2009/2010 Bundesliga Match Day 8: Borussia Mönchengladbach v Borussia Dortmund [R]

Discussion in 'Borussia Dortmund' started by footyfan1, Oct 2, 2009.

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How Do You Think Saturday's Match Between Borussia Mönchengladbach and Borussia Dortmund Will End?

Poll closed Oct 4, 2009.
  1. Big Victory For Dortmund (By two goals or more)

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  2. Close Victory For Dortmund

    0 vote(s)
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  3. Big Victory For Mönchengladbach (By two goals or more)

    0 vote(s)
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  4. Close Victory For Mönchengladbach

    0 vote(s)
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  5. Draw

    0 vote(s)
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  6. I don't know

    0 vote(s)
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  1. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    Like the final match of last season at Mönchengladbach, this match also has to be one of the most important "Battle of the Borussias" for a long time.

    However, this one is "important" for all the wrong reasons if you're looking at it from a Borussia Dortmund point of view.

    I don't know of anyone who would have ever fathomed that 7 matches into the season, Borussia Dortmund would be one spot above the Bundesliga's relegation playoff position (15th place), separated from the team in that postion (1. FC Nürnberg/FCN) by one point, with FCN holding the advantage in goal difference by three goals.

    But that is where we are. Where is the "other Borussia", you might ask?

    They are sitting three spots above us in 12th place, just one point ahead of us and one goal ahead of us on goal difference.


    I know that no entire season for any club has ever been "decided" after 8 matches.

    However, this BVB team needs a psychological boost and it needs one quickly.

    Pretty soon, these guys might just start believing they can't get it done if results keep going against them.


    I'm also getting tired of BVB management and the people writing the content at the club's website making excuses for this team.

    How will they learn that maybe they need to change their ways if everyone keeps patting them on the back for FAILING??!!!


    For example, after the Schalke match, the writers at the BVB website talked about BVB having had 57% ball possession and writing that we know BVB's players were committed to trying to win the match because of how much they ran in the match.

    Well, from where I sit, ball possession itself doesn't mean a mother fucking thing!

    We can have 98% ball possession in a fucking game, but if that 98% ball possession produces no goals and in their 2% ball possession, the opponents score a goal, then guess what?

    THEY WIN THE FUCKING GAME!!

    Same shit with how much the team ran during the match! I don't give a fucking rat's ass about how much they ran during the match!

    If all that running doesn't produce anything, then what good is it??!!

    We've had this discussion about Nelson Valdez since he joined BVB. To his credit, Nelson Valdez is one of the hardest-working players for his team in the Bundesliga.

    However, the problem with Valdez is that all of his hard work RARELY brings about any PRODUCTION!!

    I think we all can agree that Ivica Olic is a star in this league now. Olic's game isn't really any different than Valdez's game.

    The difference between the two is that OLIC ACTUALLY PRODUCES SOMETHING with his efforts while Valdez largely does not!


    What will it take for BVB management and fans to realize that effort is all well and good, but in this game, it doesn't matter if that effort doesn't lead to any PRODUCTION?!

    Klopp and the team finally realizing this is what will get them over the top.

    One motto I learned in the U.S. Army that I live by to this day is:

    "If You Always Work Smart, You Don't Always Have To Work Hard"

    If you're consistently working harder than your opponents, yet, they consistently out-produce you, don't you think it would be SMART to take a look at how you do things and maybe make some changes???

    One thing I will give the writers at BVB's website credit for is that in the pre-match report for this match, they alluded to the fact that in Mönchengladbach, the BVB players as well as Klopp's tactics will be on trial!!

    I think that's how more BVB supporters have to start looking at things. Don't have blind trust in Jürgen Klopp just because BVB management does or they tell you that you should have blind trust. Question what they are doing. Think about how things could be done differently.

    One thing I've learned about BVB management in all these years is that left unchecked, they will lead you to disaster. Only when the fans voice displeasure, will these idiots make changes. After all, at times, they seem to use kissing up to the local fans as cover from exposure that they don't do their jobs as well as they should be doing them.

    And no, that is not calling for Klopp's head. But they need to realize that they cannot keep doing the total same shit, allow the players to keep doing that and somehow expect it to start working.

    Now, there has been some improvement in the last couple of matches. I even said after Schalke that if we keep doing that, goals and results will come.

    Those are things they can continue to do. I especially notice better play at strikers from Zidan and Barrios.

    However, there are other subtle changes that need to be made, especially in midfield and defense. This is what I am ranting about.

    But let's see what happens in Mönchengladbach before we go further with that.

    Let's go to history between these two.

    In 37 Bundesliga matches in Mönchengladbach before Saturday, BVB's record is 8 victories, 14 draws and 15 defeats.

    In the last 10 matches at Mönchengladbach, our record is 3 victories, 2 draws and 5 defeats.

    Our last victory in Mönchengladbach was on 14 August 2004.

    On that day, BVB won 3-2 before 53,100 spectators at Borussia Park.

    What is strange about that match is that all five goals were scored in the first 38 minutes of the match.

