I have a much harder time seeing Jona getting a call up from Chepo than Vela. Just for the simple fact that one gets PT, and the other could probably not feature more than 5 times the rest of the year for his club. If I had to put a number on whether either of them get a call up from Chepo for the GC or CC, I would put it like this 35% Vela 15% Jona.
Based on ability alone Jona should be the first midfielder convocated. LOL @ people saying he might now even be good enough for the GC squad. Just smh. Him not getting called up to recent games shouldn't mean shit when he is probably our best midfielder.
Chaton - CC Herrera - CC Gullit - CC JDS - CC (one more chance to get off Chepo's shitlist and maybe he'll get a loan) Cabrera - GC (coming off an injury) Zavala - GC (coming off an injury)
On what exactly are you basing this? The little time I've seen him on the NT, he really hasn't stood head and shoulders above anyone else we've tried. In fact, he's looked passive and deferred too much. He has shown glimpses of having an powerful outside shot though.
https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/things-we-learned-from-the-colombia-game.1907692/ People seem to forget how good he looked compared to the rest of the team against Colombia
Yes it could mean shit if it has been proven that lack of playing time transfer to performances. And I think he's a great prospect but he's just that, a prospect. Unlike Gio he has yet to prove anything both in the NT and his club. I think he's great and hope he does well in the NT but like Nacho, I don't think he has show to be above a beyond phenom either to bypass the total playing time which after all is all on him since he had a loan to a 1st division team that wanted him to start and decided to stay and ride pine all tournament long. He had a good game but people are going overboard too. He didn't own Colombia either.
He made some great passes but nacho is right. In no way has he ever looked head and shoulders above the rest. Clearly a talented player that should be in the mix, but in no way should he be a lock.
A team CONFEDERATIONS CUP 1- jesus corona 2-alfredo talavera 3-Hector moreno 4-maza rodriguez 5-Hugo ayala 6-Hiram mier 7-Diego reyes 8-Jorge torres Nilo 9-Israel jimenez 10-severo meza 11-Hector herrera 12-Jesus zabala 13-Carlos salcido 14-Gio do santos 15-Andres guardado 16-Oibe peralta 17-Javier aquino 18-chicharo hernandez CHEPO -----------Jesus corona Torres nilo----maza---moreno---meza Guardado-------zabala----salcido----gio dosantos -------chicharo------peralta
I hate being a broken record about this but its the only thing people have really seen of Jona considering no one watched him at Barca B. Only player worth a damn the entire game. His distribution is heads and shoulders above any of our current midfielders. He didn't own them, but as soon as he was subbed out we dropped our level by a huge margin. We completely stopped moving the ball around and became even more shit. Although i see that right now him being a lock is a stretch. If Chepo actually calls him up for our upcoming WCQ games im confident he would immediately settle in as a starter.
Is that video your case? Like I said, I stand by my argument. He played well but didn't look head above shoulders or had a historic game or anything close to that. He played well, is definite a talent and should be in the picture but people are going overboard with this game. I think he's definitely Gold Cup material but I don't see at all why it's a given if he would go to the WCQ team or the Confederations cup and be a starter or great at it. It would be different if he was regularly playing in Europe and had match rhythm.
He was one of our best players in his 45 mins against Colombia. It's no surprise we lost the midfield once he was subbed. I agree that he shouldn't be considered a starter or anything like that but saying that "he didn't look head and shoulders above anyone" or "didn't have a historic game" is a pretty myopic metric. The kid is a CM, not a forward or winger. The beauty of his game is the subtleness and its simplicity.
How is that a myopic metric when it's precisely the view exposed by some people? I think he did well in the Colombia game but it wasn't the performance some people are making it out to be to declare him "our best midfielder" or "heads above everyone". And that is key because it's all the typical Mexican hype some fans make of our players that then make those people turn on them when they immediately fail to live up to their inflated expectations. Especially when he probably isn't match ready since he has barely played at all in 6 months, which would be a closer indicator to what to expect than a game in February. He's great but people should chill out too.
No, actually it isn't laughable. I know with a select few players (Vela,Jona particularly) you like to veer their shaft towards your tonsils every chance you get, but just like your wild delusions with vela, your delusional here too, no offense. As apposed to.....Jona? "I mean, yeah, we got some nice young players that have slowly but surely proved their worth with different national teams" You said the same thing though barring the dumb disclaimer. Spike in talent is a reality. Players who are first team players? Have more international experience? Make it off the bench even when they do by chance get benched? Showed character and taken their progression in stride vs knowingly accept a bench position when other options are there?.
Oh but wait....That Colombia game we lost!. The one where less than half of his passes subtly always just made it back to moreno......That's a great way to keep possession...when you dont try and cross the center half. I even went back and counted them for you guys last time. Rafa had more passes that crossed from the midfield line than Jona and Zavala combined.
For those wanting Jona, why not Davila? He's owned by a big club like Jona, he's shown flashes of brilliance, and unlike Jona he's actually helped Mexico out (at the youth level at least). So why Jona and not Davila? BTW, I don't think Davila deserves a call-up yet.
