Incoming transfer fees for players whose registration is owned by the club are revenue for the legal entity known as Bolton Wanderers PLC. Failure to book them as such without proper explanation, and even then only within rather circumscribed limits, would be a material breach of accounting conventions and of company law. The auditors would not sign off on the accounts; the EPL would be forced to investigate, the Companies Office (SEC equivalent) would also investigate. Of course, accounting conventions and company law are completely different on the other side of the pond. You are, of course, right that clubs are run on a completely different basis to any normal business. That is only made possible by outside investors continuing to pump money into the clubs in the form of fresh capital or loans. At some stage the outside investors will either start to look for a return on that investment, run up against the financial limits imposed by their other businesses, or die. In which case the "spend every penny we don't have on wages and transfer fees" juggernaut comes to a very sudden halt. You might remember Leeds United . . . Bolton's owner is rich, but not mega-rich. Coyle is operating within very tight financial limits. These are matters of fact. Whether your not understanding is due to a lack of ability or a lack of willingness to do so is the only thing that is a mater for debate. If you were interested in the finances of Bolton - and of football in general - you could try The Swiss Ramble blog. I've gone and looked up its last Bolton entry for you - it dates from November 2010 - and here it is. http://swissramble.blogspot.com/search/label/Bolton Wanderers Have a good read . . . before you make your next post.
Whilst Bolton are haemorrhaging cash, Coyle has had money to spend this season with £4m on Ngog, £2m on Ream, £2m on Sordell & the same again for Mears & Eagles.... Spending £4m on Ngog was criminal really when signing a player who couldn't score for a top club and expecting him to score for a bottom half club.
As a reminder: _____________________________________ & And again you (chalaron) are wrong: Googlee? Reellee? Yee leern seemtheeng neew eeveeree dee! … When did I mention “profit”? Then why are you arguing against the fact that Bolton has millions to spend? They’ve got one of the world biggest (wage) budgets, and have only been increasing it, and you’re trying to tell us they do not have the money to improve their team, and have already signed the best manager they could get? Or that despite their money, they have some kind of invisible barrier that they can’t seem to overcome (The climate maybe? Crappy English food?), and that that’s the reason why EPL teams can’t seem to be able to sign the best managers and players available. Actually the entire point I initially made was about ‘soccer practice’ and “millions and millions to spend”. You can find it if you read back. Couple of posts back: Anyway, still Bolton - as any other EPL club - has huge financial resources. Even IF Coyle has been operating within very tight financial limits. -- see Jgco’s post PS There's no need to get personal when you can't win an argument or make a point. Wow thanks. And how is this relevant? I’m not interested in Bolton’s exact financial numbers. I only care about the wage bill and the transfer budget. But the latter is something we won’t find out anyway although one would hope for Bolton’s sake it’s close to zero. PS I’m familiar with TSR, but nonetheless thanks for sharing.
Back to Tim Ream and whether Bolton can stay up, here is the table. -----------------------Pld---GDiff---Points 15 Aston Villa--------35---(-14)---36 16 QPR--------------35---(-18)---34 17 Wigan Athletic----35---(-26)---34 18 Bolton Wanderers-34---(-28)---33 19 Blackburn Rovers--35---(-26) ---31 20 Wolves-----------35---(-41)---23 Wolves are gone and Blackburn are in such desperate, desperate trouble that a single loss will de facto relegate them. With their better goal difference, a single win is enough to keep Aston Villa up but equally, if they lose, one win lets QPR, Wigan or Bolton win catch up. As for form Villa: one win in the last 14 games. From the last 7 games, it's 3 draws and 4 losses with 5 goals scored and 15 conceded QPR: from the last 7 it's 4 wins and 3 losses, with all the wins coming at home, with 10 scored and 9 conceded. Wigan: 4 wins, 1 draw and 2 losses from the last 7 games, with 10 scored and 7 conceded. Bolton: 4 wins, 1 draw and 2 losses from 7 games, with 10 scored and 11 conceded. Blackburn: 2 wins and 5 losses from 7, with 7 scored and 13 conceded Take the above into the remaining fixtures Villa: WBA (A), Spurs (H), Norwich (A) QPR: Chelsea (A), Stoke (H), Man City (A) Wigan: Newcastle (H), Blackburn (A), Wolves (H) Bolton: Sunderland (A), Spurs (H), WBA (H), Stoke (A) Blackburn: Spurs (A), Wigan (H), Chelsea (A) Like the SKY panel, I expect Villa to lose the derby against West Brom. QPR and Wigan will do well to get even a point today. Bolton are playing a Sunderland who are running on empty and haven't scored a goal in 4 games. A point is possible and would be huge. IF they win they will be in the driving seat. For my money, Villa and Blackburn are joining Wolves in the Championship.
