Has Klinsmann ever played Donovan at left midfield? I don't recall. Klinsmann does seem to like to get some wide play from his wide mids more than just letting them cut inside, so I'm not entire sure Donovan is as suited out there the way we're setting up these days. I'd like to see Donovan get a run up front, just out of curiosity. We've not seen him get a game up top with a strong team behind him in quite a while, would be really interested to see that. I do wonder if the way Klinsmann has set things up, maybe with Dempsey out there in the middle, a forward up top (most likely Altidore), then Bradley pushing the pace in the midfield, we're only got room for worker bees left. Maybe steady eddy guys like Bedoya and Zusi are what Klinsmann wants from his wide midfielders and Donovan has to fight for that spot up top. I guess this is partially why I'd like to see him get a game there. Because I think as long as he's healthy and in form, we are a better team with Donovan out there. If slotting him into midfield upsets the balance, maybe up top. I'm just not sure we don't want a bigger body to hold onto the ball more there. Wherever he plays, he's going to have to start stepping it up if he wants anything beyond a bench role. He came on strong at the Gold Cup against weak opposition, but has shown little since then for the US and hasn't exactly been lighting it up in MLS. I've got my fingers crossed he steps things up in the next couple months and shows well in the send off series, but he does need to ramp things up over what we've seen lately.
Zusi's a better crosser, but Bedoya I think has better pace and quickness. Agreed, I think they could be an effective platoon. You don't think Fabian will be played on the left? Powers? The guy is uncapped. He also plays CM, not Donovan's position. If he keeps up his rookie of the year form this season, I expect we'll see him early next cycle. He was supposed to be at the January camp if not for his concussion. This statement is completely illogical. First off, we do have alternatives to Donovan. We could play with a combination of Fabian, Zusi and Bedoya on the wings. The fact that none of them is as good as Donovan isn't Klinsmann's fault. He also tried plenty of other wingers. Is it his fault Shea has had injury problems and can be a knucklehead? Did Klinsmann tear Josh Gatt's knee? Did Klinsmann turn Chris Pontius into glass? Yes, in the Mexico and Jamaica hex qualifiers.
Bolded - everybody has his comfort zone. There is no book on where a 10 plays. He keeps the team going forward to good effect. What I like about Powers is his restraint in going forward that allows others to get into the game as he distracts the enemy fire. Dono plays differently. He uses his running and vision to open angles that can be exploited by others. Italics - No. You are smarter than that, Flip. The names you mention have limitations that prevent them from reaching the threshold of a credible 10 at the WC level and you know it full well. Klinsmann's dull, slow-witted approach to the selection process has doomed us.
My point is that it isn't a like for like comparison. Powers wouldn't replace Donovan in the lineup, he could easily play alongside Donovan, so it is weird to lament Donovan's presence and Powers's absence. The lack of a "credible 10" isn't a problem of Klinsmann's creation, it is a problem with our player pool itself. You don't like the guys we have, and apparently don't like the other guys Klinsmann tried or wanted to try. So my question is, other than Dillon Powers, who are the players that Klinsmann is ignoring that in your view could have been a credible 10 at this year's world cup? Because honestly, do you really blame Klinsmann for not bringing in a rookie from last year who then got a concussion and who missed a bunch of preseason? If he had been healthy for camp cupcake, he would have been there. Heck, if he had taken a Generation Adidas deal a couple of years ago, perhaps he could have already been on the national team. His problem is one of timing. Turning pro so late and then getting hurt when called in isn't Klinsmann's fault.
He's a mid, but a creative mid rather than a speed guy on the flank. Put Donovan in the CAM role in a 4-2-3-1 and put Bedoya and Green on the flanks for speed. Dempsey is the sub this time around.
