But I so desperately want to get onto a cramped, overheated metal tube where my legs don't fit in the space in front of me and people continually slam their bags against my shoulders as they shimmy down the aisle
I could care less whether he sits on one of the biggest piles of cash. I want someone who's committed and got the resources (financial and otherwise) to make the Fire contenders. Interesting though that a good number of NFL owners are investing in MLS. Maybe someone will make Hauptmann an offer he can't refuse.
There's an apple that flew far from the tree! Rocky Wirtz had a plan. He took the most miserable Chicago sports team and made them the most successful in what seemed like overnight. He did in fact invest wisely, hired the right people and gave them the resources to succeed.
Yeah, just think how good the Blackhawks could be if only Chicago were not so unattractive so that we could sign a couple of foreigners.
The same thing that might make Andy willing to sell is going to also make it harder to find a buyer. The league is at 22/23 teams, depending on the Miami situation. Garber has said that the plan is to hold the league at 24 teams for a while. So if Andy is in to get the quick ROI of the expansion fees, that is going to dry up really soon. Then its going to be about making money the hard way. God only knows what MLS or Fire financials look like, but I'm going to guess they are significantly less appealing when you can't count on your split of $100m every year.
Let this be an example of someone who's snark and hate has so overwhelmed him that he thinks this is an intelligent argument. Difficulties in recruiting can be overcome when you can pay someone ten times what they would get in European hockey leagues. Other NHL teams get their share of foreigners too, the Hawks are not some kind of premium destination for talent. However, MLS isn't in a position to do that. Not many people think Germany is an awesome place to visit either, but the Bundesliga can find players because they have higher revenue. Not even the big names get that kind of multiplier to come to MLS.
It's not all that hard. I have said this a number of times in here. Expansion is like any other expected value. A potential buyer and seller can easily place a value on those expected fees so that the time of sale doesn't matter. If I'm buying the Fire a couple of years ago, I know that I will be getting income from expansion fees and I know about what that will be (and could certainly get help from the league in placing a value on that.) If I buy after the expansion fees have been paid, then I subtract that from the purchase price. So, it isn't easier or harder to sell the team now. So, in other words, if the team were worth 50 five years ago with expected expansion fees over the next decade of 20 per team, then he might have sold the team for 65 back then and the new owner pockets the 20 over time. If he holds the team, he pockets the 20 and then sells the team for 50 at the end of expansion. The expansion fee collection is not the issue at all. A new buyer is looking at the overall value of the asset (meaning the Chicago Fire) over time. They look at those really good demographic numbers of soccer compared to other sports with 12-30 year olds and they value the asset based on what they think the Chicago Fire will be in 20 or 30 years. Steinbrenner bought the Yankees in the early 70s. AFTER expansion brought in the Royals, Pilots (to become the Brewers) Expos, Mets and others. The only expansion to follow his purchase was Toronto and the Seattle Mariners. Guess what? Old George really didn't give a rats ass about those fees. His 10 million investment has now turned into 1.5 billion or so. All of that without a lot of profit year to year. It's just the value of what someone else will pay for his team that is important. Someone would buy the Fire if they see the value being significantly more in the future. To go from current values up to those half a billion and higher value the ownership groups want, the owners will have to attract some of the better talent in the world. They will not look kindly on Andycakes and his ilk that aren't looking to pitch in on the effort to grow the sport, but instead are just hanging on for the ride as the rising tide lifts his boat with no investment or effort.
No, my post was a joke. I was making fun of your idiocy as I have no problem seeing the apples to oranges problems with comparing MLS to the NHL. However, just to tease out your idiocy, there have certainly been foreign players who have picked Chicago over other NHL cities with other things being equal because this is a great quality of life. I guess you have a significantly harder time running circles around humor.
Even if my post didn't embarrass you into changing your mind and that's your pathetic attempt to cover up, people's retarded snark has a way of becoming accepted fact around here through mindless repetition. It's best to nip that kind of thing in the bud.
Andy will get all his money back with just expansion fees. Everything else is pure profit. He can sell the team for what he paid for it and it is still a 100% return. Collect expansion fees and profit.
Hopefully you're right, because then he'll probably look to sell when the easy money (expansion fees) dries up.
Have you not been paying attention to how much he has been spending in operating losses? The expansion fees don't even cover that.
You guys must all have me on ignore as well. I'm trying to think of a way to say this that makes my point a bit easier. Andy doesn't have to wait for anything. The parties to a transaction would know and value the expected expansion fees into any deal. So, Andy would get roughly the same thing two years ago, now or two years from now. Your problem is that your owner likely sees the overall value of his asset appreciating rapidly over a longer period of time. Not based on any one time fees or payments, but based on the increasing value of tv contracts, tickets, merchandising, etc. Much of that WILL happen with no help from Andy. He found a way to ride the coattails of Uncle Phil and the others willing to invest in the league and in their teams. He just has to keep enough of you interested enough to fill 2/3 of his stadium and then sit back and watch the good works of others drastically increase the value of his shares in both MLS and SUM. He ain't going anywhere and he has killed off the original Fire club. So, what you follow going forward is Andy's franchise investment, not the Chicago Fire Soccer Club. He wants to create a Wrigley Field environment for hipsters to come out on a Saturday for a little pre party before they hit the clubs. That is enough for him to get by.