From the swiss ramble link: "In fairness, it’s not as if Bolton’s wage bill is excessive in absolute terms, as they currently lie 12th in the wages ranking for clubs in the Premier League. As we speak, they could actually be even lower, as they could easily be overtaken by Blackburn, Fulham and Wigan when those clubs publish their 2010 accounts, while newly promoted Newcastle certainly pay more. Moreover, the club is well aware that the wage bill is too high, as they have been adversely impacted by two important factors, one of which is specific to Bolton, while the other has affected all clubs. First, the consecutive changes in management have “led to the club carrying a larger than optimum playing squad and backroom team.” Second, the club wanted to shed players in the summer, but the transfer market has died with far fewer deals taking place. This meant that no senior players left the club during the season, resulting in the senior squad increasing in size from 24 players to 30, while the full squad of players averaged 57 compared to 45 in the previous season. Gartside promised that the club’s wage position would recover next summer when nine players will be out of contract, “If you took four or five players out of the squad, you’ve probably got £8 million of salaries that you don’t need.” It’s an obvious area to target and one that should not be too difficult to improve. You would have to believe that the board directors were capable of addressing the financial issue, given that they are very comfortably rewarded for their efforts. Last year, the highest paid director (most likely Gartside) trousered a hefty £584,000, including a £156,000 bonus, while the other director (presumably Duckworth) received £483,000, including a £178,000 bonus. If they make this much money, when the company reports a record loss of £35 million, heaven knows how much they would be paid if the club actually made a profit. Nice work if you can get it." Soooooooooo...they are definitely in the bottom half of the premier league when it comes to wages(possibly bottom 3), and have a larger wage portion than most devoted to unneeded players. Yes, they have millions to work with. Championship and some league 1 sides also have millions to work with. However, they definitely DO NOT have one of the biggest wage budgets in the world. And if they had vast resources at their disposal, I seriously doubt they would be investing in players like David N'gog and Tim Ream.
Me too. Even if I wind up with egg on my face sometimes Anyway, Wigan are looking good to be staying up, which is one prediction i did get right
-----------------------Pld---GDiff---Points 15 Aston Villa--------36---(-14)---37 16 Wigan Athletic----36---(-22)---37 17 QPR----------------35---(-18)---34 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 18 Bolton Wanderers-35---(-28)---34 19 Blackburn Rovers--35---(-26)---31 20 Wolves-----------36---(-41)---24 Updated vomit inducing table. QPR play Chelsea tomorrow. Sadly Villa look to be in real trouble when it looked like they were fairly safe.
Villa (37): Spurs, @ Norwich QPR (34): @ Chelsea, Stoke, @ Man City Bolton (34): Spurs, West Brom, @ Stoke Villa probably only need one more point for survival, those arent the easiest fixtures though QPR play extremely well at home, but they are the suck on the road. No way they take points from Chelsea or City. best they can hope for is 3 at home to stoke. Bolton do have the easiest schedule of the bunch certainly. in their hands, its gonna be close.
Spurs have been in the worst run of form of a top half team in a long time. Bolton have a legitimate shot at some points out of this one.
If you look at the revenue thread in the Statistics section you will find Bolton ranked about 50th. In 2008/09 their wage bill was 11th in EPL (£46 million). That would've put them just behind Everton. And it has only increased since. Everton's revenue places them 29th in the world. Ajax (30th) pays around €50 million in wages (2012). It's pretty safe to say Bolton's wage bill is one of the highest in the world.
I think you would have a hard time finding people that agree with that. That being said, this debate is done. A point on ht road wasn't a bad result for Bolton today, Ream could've had his man a little tighter for that goal though. He moves the ball around the field very well IMO, just needs to clean up his positioning and marking a bit
Pretty cool idea: http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/matchday/matches/2011-2012/epl.fan-zone.html/sunderland-vs-bolton Anyone know how Ream played? I missed the game.
Chelsea putting a hurting on QPR, 4-0 at the half. The goal difference is down to 6 in QPRs favor. We need Chelsea to add a couple more on and then Man City can beat them 5 or 6 nil on the final day.
-----------------------Pld---GDiff---Points 15 Aston Villa--------36---(-14)---37 16 Wigan Athletic----36---(-22)---37 17 QPR----------------36---(-23)---34 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 18 Bolton Wanderers-35---(-28)---34 19 Blackburn Rovers--35---(-26)---31 20 Wolves-----------36---(-41)---24 table
I thought it was ok because of the title of the thread. If you're worried about me spoiling people you shouldn't quote me, and a mod can remove my post if necessary. Sorry.
After today, here's where things stand (plus each club's remaining schedule). Club: Points (Goal Differential) 15. Aston Villa: 37 (-14) Tottenham @ Norwich 16. Wigan: 37 (-22) @ Blackburn Wolves 17. QPR: 34 (-23) Stoke @ Man City 18. Bolton: 34 (-28) Tottenham West Brom @ Stoke 19. Blackburn: 31 (-28) Wigan @ Chelsea