46 yr old Russian male seeking coach for short term fun - OTT [R]

I'm still trying to come up with a single good reason why United didn't go in for him.

It was mind boggling-ly obvious.

 

They also had Mohammed Sissoko in reserves and later Lucas Leiva who both may not be the great but suited Benitez tactics very well.

Have been saying this, lets get our midfield sorted before teams around us wake up and start buying every good/elite talent, Chelsea already did that in Hazard case (they ignored the centre of it for the moment but wont for long).

 

German league, Incompetent scouts and SAF aversion to risk strategy these last 3 years (atleast).

 

Not just us.

Why would the likes of Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Spurs, Liverpool all not be interested in a quality player while they have all been happy to spend much bigger sums on average players.

I can only shake my head about spending 15M+ on the likes of a declining Torres, Luiz, Garcia, Barry, Milner, Kolarov, old Podolski, Carroll, Downing, Henderson, Jones, Young while letting Vidal move to Italy for under 10M.

 

The thing is Syed, one didn't need scouts to discover Vidal; one simply had to have been watching football at the time.

 

cr7torossi Invincible
As far as our concern is, we have not taken a risk on big potential since Nani/Anderson window, we have bought safe and we are paying for that, too many safe/average/one dimensional players. I have bemoaned it very window and have been labeled a moaner and what not, this is not how we have come this far, we take risks on world class potentials and reap the rewards ( not always) or used to.

Most of these teams you listed think they have good/great midfields, its a delusion, go to their forums and they will point out our weak midfield and everything is great in theirs but for some reason they dont dominate or win anything, remember Ramirez is a great/good midfielder debate, Wilshere is world class debate ? Spurs never had that kind of pull, so before everyone of these wakes up and realizes that they dont win things is because they lack quality in midfield/wings/attack lets get us some quality.

City manager is an idiot, 16 m on Garcia ? Rodwell? Sinclair?

 

Don't think that was Mancini's call to be honest. Just a hunch.

Mind you, that's the market though right? Other than Vidal, name another comparable type of better quality who went for less than 15 in the past few years. That's the going rate for a squaddie now, at a top team.

 

Oezil. Reus.

 

Khedira went for 10 m, Oezil too. I think it was Mancini, he bought Balotelli for 20 whatever millions, Kolarov for 16 m etc etc.

If we saw Marchisio playing when Juve was relegated (was on loan previous season) surely we would have had him for a decent amount, Hummels went for a million ( a bit before though), Bender brothers from 1860 Munchen in 09. Witsel went for what 10 m ?

 

Dont remind me please

 

Contract situation.

And still very much in the minority.

In terms of sample size, it's a not good representation of the going rate for a squaddie at the big money teams.

 

Cabaye for 4 m ( a considerable tier below tbh) but if the argument for Ashley Young is that he is a squad player whatever that means, surely would also work for Cabaye. Also Sahin for 10 m.

 

Syed already mentioned some other names.

Where was the prem interest in Shaqiri when almost everyone was in for a winger, and were happy to spend money on the likes of Sinclair, Moses and Marin?

 

Herrera just moved last season for 7.5 m, as I said we dont buy top potentials anymore as they are risky.

 

But the those transfers you mention in the second paragraph don't involve a big money team.

We don't get the luxury of getting players on the cheap, unless they either have a big contract dispute, or are virtual unknowns to the other big money teams.

Just as it's not a level playing field for others again us in terms of revenue, nor is it in terms of expenditure.

 

How much has Valero cost? Why didnt we complete Ljajic move?

 

I did not note any virtual unknown miracle stories like that CC striker (Austin is it), I put down some of the best young talents that were known for ages and went very cheap, Ronaldo was not ready either when we forked out the 12 m for him, neither were these guys when they did but in a year most of them have played vital and key roles for their teams, tells you of our scouting network and risk aversion.

 

I wish we had gone for Moses myself.

You're judging Shaqiri too early I think. Same as many were knighting Cisse last year after his hot streak. These judgements in terms of ROI and value need to be made over a period of many seasons.

 

First the Ronaldo transfer started before the market really exploded.