LA have played 4 league games (two fewer than most of the rest of the league in a start/stop schedule) - two against one of the league leaders RSL, 1 against Chivas, and this past one against Vancouver. They also played 2 CCL games in March. He was stellar in the game against Chivas, and good but not great in the other games. No, he doesn't have 5 goals in 2 games like Clint, but he's not been mediocre. Not sure where that is coming from for MLS. LA also has a new diamond midfield which is different for the team - a possession based game that shows off the midfield + Keanovan's passing skills, something the team is getting used to. His stats show someone that is actively involved creatively. He's also the one player that has been shifted everywhere - LM, RM, CAM, SS. So he's not setting the world on fire, but it's not like Zusi is blowing the doors off the building either. Both look good and like they are getting in gear. Against Clint Dempsey's two week bar, no contest. Still too early to judge anything for any of the MLS players imo (including SJ, who have also played very few games) except to say Clint is on fire. I'm hoping May brings more clues as to form, once these players have more consistent time under their belts. MLS scheduling has been kinda funky through March/April for a few teams. Same goes for Omar Gonzalez - who looked MUCH better last week, but would like him to string together some solid performances. LA's early schedule has done them no favors. The weird home/home this week with Vancouver included. My preference on where to play LD depends on where Clint is playing. LM/RM/CAM/SS are all options. And he starts. I'm fine with him getting subbed in the 2nd half to preserve his legs. But I want his creativity on the pitch for as long as possible. I'd take that over "worker bees."
I agree with that. Landon just hasn't impressed much lately. Looks slow and not nearly the threat he was a couple years ago. GC was impressive but the competition level was poor and that form didn't really translate into increased form which he carried into this year. I've watched every LAG match this year and it's Keane putting that team on his back. Landon has had a few moments but he's not playing anywhere near the level Clint and Mikey are. That's worrying. Hopefully it does turn around as I have little confidence in Zusi starting a WC match. I'd much prefer Landon at RW based on experience and resume, but he does need to pick it up. If it's his knee which is the issue, tendonitis, that requires rest usually to heal and I don't see any rest coming his way.
Seems like the explosiveness comes and goes with LD. Last week it was mostly gone. Hopefully the knee is feeling better come May.
During the Vancouver game? He had multiple defensive/offensive runs and sprints up and down the pitch. LA also had the majority of possession playing keep away a good chunk of the game. I think he's playing good, but not great so far (Chivas and CCL game #2 excepted), but he hasn't looked like a snail imo except for the Mexico game. He picks his moments now. In his own words: http://espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/1...insmann-affecting-landon-donovan-game?cc=5901 sprint at 5:39: Time will tell what form May brings of course, but I don't think he looks especially bad right now.
Doug McIntyre's (ESPN) opinion, which seems fair and echoes what has been said in the thread: Landon Donovan, M, LA Galaxy (MLS) Why he’s here: Donovan has been ever-present through the Galaxy’s first four games, but he’s still looking for career goal 135, which would put him atop the MLS record books. On Saturday, he headed his best chance over the crossbar from close range. What this means: As Klinsmann’s benching of Donovan against Mexico reminded us, the Yanks’ all-time top scorer won’t start unless he’s at his best. He’s got more than two months to find his game before the Americans’ June 16 World Cup opener, but right now Donovan isn’t there. It's not that either man has shown poorly with the Galaxy, although Gonzalez was lucky to avoid an embarrassing own goal in the first half Saturday night. It's more that the pair has lacked the razor sharpness they'll need to be effective contributors for the Yanks this summer in Brazil. Clint, Maurice, Beckerman and Wondo are on Doug's "hot" list.
I give you my choice and you say no fair, who is the alternative. He could have tried out Powers at the Gold Cup but he was just going on and on and on about JF Torres and other known quantities. I love the nervy bias Klinsi has against college players. Gonzo, Zusi, Edu are Terrapins, Besler - Notre Dame, Cameron Rhode Island, Bedoya Boston College. Edit: I think Powers would essentially replace Donovan, yes. Donovan isnt scoring so much anymore and his value now is really as a facilitator.