Davila Why not both? For Copa Oro.... we can't let the nads have it and then they're gonna be like "see.... "C" squads." Fuk that, we need a strong squad for the Gold Cup. They do good there they can come to the WC... maybe.
The reason that game got him so much attention is that he quite was noticeably better than the rest of the team, and how bad we looked when he got subbed off. And im not basing my opinion on just the Colombia game either. I saw him a bunch of times at Barca B and Barca preseason games, and no one really stacks up to him in getting the ball around and having the vision to make great passes. Maybe im just a Jona fanboy here, but even though he hadn't played in a long time, he looked great in that game he just started for Barca. He was fit and his passing on point. I dont think lack of playing time has affected his quality, which is why i want him to get called up so bad so he can have that Gio exemption of PT criticism. I can see how i might be hyping him up too much though, i'll let it rest. Hopfully he actually goes on loan during the winter or something
The difference being that he was playing in Barca B regularly at that time and not now. Look I think Jonathan is great and I think he's promising and has been for a while. I just don't agree that he was head above shoulders better than the rest in that game or now to the point that he's an unquestionable for the A team. In fact to me unless he gets playing time in a loan in the next 6 months, he's perfect for the Gold Cup team not the Confederations cup. I just think that his lack of playing time and the overrated expectations may lead to disappointment and harsh judging on him. And most of it has to be on him. After all his decisions have been as bad as Gio's or worse. The scandal in Peru (which was bullshit imo), picking Barca over the Olympic team and staying in Barca and skipping on a loan after the coach said he wouldn't play with the team (which is exactly what happened) are all self imposed roadblocks to him exploiting his true talent. I hope he gets another chance and doesn't waste it but I would think it's more logical for that to be in the Gold Cup.
It's myopic because you keep talking about what "some people" have said about him and use metrics like "standing out heads and shoulders above anyone else". He's not a forward. His performance will be measured in a different manner when it comes to what he brings to the team and what he brings to the team, even with limited minutes at his club, is something we don't really have right now in the domestic league, even among the up and comers. That doesn't mean he should be a starter or should be considered one but our very own Bill O'Reilly aka Baysic claimed that Jona wasn't even good enough for the Gold Cup squad and here we are. We both agree that he is a good player with great potential but I'm certainly not anointing him as the next great big thing for Mexican footie. Pues el burro hablando de orejas. Hype goes both ways. You were very adamant about the fact that you didn't believe the Olympic team would do shit in London and look what happened. I don't understand your need to constantly use the reasoning of "some fans" as a logical crutch for all your arguments. As if that somehow proves it rational. He's not ready now and shouldn't be called in. The question really was whether or not he would be brought in next summer when we have GC and CC back to back.
Claiming Jona isn't even GC material is laughable. I know with a select few players (Vela,Jona particularly) you like to veer their shaft towards your tonsils every chance you get, but just like your wild delusions with vela, your delusional here too, no offense. ahhhh bueno.... I don't understand why you're so butthurt about these guys but just remember, it is he who forgives who is strong. Yes it's a reality to a certain degree and Jona is part of that reality. Again, your claims are misguided. It's a matter of interpretation. The kid thinks he's good enough to be part of the Barca first team, you don't. Ultimately, it's his career. If things don't pan out for him, the NT has other options. I know.... I want them shrooms man...
Different positions, Davila has Gio, and Fabian ahead of him. Jona, is battling with Zavala, and Salcido, and a bunch of other guys his own age. Jona, possesses different qualities than any other DM/CM in our stable. Which is why I personally, hope he's always an option. But if he's bypassed for the CC, and its because hes not getting pt, then I have no problem with that.
First off, when did I say the Olympic team wouldn't do shit? The only thing I said was to be cautious of the expectation and I was right in that because people went all over. Before everybody was certain they would win gold. The the South Korea game happened and everyone panicked and this team was shit etc. Same thing with the players. Oribe didn't score and everyone wanted Raul Jimenez to start and give chance and in the end, Oribe was the hero and now it looks insane to play with Jimenez instead of Oribe. But I never said the team wasn't going to do shit. The only thing I said where I was wrong was thinking Uruguay was going to be a great team and was better. Baysic is wrong in the Dos Santos thing but he's right that you slurp on certain players and that is why you only see Baysic arguments but not people saying he's our best midfielders or him being unquestionable because of that Colombia game. You are a great poster but you do that all the time. Somebody could be saying "Chaton Enriquez is the greatest player in history" or "He's the best bald player since Ronaldo" and you wouldn't have a problem but if somebody says "He misses a lot of passes in every game" you go on as if they said "Benito Juarez is the devil" or something like that. I don't see why your post about how Baysic total mistake of saying he isn't GC material are valid but my post against overhyping the guy and not being given as a lock or heads and shoulders over everyone is myopic. I already said he was perfect for the GC so I don't know what is the problem then?
We have an ace in vela. We will be in form due to the WCQ this is a great run of official matches, everywhere i'm reading Mexico and Japan are seen as a dangerous team. its funny because its like we both are fearing each other. im just excited.