A New York expansion team not named the Cosmos?

Discussion in 'New York City' started by Unak78, Mar 22, 2012.

  1. Unak78

    Unak78 BigSoccer Supporter

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    Buzz Carrick is doubling down on his prediction that MLS will announce a NYC expansion team but it will not carry the Cosmos name.

    http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/soccer/post/_/id/14744/bold-predictions-2012

    Why?

    Personally I'm not sure why there are people who are so certain that this will be the eventual outcome. For one thing Sela Sports has already invested money in purchasing the name and rights to the history of the original NY Cosmos, not to mention continuing their academy agreement with BW Gottschee. It doesn't make sense for them to sit on the sidelines at this point. They may not be making much noise right now, but with the stadium search in MLS' hands, there's little reason for them to unless they're eager to follow Kemsley's path.

    But even if Garber decides to award a franchise to another NY investment group, I can't see them leaving a potentially very profitable brand sitting dormant. Just having the Cosmos logo on your shirts at least doubles the initial revenue of a potential NYC franchise as opposed to a NY FC. Now there might be a question as to when a NY expansion franchise might be viable, but I'd put it at 60-40 odds in favor of any NY expansion franchise carrying the name Cosmos.


  2. QueensNick

    QueensNick Member

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    I kind of agree with your odds - of course they can do whatever they want but as I have said a few times - one thing PK did do right is show that the brand still holds weight.

    Fack the other day some dude sent me a PM on my celtic message board and was asking me for hte details of the Cosmos - wanted to know if htey were coming back -he remembered the old days etc.

    It would generate a more global interest (and at home) if the team was the Cosmos.
  3. PCFC

    PCFC Member

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    Apparently, the international sales of the Cosmos jerseys beat all the MLS teams combined. Wasn't that cited somewhere on this board?

    If that's true, I wouldn't understand not including them. Your international recognition would jump instantly.
  4. Metrogo

    Metrogo Member

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    Terry Byrne told me that. That they were doing extremely well abroad.


  5. QueensNick

    QueensNick Member

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    couple of guys i know in england say they see the shirt a lot
  6. EL YANQUI

    EL YANQUI Red Card

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    I have seen more NY cosmos jackets this past week thru out the mid town area than i have seen energy drink gear in the last 3 years... and i am not saying it to take a shot at energy drink fans.... like i said seen the cosmos jackets this week in mid town and its just a reminder what this scum bag paul kemley really was nothing more than a cheap fraud......

    The cosmos jacket also reminded me how broken this sham is while the name and logo holds some weight if a serious MLS expansion bid with out the cosmos name came in to the mix it would have my full support.. a sad reminder of the mess that i called a mess since day one......

    what the arabs are doing not doing plan to do is any ones guess the silence is also doing damage to add to all the damage paul kemsley has done....

    NY is a huge unkown the league wants it...but wanting does not mean instant results....... its just a huge mess and thats not even taking into account the stadium situation...... if fred wilpon and his land was some how involved things would be so different..... but he is out....

    I tip my hat to fred the guy was up front since day one the scandal was what killed the soccer plans......
  7. QueensNick

    QueensNick Member

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    but now that they are done with the madoff mess - can they get back in?

    Even during this - they were in talks with the MOs to hold an exhibition and possibly be a temp home while they build a long term stadium. They were looking at a hydrolic mound.

    Madoff mess is over now - they know what the worst is and it will probably not even be that bad - do they get back in is the question.
  8. napolisoccer

    napolisoccer Member

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    NYCFC has always been my favourite name.
  9. NorthbankHighbury

    NorthbankHighbury Member

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    The might be the most ridiculously premature question in the history of questions .... and might even be a severe indicator that I need some kind of medication but if NYC2 wound up not being the Cosmos, but the franchise proved to be a success without really hurting RBNY ...... wouldn't that open the door to possibly having a third team in the city at some future point...

    ?

    NYC3

    Yeah I went there.
  10. looknohands

    looknohands Member+

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    Ultimate double-edged sword, though.
    If you're going to bring about a second Cosmos, you do so with the implicit understanding that you'll need to spend big to try and attract some media superstars...the Messis, Ronaldos, etc., and even that will only get you to a point level with the current Galaxy; i.e. the awareness that Beckham plays for them, but no sense of attachment to the actual team. People aren't going to snatch up James Riley Cosmos jerseys (I'm pretty sure he'll play for the next 20 expansion teams at this rate,) nor are they going to be satisfied with watching a typical MLS squad. Fair or not, people will compare the new Cosmos to the Cosmos of old. Not only that, they'll only remember the Cosmos of old as a superteam led by the likes of Pele that could challenge any team (again, fair or not.) Unless the new Cosmos can attract the biggest and best names, you risk not only hurting the appeal of the new brand but the old one, as well.
    aetraxx7 repped this.
  11. Jossed

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    It has been pointed out many times, but it was a myth that the old Cosmos were a squad of superstars or a superteam. They usually had one or two elite players and the rest were middling and cast off players from Europe and South America. Sort of like MLS today, except the American players in MLS are far better than those in the NASL.
  12. lkgf09

    lkgf09 Member

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    [​IMG]
  13. QueensNick

    QueensNick Member

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    not a chance at that lol

    Well yea - im sure if the Cosmos came back - like any expansion team, year 1 would be find - draw solid numbers etc but what about year 2? Or year 3 with no HUGE players.

