2012/13 Shinji Kagawa @ Manchester United (ENG/CL) Thread [R]

lol I really don't get why you all are making such a big fuss
it's just as he said: it's not that he's afraid of taking the number 7, it's that he wants to prove to be worth it before.
It's not that strange to think that way for a japanese. See Kiyo not getting the 10?

Meanwhile in Japan...

Oh yeah, somebody that vain will never fit into the other side of Man U player history, with the preening, media savy, pop culture driven legacy, of the Man United #7's .

I'm all for earning what your given in life, but I thought he already did a major part of that with his performances for Dortmund? It may seem like a silly overreaction, but the poor/slow combination of ability with confidence, has seen many star players fail to be all they could be at Man U. He obviously has all the drive and ability in place, but if he doesn't grab every opportunity to show people within the club what time it is, with SAF still around, he'll just be dropped, and then eventually lose his new toy sparkle.

The joke with this scenario now, is that he didn't want to create any fuss, but he's actually gone and created a whole lot more (for the English press at least) by doing something basically unheard of within the club, by hesitating on something which is typically seen a pretty big gift, if offered. I mean, for all the business of cultural differences, I couldn't see Honda doing something like this .

If you read the united article by which Shinji stated they have to wait for Sir Alex to come back from his holiday to designate him a number. I think the media is taking everything out of context and the translation from Japanese to English is very much incorrect.

Shinji Stated
"We did [discuss it] but nothing will be confirmed until Sir Alex comes back," Kagawa explained. "Since I am very new to the club, I have no intention to get an important number. Let's wait and see how it goes.
You never know he may end up with number 7 but really who care about number.
Paul Scholes never really care about number, and he was one of untied best player and Scholes could have gotten any number he wanted.

Anyway I listen to BBC five live and talksport everyday and there wasn't really much mention about Kagawa. It's alway Eden Harzard

Cool. The lost in translation thing has happened many times before this, and the English press will no doubt make sure it happens many more times in the future too .

On Scholes, he never cared about much beyond playing for Man United. Money, status, and the other trappings of fame, just didn't do it for him, as Scholes was always like a old school throwback to a football related 'Life on Mars'. He only did his first TV interview two years ago , and that was because he planned on retiring , so the extra attention of carrying a more prized number would have been wasted on his Shaolin Monk persona.

Get used to it. BBC and especially Talksport radio platforms, are over populated with the London Mafia tabloid establishment. They have whole segments on Arsenal, and manage to talk about West Ham, just as much as they discuss the nations more historic clubs. So even though Kagawa has achieved more, and moved to the bigger club, you should expect to hear Hazard's name a ridiculous amount in the run up to the new season.

Actually, Batfink, I'll just say this as the means of cultural exchange (i.e. not having a go at you), but leaping from requesting a personal number to rejecting a particular number is a media speculation. The gap created there is just a difference of hypothesis.

"Lost in translation", however, is more on how you have extracted Kagawa's personality in a very non-Japanese way. In Japanese, which is not a language of contracts, the interpretation by the listener holds the key. You almost have to assume is that the speaker is unclear, even if the translated sentences are clear in the English context. It works in Japan as we have a relatively standardized mannerism and figure of speech, but it can be hard to wrap your head around if you're of a foreign cultural background (probably Anglo-Saxon based culture in here). That gap you might experience (or have already experienced) is the "lost in translation" bit.

Fascinating, no?

Thanks, but I was going on the English speaking press, not personal misguided Anglo Saxon opinion, or was the English press the misguided Anglo Saxon opinion your trying to highlight

Personally I just hoped that even in his relatively short time in Europe, Kagawa would be more aware of the cultural differences when talking to the Western media, and especially anything to do with the British press .

The English sports writers are notoriously crafty at engineering bullsh*t, but this time every global English langue piece of news relating to him, had the same heading themed around the lines of "Kagawa rejects Man United #7" . Gathering all the info now though, I can see huge holes in what was initially reported, but lost in translation, or based on a poor interpretation of the overall context, it still wasn't the first introduction I was hoping for Kagawa to make in front of the "only a shirt seller" sceptics.

Batfink, that's not what I said. Rejecting #7 is but one of many media speculations and started in Japan. Nothing "lost in translation" in the reports themselves, English or Japanese. The personality analysis was where "lost in translation" crept in, whoever the instigator may have been.

Anyway, on a more general point, I agree with you that Kagawa needs to be careful with what he says especially in England.

It seems that Manchester United will play Messi's Barcelona on the 8th of August.

Manchester City perhaps?

So your telling me Kagawa can't even trust the Japanese press? LOL.

Man U have a pretty decent strangle hold on the flow of information relating to everything taking place within their own club, but with the Japanese press following his every move, you can bet a few more random thoughts get passed onto sources that will love to create further bits of unnecessary drama .

I already sense that the English speaking media are trying to focus on a weak Kagawa vs Hazard battle for EPL supremacy , so we'll see what happens as they attempt to stir that one up throughout the season.

Where is this one going to take place?

It will be played in Sweden, in Goteborg. Just check it on the official manutd site.

Sorry Batfink, you've lost me. We might not even be on the same subject? I was addressing the link between a rejection of something (#7 in this example) and being weak/intimidated; that link is a case of "lost in translation" and I see many examples of this elsewhere in life. It's a common culture shock and I mentioned it here just because the exchange on the previous page happened to illustrate this elegantly. That's all.

Yeah, I'm talking about media relations, while your talking mistaken cultural differences, but I get what your saying, and vice versa .

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/park-ji-sung-believes-new-signing-883166

so park speaks jpese, i wonder if kagawa will address park using 'jisung san' or 'aniki?.

in korean honorific, a younger male addressing to older male who are generally in the same age group, just use 'hyung'. so if kawaga would say to park 'jisung-hyung'. which i assume is the same for 'aniki' in japanese. i at least know the word 'aniki' because of professional baseball player named kanemoto of hansen tigers (ethnic korean).

i don't really know about japanese honorifics anymore than i read on wiki. but, i'm watching japanese dubbed anime called 'slamdunk'(awesome manhwa btw not so much for the anime, i own all 24 volume of the complete edition in korean) and i noticed a person like sendo is addressing his upper classman teammate uzumi as 'uzumi-san'. which i was kind of surprised, because korean equivalent of san is 'si'(strong S pronunciation). A person who's only a yr younger in school, would never use 'si' to upper classman in korea. then again, watching slamdunk is japanese dubbed version, i don't think i ever heard anyone saying 'aniki' to anyone.

A "senior" honorific in japanese is -senpai.

We Japanese are really afraid that Shinji will become a new Berbatov.
I don't rate Kagawa very highly as a 'high pressure performer'. I know he did well in the German Cup Final, but Bayern were a shambles, and aside that, most occasions he had quiet games vs. Bayern. Actually I think he tended to be more subdued against the highest ranked BuLi clubs,
being more prolific against mid-table and weaker teams. Unlike him, a lot of Park Ji-Sung's goals came against the top teams especially Arsenal. He should learn something from the Asian legend.

oh hi, he's back

But he's right on the last sentence!

56 goals in 149 appearences over 4 seasons? Sign me up!!

Kagawa will wear #26. Valencia gets #7.

http://www.manutd.com/en/News-And-F...ad-numbers-for-valencia-and-new-signings.aspx

Well, at least numbering issue is gone. Let us see him play like a proud united player along with a great history players who worm number 26.........

Should've taken number seven jersey

Just taken this foto off wiki and share this thought.



Never thought we see a Korean flag among the world's great playing for the bigesst club in the world. Now, two nations who practically represents the entire continent plays for biggest club in the world.