    Ivo Ulich opened the scoring for Mönchengladbach in the 7th minute.

    Niclas Jensen equalized for BVB on a free kick 6 minutes later.

    Then, 21 minutes later, things got crazy for four minutes.

    Markus Hausweiler gave Mönchengladbach a 2-1 lead in the 34th minute.

    One minute later, Jan Koller equalized for BVB and Ewerthon added what would be the winning goal for BVB in the 38th minute.

    Bert van Marwijk was still the BVB coach and BVB's starters went the entire 90 minutes in this match.

    They were:

    Guillaume Warmuz, Evanilson, Guy Demel, André Bergdölmo, Niclas Jensen, Sunday Oliseh, Sebastian Kehl, Dédé, Tomas Rosicky, Ewerthon, Jan Koller


    This was the second match of the 2004/2005 season.

    At the end of that season, we finshed 7th. Back then, 6th place was good enough for the UEFA Cup (now the UEFA Euro League). We finished two points behind 6th place Leverkusen.

    Mönchengladbach finished just one point above the drop zone.


    Since then, in three matches played at Mönchengladbach's Borussia Park, we've lost twice and drawn once.

    You might remember that the draw might as well have been a loss. Of course, I am referring to the draw at Mönchengladbach on the final day of last season.

    Not winning that match cost us a spot in the UEFA Euro League this season. And now that I see what we are this season, I'm happy for Germany fans that HSV got that spot and we didn't.

    We would be fucking embarrassing the country right now. But then again, I guess not any more than Hertha BSC Berlin is.

    However, Hertha did what they had to do last season. BVB did not.

    And the local fans will whine that Trochowski was off-side in Frankfurt.

    My response to that is, if we had just done the fucking job ourselves, that Trochowski goal would not have mattered!

    But of course, all the local fans buy the bullshit Watzke, Zorc and Klopp fed them about "Well, if the referee had........"

    And we hear even more of their bullshit excuses blaming referees this season.

    The only match I buy that "the referee cost us" bullshit this season is the one against Schalke.

    The rest are just bullshit excuses for a team that continues to fail, fail, FAIL!! :mad:

    They'd better get their fucking act together in Mönchengladbach.

    If not, people might start to turn on them........
    1 person likes this.


  2. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    "We have to keep the faith in the big picture"

    [1.10.] One team has lost four games in a row, the other is stuck in a six-game winless run. When Gladbach coach Michael Frontzeck talked about " an important game that could set the course for both sides in the next couple of weeks," he had the full approval of Jürgen Klopp. Borussia versus Borussia - both are eager to win. But on Saturday at about 2020 CET, there will be only one winner.


    Click here for the rest of the story.



    However, take a look at the final two paragraphs here......

    The BVB coach has spotted a degree of uncertainty in his young team. "The lads really want to get out of this situation," said Klopp, "but they are also aware about all the debates held about them and the little faith people have in them."

    ***They should fight harder and SMARTER to win back that faith.



    The club is in full support of their coach, and the coach is in full support of his team. But nevertheless, Klopp is currently "wondering what to continue and what to change?" The tactics as well as the players are on trial. His advise for the game in Gladbach: "Make tough tackles when needed, and play football when possible."


    ***In my opinion, Klopp's tactics have been on trial since last season. I still believe it was his tactics that drove Petric and Frei away.......
  3. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    Projected Rosters, Starting Line-Ups & Other Match Information From The Official BVB Website



    German Bundesliga, 8th Matchday
    BOR. MÖNCHENGLADBACH - BORUSSIA DORTMUND
    Saturday, October 3, 2009, 6:30 PM CET (Stadium At Borussia Park)



    Bor. M´gladbach Projected Starting Lineup:
    Bailly (GK) - Stalteri, Brouwers, Dante, Levels - Marx, Meeuwis - Matmour, Arango - Colautti, Bobadilla

    Bor. M´gladbach Projected Substitutes: Heimeroth (GK) - Kleine, Reus, Friend, Jaures, Arango, Bradley, Neuville


    Doubtful For Bor. M´gladbach: Reus (undisclosed training injury), Stalteri (lumbago)


    Out For Bor. M´gladbach: Daems (torn knee cartlige), Callsen-Bracker (foot inflammation), Löhe (torn elbow ligaments)




    Borussia Dortmund Projected Starting Lineup: Weidenfeller (GK) - Owomoyela, Subotic, Santana, Dede - Hummels - Tinga, Sahin - Hajnal - Barrios, Valdez


    Borussia Dortmund Projected Substitutes: Ziegler (GK) - Schmelzer, Feulner, Bender, Kuba, Großkreutz, Zidan, Rangelov


    Doubtful For Borussia Dortmund: No one


    Out For Borussia Dortmund: Kehl (Pelvic Bone Inflammation)



    Referee: Manuel Gräfe (Berlin)

    Assistants: Christian Dingert, Markus Häcker - Fourth Official: Thomas Metzen



    Spectators: Of the 54,019 places in Borussia Park, a few places in the guest block will be available at the stadium ticket stands on match day.