Landon will probably have to step it up more to really be a lock starter, but that's me talking about him being a lock-starter. I would still go with him about 75% of the time (most would) and I happen to feel like Klinsi made a mistake not having him and Zusi on the pitch at the same time. It seems pretty basic. These two on either flank serving in crosses or drifting in and helping Michael Bradley dictate the flow of the game just makes a lot of sense. Of course, the last time we tried that, it was against Jamaica, and Landon wasn't in tip-top shape for that either, which is starting to get a tad annoying. Still, I like the idea of those two on the flanks - Landon, from the left, would be more direct and would drive at the backline a bit more like he did late against Mexico, while Zusi would perform the facilitator role, which I think he did a good job of in the last match. I like that his game has transformed into him making the most of dangerous runs being made not just in the box, but out of midfield, floating across the pitch and allowing guys like Bradley to move forward. I think this had a lot to do with how frequently Bradley charged forward, although he's always done that when given freedom.
You said "Klinsmann's dull, slow-witted approach to the selection process has doomed us." This implies that Klinsmann is consistently making the wrong choices, not that he hasn't called up one guy that you think will be a difference maker. Powers was a rookie. This is 20/20 hindsight. The guy was the 11th pick in the draft. He was highly thought of, but wasn't such a can't miss prospect that people felt the national team was only a matter of time. I'm confused, how does this show that Klinsmann has a bias against college players? All those guys he has given lots of playing time to. Then you don't understand soccer. Powers is a box to box midfielder. He wouldn't replace Donovan, he would be fighting with guys like Mix, Beckerman and Edu for a spot.
LD has been playing well, but so far he hasn't been as lethal as he was last year. He's still on 2 assists in 4 games though (4 in 6 if we count CCL)
Yup - those were the games I pointed out as well, Chivas and CCL game #2. I think our start/stop schedule hasn't done us any favors as we talk about on the LA forum. Keane just now looks like he's in form - lots of the rest of the team (especially Sarvas/Juninho) still getting there.
Like I said, Klinsmann keeps calling up Torres, Corona, Davis, et al after we have seen that their abilities make them questionable for Brazil. I am just saying he could have given others a trial. Hard to see how that would be considered questionable procedure and I cant agree with 20/20 hindsight when Powers already had a pretty good history and I had him on my Gold Cup team before the Gold Cup. I think we are talking past each other on the Powers replacing Dono question. You say I do not understand soccer because I do not accept that Powers cant replace Donovan because Powers is a b2b mid. What I am saying is that Dono has traditionally been our 10 but he is not in good shape and not scoring goals (which made him prefered over other 10's who dont score as much) therefore we have to think about who is going to be pushing the play up the pitch. Since we cant afford two 10's, I leave Dono off and if he proves out in camp he goes back in, etc. etc. Mntime,Torres gets run over as does Mixx(tho less so recently), Feilhaber gives up, Davis is more easily read than a comic book at WC level, Corona has not proved out, etc. Would we change our shape if we play a different 10 than Donovan? Most likely, but if you dont understand that then it is you who doesnt understand soccer.
For me, I want Dempsey and Donovan up top. With Landon behind Clint. Call it a SS or CAM as you will. I still think RM is the next best spot, just don't know if he can keep it up for 3 games. I'll still take Landon over anyone in our pool in both spots. Save maybe CAM, where I could make a case for Bradley.
When I was a freshman in college, I joined an ultimate frisbee team. I had played a bunch in high school, but the level was much higher on the college team than what I was used to. The team captain told me that whenever I made a catch, I should look to make a simple pass to one of the team's 'handlers' - the team's talented throwers that would make the difficult forward passes. These players were in essence like the quarterbacks. Now, a team plays 7 guys at a time. I asked the captain "how many handlers are ideal to have on the field at a time?" He looked at me like I was stupid and said "Seven." It's the same thing with #10s. Why wouldn't you want every player capable of pushing the play forward and contributing to the attack? I mean, obviously you need defensively capable players as well, but being good at attacking doesn't mean you can't be capable defensively as well. Look at Barcelona. Messi wears the 10 shirt sure, but that team has tons of guys that would wear the 10 shirt if they played for team USA. And yes - it's quite possible for two of those players to play at the same time, sheesh. So if you think Powers is such a great attacking talent, I continue to be utterly baffled by your inane presumption that he would be unable to play alongside Donovan.
