2012-2013 Off-Season Player Movement Discussion

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by OleGunnar20, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    If they're so good, how come the Canadian MLS teams don't sign or draft them?

    You don't have to be in the Combine to be drafted or signed after college. The list of US players who went undrafted or didn't go to the Combine but went on to solid pro careers is long and distinguished. So not being at the Combine doesn't prevent these kids from signing or being drafted.

    Every year around this time we hear a couple of Canadian fans clamor for the inclusion of players from Canadian universities because of this swath of untapped talent, yet we never see the Canadian MLS teams seeming to think these players are any good.

    Of all the Canadian players that have been in MLS, how many of them played Canadian university soccer? I know Ante Jazic played a season at Dalhousie before going to Europe. I know Pat Onstad played at UBC, though that was after he had played several seasons in the defunct-CSL. (Canadian amateur and eligibility rules are different than NCAA ones and athletes can still play university sports after a pro career. Happens in hockey a lot.)

    But other than those two, what Canadian MLS players played college ball IN Canada?
     
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  2. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    I'll be curious to see how much Caleb plays Fehr and fellow-young CB Andrew Jean-Baptiste. I also wonder if this impacts Portland's plans to sign Akron's Mike Gallego, whose homegrown rights they traded for. Gallego mostly played CB at Akron and the Red Bulls academy, though he is a bit undersized for a CB.

    Hard to imagine a team having three CBs that young so either Gallego plays a different position in MLS, they don't sign him or there's a trade afoot.
     
  3. Balerion

    Balerion Member+

    Aug 5, 2006
    Roslindale, MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If they join forces with the stars toiling in overlooked Latino rec leagues in the US, they could form a league that would rival MLS.
     
  4. SweetOwnGoal

    SweetOwnGoal Member

    Jan 5, 2003
    11.9986 km from BMO Field
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    As anyone that has looked at a map would tell you Windsor, Ontario is the Canadian SW.
     
  5. EvilTree

    EvilTree Member+

    Canadian S.C
    Canada
    Nov 20, 2007
    Frozen Swampland, Soviet Canuckistan
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Geoff Aunger, Gabe Gala (though at same time while at TFC I think), Mark Watson

    Most Canadian players go through NCAA because at best, Canadian university is at about NCAA III level right now, though some teams might be NCAA II level (Simon Fraser University does play in NCAA II)
     
  6. SweetOwnGoal

    SweetOwnGoal Member

    Jan 5, 2003
    11.9986 km from BMO Field
    Club:
    Toronto FC

    Some MLS academies are utilizing the CIS (Canadian college) now. There is a certain truth to the idea that they are under-scouted. MLS scouting networks are still very much in their infancy and it's a bit naive to think that there aren't holes in the way they approach things.

    There are kids in CIS that are as good as some at the combine. It seems a bit... stubborn to not at least invite a couple in to have a closer look. What's the harm?

    That said, CIS is likely, at best, NCAA D2 quality. Like D2, you're looking at longshots. You might get the odd kid that fell through the cracks that has some raw skills and is athletic, but any sure thing is either on the academies or in D1.
     
  7. FlipsLikeAPancake

    Jul 6, 2010
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    fyp
     
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  8. EvilTree

    EvilTree Member+

    Canadian S.C
    Canada
    Nov 20, 2007
    Frozen Swampland, Soviet Canuckistan
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Also there is this thing of most of the Canadians playing in CIS would count as an international for US based MLS teams, so not much of a value for those teams.
     
  9. Felixx219

    Felixx219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 8, 2004
    Kansas City, MO
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    SKC DP announcement press conference at 1PM CST: bit.ly/T5Rtcf
     
  10. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    Defender. Shortstop. What's the difference? ;)
     
  11. Felixx219

    Felixx219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 8, 2004
    Kansas City, MO
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yellowbismark repped this.
  12. Autogolazo

    Autogolazo BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 19, 2000
    Bombay Beach, CA
  13. RapidStorm

    RapidStorm Member+

    Jan 30, 2005
    Denver, CO
  14. Autogolazo

    Autogolazo BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 19, 2000
    Bombay Beach, CA
    You're right--I forgot him b/c of 4-4-2 announced by Schellas. I really don't know how they're going to fit those players in, then. Can't see them leaving Luccin or Jacobson all by themselves at DM.

    More Dallas news (perhaps)--this is claiming Pertuz back to Colombia with DIM:

    http://www.futbolred.com/liga-posto...afara-a-una-firma-del-dim-de-bolillo/12461502
     
  15. Balerion

    Balerion Member+

    Aug 5, 2006
    Roslindale, MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If true, Dallas' decision to take Stephen Keel in the Re-Entry Draft would make more sense.
     
  16. CANPRO

    CANPRO Member+

    Dec 23, 2002
    How many Canadian kids were playing on good NCAA teams before Canadian USSDA teams? Pretty close to none, now it's different, pretty quickly.

    Exposure is everything. It's the exact same thing at this.
     
  17. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    Canadian kids have been playing college ball in the US long before the advent of the academy system.

    Here is a sampling. I'm leaving a LOT off.