    [​IMG]
  4. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    Please, please....let us win a game - please!!!!!!!!


  5. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    We'll win this one. Confident this time ;)

    I hope Bender plays today. I'd play Barrios and Zidan up front, however it's likely that Klopp will choose Valdez anyway. Is Blaszczykowski fit?
  6. Bundesligafan

    Bundesligafan Member

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    i wish i had ur confidence
  7. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    My feed died but we are ahead thanks to Lucas Barrios (38')!!! :D
  8. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    Finally, Barrios scored. I think we all saw already before that game that he has the best potential of all BVB strikers.

    And to the rest of the game: Awful, Just awful!
  9. MetroChile

    MetroChile Member+

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    That's rite: y'll bettah rekonyze! :D
  10. MetroChile

    MetroChile Member+

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    Amen to that! :cool:
  11. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

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    More Lucas' goals, please...:)
  12. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    That's pretty much what I've been saying all season.





    I haven't watched it yet. Had to go to a party last night. Only saw the Barrios goal.

    Will the rest of the match make me scream for us to sign Lincoln some more?? :cool:
  13. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    It will, yes.
  14. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    I was afraid of that. I'll probably watch it tomorrow (Monday).
  15. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    Here are some things I'm taking from the articles, e-mails and other messages I have read.

    I will try to watch the match sometime tonight.

    If any of you saw the match and have the time, maybe you can let me know if my thoughts after reading so much are on the right track:


    1) Hummels was so good in the center that if he keeps this up, Santana might not get his job back: Not only did we keep a clean sheet, but Hummels was the "Kicker" Man of the match and earned a place on their top 11 of the week. Having Hummels next to him also seems to bring out the best in Subotic.


    2) Sven Bender is looking like the long-term solution at sweeper if Kehl can never get back: Meaning, Bender was our best player in Hannover, got sick, but then came back and got a respectable "3.5" rating from "Kicker" in Gladbach. Hmmm....... :cool:


    3) Our offensive midfield is still pathetic: From what I'm reading, it was Sahin's worst match of the season and Hajnal was his usual sucky self as he's been most of the season to this point. "smithfan" told me this match would make me demand they sign Lincoln even more. It seems the people who do player ratings totally agree.


    4) Weidenfeller had to make at least one big save to preserve the victory. KC also said Weidenfeller made some good saves in the match.


    5) Zidan and Barrios are probably going to wind up being our long term-strike force with Tinga playing on the right side of midfeld. This would relegate Valdez and Kuba to the "joker" roles they played on Saturday.


    6) While we deserved to win the match, there was nothing "impressive" about it. KC said the guys on the SportStudio said it was a "Relegation Match-up On The 8th Matchday".




    That about sums up what I've been able to gather from reading articles and e-mails. I'm hoping this is a first step for the team.


    This team needed something to prove to themselves that they can indeed win. Even something seemingly as crappy as this can help.



    Turns out something I screamed in my pre-match rant came to pass. According to "Kicker", Gladbach had the advantage in ball possession 52% to 48%. But we scored the goal and we won the game.


    I hope to not see or hear anymore of those f#cking "ball possession" or "we ran so much" excuses when the team blows a match.

    If we can win while having less ball possession than our opponents, telling me we had more after we've lost a match isn't going to make me feel "better" about losing!
  16. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    agreed.


    Yes.


    yes.


    hmm...my boss (who was in the stadium) called me and said that Weidenfeller was huge in this game. But in fact, I thought that it was an ok-performance. I expect those saves from a Bundesliga goalkeeper.

    To me, Zidan and Barrios are our No.1 strikers too. However, I doubt that Klopp thinks so. I actually expect Valdez to be the No.1 striker in Klopp's eyes soon again.:rolleyes:
    I thought that Tinga sucked, tbh. He slows down our whole offensive play.


    yes.
  17. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    Just watched it. I shouldn't have wasted my time.

    But at least we won. :eek:
  18. smithfan

    smithfan Member+

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    Oh, I forgot to warn you. :D
  19. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    You didn't forget to warn me. I just watched it anyhow.

    When it comes to BVB, I can be a bit of a masochist. :eek:
  20. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

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    The problem with this is that too many also expect "Bundesliga goalkeepers" to be "perfect" too.

    They are not. No keeper is. Too much can happen in a match with shot deflections, own goals, etc, to just take for granted that a "Bundesliga goalkeeper should make those saves."

    I think he also noticed that Weidenfeller commanded his area very well in that match.

    I noticed a few good saves, but his command of the area stood out to me.

    I thought we were also pretty lucky on some situations that Gladbach simply was not good enough to make us pay for some defensive errors on both wings.




    If Valdez does get back out there, it will have to be in place of Zidan. Klopp has to realize that Barrios is a player who can pull a goal from nothing from time to time.




    Tinga might do that, but he gives us what little defensive stability we have in midfield and when he does get forward, I think he's much better than Kuba in the opponent's penalty area.

    Kuba hasn't shown me anything this season that would warrant playing him ahead of Tinga.

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