    Its the golden question but only one way to find out.

    Also - the supporters club should take the responsibility of making sure people have another reason to come out - gotta make that atmosphere amazing.
  14. Metrogo

    Metrogo Member

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    This is definitely a danger that people will be turned off when they see it's Chance Myers at fullback and not Carlos Alberto. I think that's why the old ownership group was doing such a great job of connecting with the community throuhg Cosmos Copa the PDL team, the youth soccer system. The grassroots was getting to know them and feel an attachment sans Cristiano Ronaldo.

    I also agree that the game day atmosphere has to be special. I think a stadium near Roosevelt Ave. in Queens will make for a world class game day experience, like floating around the Boca neighborhood before the game. This will help make up for the gap in quality between Cosmos 1.0 and 2.0.
  15. fifty7

    fifty7 Member

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    From a business standpoint, I don't see how they don't use the Cosmos branding.
  16. looknohands

    looknohands Member+

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    That was the point I was making with the whole "fair or not.":D
    People are going to have a romanticized notion of what the Cosmos were...and I strongly doubt that a new version could live up to those lofty expectations.
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  17. looknohands

    looknohands Member+

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    $$$$$
    If Sela doesn't get the bid (or even make one) then it'll be interesting to see how much money they want for the Cosmos name.
  18. brentgoulet

    brentgoulet Member

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    correct, but maybe some people are scared off by the Cosmos legacy
  19. Goforthekill

    Goforthekill Member

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    Do we know if they will sell the name? that has been my real problem with other ownership groups, they don't have the cosmos name. if we can be sure they'd sell the brand to whoever the owners are then i would be okay with the Wipons, or the Blazer, Messing, Martin bid. how much was the brand sold for the first time?
  20. 4door

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    If you are talking 10+ years than I could actually see something like this happening but only in Long Island. I think that the Galaxy, Red Bull Arena, PNW teams would all have been laughable 10 years ago when the league was retracting and almost went under. The NHL has the Devils, Islanders, and Rangers so its not incredibly outrageous of an idea especially if NY2 does really well. Its not like suggesting we have a dozen clubs like in London, but if the league grows and there is a stadium/fan base in Long Island/Queens and NYCFC is near Manhattan then maybe there could be another team and enough fans to make it happen. But it would probably not be until MLS is closer to NHL size which wouldn't be for at least 10 years.

    As far as the NY Cosmos brand, I'll throw out a bigger wild idea. Sela buys out part of RBNY (allowing them to keep sponsorship/stadium naming rights) and names the Club NY Cosmos. So in 4 years we have a NY Cosmos vs. NYCFC or Empire FC derby both with SSS accessible to public transit. Could you imagine a Sounders/Timbers level of fan bases and traveling supporters within opposite sides of NYC metro? It would be a game changer for the sport.
  21. Roger Allaway

    Roger Allaway Member+

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    I think they had more elite players than one or two a season. Pele, Chinaglia, Bogicevic, Neeskens, Carlos Alberto and Beckenbauer played a combined total of 34 NASL seasons for them.

    However, it is true that they did not rate as well against European teams as the myth would have you believe. In their six peak years (1977-82), their record against European clubs was only 15 wins, 19 losses and six ties.
  22. Unak78

    Unak78 BigSoccer Supporter

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    And this was before European clubs were truly the "superclubs" with the high concentration of talent that we have today.
  23. Fenerbace

    Fenerbace Member

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    Sela doesn't need to submit an own bid and the successful bidding group wouldn't need to "buy" the brand in the sense of a large cash payout.

    Instead, sela gets brought into the bidding group directly with an equity stake, or, more arms length, is offered a revenue share in exchange for unlimited/exclusive use of the brand. This works for sela because it's the lowest risk and highest upside of any other option they would have.

    So, a high likelihood that the brand would be available for any successful bidding group.
  24. Goforthekill

    Goforthekill Member

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    Could Wilpon team up with Blazer, Messing and Martin? the Sela can buy the Red bulls with some huge bid and we're all good.
  25. Unak78

    Unak78 BigSoccer Supporter

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    This is the least likely of all scenarios. I would wager that Vergara would sell Chivas before Redbull sells RBNY considering the investents that they've made, the health of their business model, and the fact that they've yet sell any of their other sports ventures.
    aetraxx7 repped this.

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