    Said Ali (Robert Morris)
    Robbie Aristodemo (Tulsa)
    Richard Asante (Syracuse)
    Rob Baarts (Portland)
    Jason Bent (Maryland)
    Patrice Bernier (Syracuse)
    Adam Braz (Fairfield)
    Felix Brillant (Franklin Pierce)
    Adrian Cann (Louisville)
    Chaka Daley (Providence)
    Jamie and Rhian Dodds (Robert Morris)
    Alex Elliott (Portland)
    Iain Fraser (Hartwick)
    Sean Fraser (Memphis)
    Rob Friend (UC Santa Barbara)
    Simon Gatti (Rhode Island)
    Gabriel Gervais (Syracuse)
    Tyler Hemming (Hartwick)
    Jordan Hughes (Coastal Carolina)
    Tyler Hughes (Coastal Carolina)
    Carmine Isacco (Maryland)
    Dejan Jakovic (Alabama-Birmingham)
    Michael Luk (Winthrop)
    Rob Marinaro (Clemson)
    Josue Mayard (Fairleigh Dickinson)
    Rumba Munthali (Alabama-Birmingham)
    Olivier Occean (Southern Connecticut State)
    Andrew Olivieri (Southern Connecticut State)
    Dominic Oppong (Buffalo)
    Marco Reda (Winthrop)
    Mike Reynolds (George Mason)*
    Tosaint Ricketts (UW-Green Bay)
    Tyler Rosenlund (UC Santa Barbara)
    Adrian Serioux (New Haven)
    Josh Simpson (Portland)
    Paul Stalteri (Clemson)
    Greg Sutton (St. Lawrence)
    Fred Thompson (George Mason)
    Justin Thompson (Fairfield)
    Josh Wagenaar (Hartwick)
    Chris Williams (Mobile)
    Davide Xausa (Portland)

    *Best player I ever had the privilege of being on the same playing field as and someone who died way too soon.
     
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  18. CANPRO

    CANPRO Member+

    Dec 23, 2002
    That's over a period of several years. Stalteri went to Clemson in 95-96, Sutton was at St Lawrence in 87-08. Isacco went to Maryland in 89-92!!!! So you put together a small list over what, a 15 year period?

    Right now, at this very moment, from the Whitecaps 14 man - u18 team last year, there are:
    Ben McKendry - UNM
    Callum Irving - Kentucky
    Daniel Stanese - FGCU
    Declan Rodriguez - Milwakee
    Wesley Cain - Committed to WSU next year

    Jason Van Blerk - Simon Fraser - SFU NCAA 2 - final four
    Alex Rowley - Simon Fraser - SFU - NCAA 2 - final four

    I add the two kids from SFU because word is MLS scouts actually come watch their games quite frequently. Not a chance Sounders or Timbers would be watching these two kids if they were playing CIS ball.

    Toronto FC
    Omario Morris - Akron
    Allando Matheson - UConn
    Jay Champman - Michigan State
    Jordan Murrell - Syracuse
    Parker Seymour - Spent the year at Michigan State after being at Maryland last year
    Garret Cyprus - Virginia Commonwealth
    Chad Bush - Duke

    That's just off the top of my head. This year ONLY, compared with more than a decade for your list.

    A lot of these players wouldn't be in the NCAA without Sum CUP/USSDA exposure. There are good players who were club mates that went the CIS route who are good players that won't ever get the chance to impress anyone into landing in the combine the way an NCAA guy might. MLS teams just don't take the CIS seriously.
     
  19. Hararea

    Hararea Member+

    Jan 21, 2005
    Frighteningly impressive list, but only a UVa guy would dis Sasho Cirovski like that. :p

    Getting back to Simon Fraser, is there any possibility they could go D-I? They made the semifinals of the D-II tournament this year, but to prepare talent for MLS, they'd be better served facing stronger opposition.
     
  20. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    I think that's their plan.

    It's a really big school - something like 33K - so they'd have the resources to go D-I. It would certainly be good for college soccer, especially on the west coast, if they did.
     
  21. Sandon Mibut

    Sandon Mibut Member+

    Feb 13, 2001
    It's also a tiny fraction of the Canadian kids who have played college soccer in the US over the years.

    You can either choose to believe me or not. That's up to you. But I know a thing or two about this issue and believe me when I say that American universities have been recruiting a lot of Canadian kids regularly long before the advent of the academy system.

    I'm not going to argue with you because it's like debating whether the earth is flat.
     
  22. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rapids President Tim Hinchey tweeted that they'll be signing a left-footed CB/LB this week. Rumor is that he will be from Central/South America.

    Of course Hinchey also tweeted that we've re-signed Thomas (no official announcement yet), Wynne (no official announcement yet), and that Rivero was being signed by the club (eventually ended up being a loan). So he tends to jump the gun on these things.
     
  23. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is apparently Diego Calderon from LDU Quito

    http://www.teleamazonas.com/index.p...iego-calderon-sale-de-liga-y-jugara-en-la-mls

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diego_Calderón
     
  24. FlipsLikeAPancake

    Jul 6, 2010
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  25. KensingtonSC

    KensingtonSC Still Lazy After All These Years

    FC Vaduz / Philadelphia Union
    Jan 7, 2010
    Andalusia, PA
    Club:
    FC Vaduz
    That would be two players from LDU Quito coming to MLS. I'm guessing that Ecuador is the new Colombia.
     

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