate. Its very possible that he sees less than 90 -180 total minutes the entire tournament.

 

How is that possible? He played during Euro 2012 qualifying and scored a lot! Then with his great 2011-12 club season it's going to make the decision to start him even easier.

 

Klose is still preferred by Loew.

I think Oezil should have a good shout. If we are looking at the number of goals scored by those whose job it is to score, we should look at the number of assists playmakers have and Oezil is ahead of all in this category. He is also most likely to be 'the' player for his country this summer.

 

What if Cristiano Ronaldo is a flop at the Euro? Then I don't think he's got any edge. Anyway personally I would want Ozil to win it. He's an amazing player blessed with technique ,great imagination and vision.

 

Must spread rep

 

What if all the big names underperform at the Euros?

Let's not forget that players like Ronaldo, RVP, Robben, Gomez and Ozil are all in the same group. Someone will be eliminated early from the Euros......

 

Like I mentioned, this is the Euro12 year, and all the names CR7, Riberry, Robben, Ozil, Silva, Van Persie, Rooney, Ibra will have a chance to shine ... over Messi

 

Basicly, the last time Messi didn't win and where he ended up 2nd was in 2008. Coincidentally the last time the EC was held.

Xavi or Iniesta would've been a shoe-in for this year, but Chelsea changed all of that.

 

Really? Cuz Gomez started the 2 most recent qualifiers. Klose is 35 years old. I think there are 15 teams that hope Loew still prefers Klose over Gomez though.

What if my Aunt had balls?

 

Klose was injured, that's why he wasn't on the bench. When Klose returned he started every game.

 

Klose always performs well for Germany however, since last year Gomez became more and more a worldclass ... type . We'll see... how Lowe will do

 

CR7 definitely has the edge, as the key player behind RM's La Liga title. Plus he has been as phenomenal as Messi all season long. A few meaningless goals less does not change the fact that Ronaldo has performed in all key games this season, while Messi has flopped. Right now CR7 is the clear favourite for the Balon d'Or with Messi a clear second. With Messi down and out after being a failure in the three key encounters for the season.

Not even a poor Euro outing can take it away.

The only players capable of taking it away from CR7 are Ribery, Robben or Oezil, but each of them would have to have a phenomenal Euro. Plus Ribery and Robben would have to top it off with a CL trophy winning performance.

Naturally one can not underestimate fanboyism in footballing circles... ergo the 2010 Messi Balon d'Or, but to anyone thinking logically Messi has lost the Balon d'Or and can do nothing to regain it.

 

Im sorry but 65 goals and 28 assists is WAY more than just a few meaningless goals.

If we are discussing meaningless goals then we should count all the penalties ronaldo had compared to Messi.

In terms of individual performance there is not a single doubt that Messi has been a better player than Ronaldo this season, its not even close.

You can check all the stats, passing, dribbling, shoots per goals, assists, key passes and u see Messi is better at all aspects, in some BY FAR ( example dribbling).

However if Ronaldo performs good at the euro and leads portugal far then he is a favorite for sure.

 

ROTFL. How about counting all those meaningful penalty goals Messi DOESN'T have. Plus Messi has like 5 PKs from the Champions League

Not true. In terms of individual performance CR7 has been a better player. He has been performing home and away, against all teams he plays against, all season long. Something THAT can not be said for Messi (away games, missing in key matches all season and messing up several key PKs). Albeit it is close.

How about penalty conversion rates? Fact is CR7 does more with less

He is favourite already. Especiallly if he pips Messi for the Golden Boot. He has won La Liga, while Messi will win nothing this season, save for maybe the 'meaningless' (according to Barca fans last year) cup.

 

Whoscored rates Messi ~0.5 point higher than Ronaldo.

The most used starting 11 of Barcelona has an average of 7.51

The most used starting 11 of Madrid has an average of 7.33

A difference of about 0.2

The 10 highest rated players of Barcelona have an average of 7.7

The 10 highest rated players of Madrid have an average of 7.4

A difference of about 0.3

So it is fair to say that Messi performs statistically better. But as said before, I don't think there is much between them and as often mentioned, they are not the kind of greats to carry a team (like Maradona or even lesser greats like Zola).

 

Statistics... gotta love them.
With stats so favourable towards Barca then how come Barcelona is trailing 7 points behind Real Madrid in La Liga?

 

Messi fanboyism goes above and beyond logic at times.

Last year, Ronaldo broke La Liga record with goals and they were all meaningless too

 

If Messi breaks Gerd Muller's record, that is something new that could justify voters giving it to him. After all, this year it's clear he carried his team rather than vice versa.

Do people think his previous 3 makes voters more or less likely to give it to him again?

 

Difference is Gerd Muller needed 49 games to score 67 goals. Messi needed 56 just to get to 65. The record therefore still remains Muller's.

 

I'm pretty sure the journalists will give it to CR7 or possibly the key EURO player. The problem is with the clueless fanboy team captains who vote on likeability not on merits.

 

I see that the Messi-haters have escaped from the clinic again.