Second, I think your now taking the argument in a different direction. I commented on how the likes of the Garcia transfer is really a reflection on the current market rate for an instant squaddie in a big money team, who is ready to contribute right away. I know you don't rate Garcia highly, but he came in as a durable player, at a good age, with plenty of experience at a relatively high level, and with european experience. He may not be a world beater, but those kind of players don't come cheap.

I mean, for all the talk of the bargain Bayern got in Shaqiri, look how much they had to pay for Martinez.

 

It would had not matter to 1860 Munchen if we went for Benders, they wouldnt just ask 30 m all of a sudden if we were there, or Zarogoza if we were there for Herrera, maybe a couple of million increase.
The high prices is for lesser risk, we didnt used to do that, we used to take considerable risks alongside safe (or thought so safe) investments, players who are not ready but on the cusp of breaking through. But now we have started that, go for safe stable players with no high side to their game, Ronaldo was a risk, so would be Sanchez but we went for Valencia (not a bad decision if he was part of safe plus risk decision), Benders would be a risk so would be Herrera, but think of upsides. Hazard would have a risk last season, much safe this season but that increase price, we need to get players in who have high upside to their games.

Vidal was an obvious one but still lower value because of Leverkusen failures in Europe, so risk still involved, we have stop taking risks at all.

 

Sorry JamesA if I am confusing you, just saying rather than acting on potential/upside we wait and wait until the player is unreachable or choose stable safe targets who may not vary much in performance, safety rises value, the longer we wait and longer a player proves himself (safer he gets) he would either be snapped or his price unreachable.

 

Brazil sacked their coach, did not know that,

 

Looking at the league quality and ours it reminds me of "The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. How did it come to this?", sorry if overused but loved it there and still love it.

 

It's okay Syed, I understand what you're saying, and I don't 100% understand our transfer strategy myself. I'm merely speculating. But I don't think we're totally sitting on the sidelines here, as last off season proved.

But, I also think that economics dictate we have a lower top end financially than the following clubs right now: Barcelona, RM, Chelsea, City, and PSG.

That provides a lot of alternatives for these potential world beaters to consider, all paying outrageous wages, agent fees and total compensation packages.

I feel we've decided to prioritize numbers and squad size in general over first team quality. That's a decision we've made and I think that at times it benefits us, and at times, its hurts us.

For all the crap we give our midfielders, even the likes of Chelsea would benefit from some of our squaddie midfielders over a full campaign. Yes, we do need upgrades, or somebody stepping up, btu sometimes I think we loose sight of what we do have.

For example, look how Chelsea faired against Brom the other day with resting Oscar and Mata. They, like us, have to rest those guys some of the time. The game is so different than it was 10 years ago. Two - three seasons of 50 games for a player can bring on burnout very quickly. Especially in high tempo systems.

 

We cant compete is fine, we never competed with Italians in the 90s, with RM in Galaticos reign and after, we just acted smart (us and Arsenal actually, we are both stupid now), we took more risks and we reaped more rewards (also had pit falls though), we were bold in our strategy. Remember the day when both Anderson Nani signed, when others challenged us we upped our game but now it is all safe.

Strengthening squad for the cost of first team is so Rafa Benitez's Liverpool, they out spend us but still could not get close and it will lead us no where as well, we will become what Arsenal are now devoid of class players and a group of average above average players and will complain. Well if you buy average you will get average, no question about that.

Off season was fine but nothing special, RVP is still a very safe bet, Kagawa is a risk but it was more an opportunity than a calculated risk, we took a risk without thinking where are we going to fit him and I have no doubt his nationality played a big part in us taking that risk that we will recoup even if the risk does not come (he is in most ads I think).

In all the financial prudence we offer Young 100 k or more? and pay 17 m for him ? Our priorities are totally wrong, it is not the squad that have need bolstering it is first team, it is quality that needed adding, what Chelsea are missing are a academy and young players to step in, we always had that advantage our youngsters have been capable backups but that is not the route anymore, its just adding players for the sake of it because they are cheap or prem proven or whatever.