I disagree because the World Cup is, in the group stage, a defensive affair. Suppose Klinsi starts both Jozy and Dempsey. ( Not my choice but most expect it to happen.) That's two players who really dont play defence. They really dont. Now add Donovan. Donovan isnt bad at positional, "help" defence on the wng but, overall, defence is not what we think about when it comes to Landon Donovan and in Brazil we will expect Dono to lead the attack and run up and down the pitch in 90 degree humidity in Manaus. Ok, that's three players who don't play defence and only two of them score goals and none of them play wide. Now add 4 back line and two dmids (Bradley + 1 ) and you have nine players with one spot left to make 10 field players. Problem is you have no wide players. Donovan is not fast enough to get wide and there is nobody on the opposite side because neither of Jozy nor Dempsey plays wide. Let's say we add Johannsson out wide as our fnal 10th field player - you cant send Bradley or Zusi into the attack because Landon does not play central defence. That is why I would add Powers in lieu of Donovan. He would cover for Bradley or Zusi running into the channels forward. P.s. Adding Powers to play with Donovan means you have no wide players at all. In case you hadn't figured it out. Demspey jozy Powers donovan Jones Bradley No width. Just Fabian Johnson.
I think he's a sub for CAM/withdrawn forward after dempsey. I'd put FJ on the LW and Zusi or Bedoya on the right. I would like to have some speed down the flanks and Donovan has a bad knee (i.e, slowing down)
I think the idea Powers is some necessity and better than Donovan and something any decent coach would see is silly talk. I also don't think World Cup level soccer is anything like a college Ultimate Frisbee team. Always, teams have needed a balance of piano players and piano movers. Frankly, Barcelona is a big exception to this rule and only is able to win without many workhorses because they have a roster packed with the best players in the world. The US is in completely a different position, with or without Powers or Donovan for that matter.
You seem to be arguing with yourself. As for me, I have been saying since the beginning of the cycle that Donovan's replacement needed to be researched because Donovan would be 32 in summer 2014. It's not an issue of somebody being "better" than Donovan. It is an issue of what kind of condition Donovan will be in for a 6 game tourney and what we lose when he doesnt play and how we replace it.
I like the 4-3-1-2 with Donovan being the 1. Have a midfield 3 of Zusi/Jones/Bradley then Donovan above them and have Dempsey/Altidore as the strikers. Zusi will naturally drift wider on the right and we will have Johnson running down the flanks as the LB. Pretty much will look like this: ------------------Howard-------------------- -Cameron-Gonzalez--Besler---------------- ------------------Jones----------Johnson---- ----Zusi------------------Bradley------------- -----------------Donovan--------------------- -----------Altidore----Dempsey---------------
You formation has no width because you're playing Powers instead of a winger. If he were to play for the US, he would play instead of Jones or Bradley, not where you have him. The frisbee thing was a metaphor, and I think it works fine. After all, in frisbee you want all the players that are good throwers to be good defenders too. The point is that ideally, you want all of your players capable of attacking. But just because someone is good at attacking doesn't mean they are inherently bad defenders. You want both. Barcelona's players succeed because they are talented attackers and because they are workhorses. They press relentlessly to get the ball back. Excellency's argument was that somehow you can't play both Donovan and Powers, because you can't play two #10s, which doesn't make sense. When questioned about it, he says it is because they don't play good enough defense. Well, since Powers plays CM, a position with real defensive responsibilities, he'll have to prove he can hack it defensively if he is going to make it on the national team. I really don't think Klinsmann will say "because you aren't great defensively, I'm going to sacrifice offense on the wing for a more defensive player in order to squeeze you into the lineup."
You wore me out Flip. Your wife is a patient woman. One final try. By 10 I mean somebody given free rein to play where he is most needed. We cant put Powers at the 6 and give him free rein. Jk calls Bradley and Jones his 6's. That is a very strictly defined role in our formation.