Well, you haven't been paying attention to any common sense either big boy. Not surprising. Small operating losses of a million here or there mean nothing. He works at reducing those by cutting back on fireworks, game day programs etc. I'm guessing that in your calculations about how much he is "spending" on operating losses, you are not factoring in how much he makes off of SUM. In fact, I know you aren't because none of that is public, unless of course, Andycakes has shared that information with you in a quite moment. My guess is that he doesn't lose a penny when all parts of the investment are factored in, and none of that matters anyway. The overall value of the Fire has increased since he bought the team and that is what truly matters. Value of the asset and cash flow. The rest is all noise. And I defer to your expertise on valueless noise.
Not to mention, of course, that any monetary "loss" is not really a loss, as he can write most losses off and amortize players salaries, etc. Losses only become a problem when they exceed what can be digested. I have been reading some law journal articles on taxation and sports franchises lately. Hauptman is many things, but he clearly not stupid. He has an MBA from Harvard and, most likely, earned his (as opposed to, say, George W. Bush). Yes he "married into" money. But vulture capitalists are nothing if not clever. They are evil, but not clever. He is not losing any of his (and/or his wife's) money with the Fire. He is the anti-Bill Veeck. I think you may be right, and pena pirata mentioning certain people arguing that the Fire "being cool" is more important that winning. However, if this is his aim, he is making a big, big mistake. The Fire are not cool (at the moment), for the most part as Bridgeview is not cool, the team is not cool, the marketing of the team is not cool, the promotions at the games are not cool, the "communications" from the team are not cool. If he wants a "Wrigley Field" environment, he had better move the team to Wrigleyville or Wicker Park. He might have been able to pull this off at Soldier Field, by playing up everything (location, lakefront, stadium, cross promote with Lollapalooza,etc.), hype everything but the team. However, Bridgeview is a problem. I suspect that it part of the "beer bus" idea (probably the "driving force" behind it). Bring the douchebages to the venue, since you can't bring the team to the douchebags. He could really do this, if he manages to bring some additional concerts to Toyota Park, and really markets the hell out of the "experience" (of course that presupposes that there is an "experience" to market).
The tv ads for the beer buses is exactly for that purpose. Don't get me wrong, I have been a big supporter of beer buses to sporting events. I started riding the bus from Kincaids to the united center for Hawks games 25 years ago. But look at where he spends his marketing dollars. Billboards in Wrigleyville. Fire Fridays at hip city locations. etc. I would normally applaud all of this, but not if it is nearly the entire strategy. My thought is that he sees Section 8 as being a cool thing and he will try to draw hipsters from the city with Bridgeview almost being an "exotic" location where they would normally never go. The same way that raves took off when they were held in old warehouses in odd neighborhoods.
Funny, because I got a program Saturday. Two actually, one for the Fire and one for the Red Stars. My calculations on how much he is losing is based on two things: The Forbes estimates. SUM revenue isn't public, but then MLS revenue isn't public either. The obvious large expenditures the team has made compared to the seemingly low revenue: cheap tickets that they still don't sell out, paying something like 5% of the team's total revenue just to get on TV. There are other elements to the strategy: The @ChicagoFire launched the "Soccer in the Community" program to support & grow the soccer community in Chicago. http://t.co/LBoxGhEQBV— MLSWORKS (@MLSWORKS) April 16, 2014 We're very excited to announce our new partnership with the Chicago Fire. With it's focus on player development,... http://t.co/UP6mEOKQgw— IL Youth Soccer (@ILYOUTHSOCCER) April 17, 2014 Outstanding! @ChicagoFire billboard with @magee9 standing tall & proud alongside iconic skyline #cf97 @ChooseChicago pic.twitter.com/ZgSiwjKqFu— Kevin Egan (@kev_egan) April 21, 2014
I have been warning you all about this strategy since I have been here. He is taking the marketing tact as McD did with the Cubs and the Hawks. Butts in the seats no matter who they are or how loyal they are. Section 8 will be the Bleachers of Toyota Park or the 300 Level of Toyota Park. Both were places were where the die hards were but now filled with people who need to be seen over watching and understanding the game.
If true, that'd be terrific. It's not as if die-hard fans wouldn't be able get in. 10,000 added douchebags is better than 10,000 empty seats. The problem is that it will never work for the Fire in Bridgeview.