So scoring 80 goals or so in a calendar year, which is what Messi will likely end up with, is not something to be talked about? Of course it’s not mentioned commonly because it hardly ever happens. How many times in history has it happened? Tons of strikers don’t score 80 goals in their entire careers, scoring 80 in one is certainly something to talk about.
I don't have a problem with the total goals scored in the year. It's the narrowing it down to goals scored in non-domestic matches that strikes me as a manufactured record.
Yeah, it's a manufactured record. Wait what, what is a manufactured record? Something that isn't true or...? I think it's pretty news worthy if someone breaks over 100 year old football record. But, that's just me of course.
But his overall game is worse... Apart from a few games the predominant comment about Messi has been 'hardly a vintage Messi performance'. Really... you repeat the same thing game after game on your own Barca board, but somehow fail to notice that Messi's overall game (still world class) has dropped off. If anything its pretty surprising Messi has scored as much goals as he has...
A record that next to no-one has mentioned throughout it's existence? Come on, there are plenty of things that Messi can be proud of, standard records he has broken or has a chance of breaking - there's no need to concoct more just for the sake of it. This record is effectively goals for your country and some goals for your club.
I can't see what Bada Bing wrote, so... There is a drop-off. The only surprising thing that it isn't bigger, but because Messi has become a true penalty area fox he manages to limit the fall in goals scored.
So it isn't a record, or notable record if somebody doesn't mention it? Maybe somebody haven't mentioned it because it happened last time over 100 years ago, by some amateur player? I actually think its pretty fundamental record differentiating goals in international and domestic games.
The problem is that there is no significant history in football of identifying international club and international country matches/goals as a distinct entity. The breakdown is almost always club and country. Taking some parts of one and adding it to the other makes no sense - either combine them in their entirity or keep them separate.
Why isn't that a manufactured record? Some countries opted to coalesce the seasons with the calender year, fine, while others made another choice. Only the goals within a given season counts, regardless of whether a season ends at the end of the year or in the summer. I don't see how goals within a calender year is a valid record. In some cases the rounds aren't distributed evenly such as the Serie A whose 'return rounds' used to start somewhere midway February and not at the beginning of the calender year.
Yes, I'm anti Spanish and I'm proud to be anti Spanish since 2005. In contrast to others who hide their preferences and pretend objectivity. I don't see why that should be a reason to freeze me out or don't help me. It is like ignoring you solely because you are a Barca-fanboy. In fact, if such a publication with La Liga stats exist (assists, cards and whatever) it would help a lot in many of these debates. Fact free shouting isn't fruitful. Even considering my biases, Barcelona fans have to admit that some calls are very doubtful like, for example, Terry his red card last year against Barcelona. Of course it was a foul and deserved a red but how often do we see cards for offences like that? The name Jaap Stam was mentioned here and I remember now his story about he transformed from a midfielder in a defender; one of the tricks he learned was smashing the knuckles of the attacker or bang into his back with the knee if the attacker wants to 'feel' where the defender is. Attackers want to have a physical connection with the defender so they know where the defender is without having to take a look. Jaap Stam his remedy was knocking that attacker down. That is really a default trick of defenders and also Terry did this against Sanchez but surprise, he got a straight red for it. Do I believe that it was a red? Certainly, but you rarely see it happen.
I don't see problem there, because it's easily differentiable, international or domestic. In a way you are now manufacturing pretext of your own for the "manufactured" record.
Nobody should pretend anything, but when discussng one should at least make an effort not to be "pro" or "anti". Otherwise you get that mental rigidity that is typical to fanatics, to people who will never admit their opponents may have a point. And after a while their opponents become enemies: something that is indeed happening in Spain since the arrival of José Mourinho. So don't get trapped into that mind set.
That's very true ... I had mentioned the same before in other post (!) I believe While Messi's 70+ or 80 goals per season is a great achievement - phenomenon. However CR7 did come close with 70goals/season as well .. to say it may not be something never seen or ever happened! It could be a record for Barca alone, but NOT official to world football by any standard. Like you said there are "other record" that Messi did to be proud of: Official records Messi did were: 1- 10games streak scoring in liga (Tied with Ronaldo 97 - R9 and Nistelrooy held 11 games world record though) 2- broke (Ronaldo97) most goal scored at liga/season (50 vs 47 of R9) 3- most goals scored at home 25 ( however CR7 broke most goals scored away with 23) 4- most hat tricks: 8 5- Youngest to reach 150 leaguegoals at 24. Messi still got to break Ronaldo record at Barca for most opponent scored against 19/21 teams) - and CR7 did it for Real 20/20 last season. =============================================== NOTE: for the two records CR7 did last season (underlined) he als well deserved the ballon D'or if not messi! If counting calendar year, NO ONE could ever catch up with Pele (3 seasons >100goals) Or if we try to note something has never done before, Pele will blow people's mind with so many "manufactured records" per se
Pele scored 75 goals once in a calendar year, and most of those were in a regional level competition. Messi has currently 74, in a topflight national level competition.
???? This is a legitimate point I think? I mean: if the return matches start at the beginning of the calender year and the first half of the next season ends at the end of the calender year it is at least the case that the player has played against more or less the same opponents. This is not true if the second half of the season starts somewhere in February which was in the past the case.
Messi has already the seasonal WR's, most goals for club 73, and most goals for club+country (all official games) 82.
Just because you haven't read about the "record" before doesn't make it irrelevant. I bet you read about Mourinho's 90+ match unbeaten home league record or "Barcelona is off to their best league start in history" record, right? Those are totally manufactured as well. But that doesn't mean they don't point to anything impressive (or at least noteworthy). I mean : "unbeaten, home, league" streak ... haha... that's using 3 filters to produce an impressive-looking run. But even still, I think it still says something. Just like non-domestic goal scoring record says something.
read well... 10games in liga as liga record - here R9 in 97 = Messi 2012 However R9 + Nistelruud got 11 games scoring streak (10liga+1 game international club) hence "world record" - no other players has done more (exclude Pele for Brazil's complicated league division back then)
No, it's the combining of two usually distinct parts of a players record to form another record that I find irrelevant. It used to be Mourinho's unbeaten home record, but then he lost a cup match to Charlton and it became an unbeaten home league record. It's an irrelevent record. It's far from uncommon to compare how teams start a season. Spurs 11 wins to start a season is quite well known in England, and the media regularly compare how teams start the season. It was only today I heard that Arsenal were off to there worse start and Middlesbrough their best for a number of years. These aren't being posted as a point of interest, but as claims for Messi to be breaking records on a constant basis. Well established records are fine, but ones that have never been brought to light before make one wonder as to the motives. Would anyone like to point out some sources that list Woodward (or anyone else) as the holder of this record. If it turns out that it is a relatively established record then I will take everything I said back. Until then, I maintain it is a meaningless record. And for what it's worth I am a Messi fan, and believe he deserves all the sensible plaudits that come his way - I just don't think scouring the history books to try to bolster his records achieves anything.