I said before that I was trying to create a "rangliste" for the whole of Europe from some historical seasons starting with 1980-1. https://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/the-best-players-of-the-season-1980-1.1886897/ I've listed below a draft of the best players by position for Europe for 1982-3, and would like some feedback and suggestions on players. Who've I missed out, who shouldn't be included? If any of you want to have a stab at assigning the three ratings (world class, international class and national class) to the players then please feel free to. The players are in no particular order. Goalkeeper Franco Tancredi Peter Shilton Paco Buyo Bernd Franke Jean Marie Pfaff Andoni Zubizaretta Piet Schrivers Thomas N’Kono Ivano Bordon Rinat Dasayev Jim Leighton Zoran Simovic Fullback Sebastiano Nela David Narey Danny Thomas Kenny Sansom Manfred Kaltz Rafael Gordillo William Ayache Juan Jose Thierry Tusseau Alan Kennedy Santiago Urquiaga Claudio Gentile Phil Neal Antonio Cabrini Stopper Pietro Vierchowod Migueli Karlheinz Forster Francisco Bonet Ditmar Jakobs Andoni Goikotxea Antonio Alvarez Graham Roberts Moreno Ferrario Willy Miller Libero Richard Gough Alan Hansen Mark Lawrenson Johnny Metgod Antonio Maceda Humberto Coelho Holger Hieronymus Morten Olsen Ronald Koeman Maxime Bossis Roberto Tricella Gaetano Scirea Edinho Glenn Hysen Central midfielder Paulo Roberto Falcao Agostino Di Bartolomei Juan Barbas Graeme Souness Bryan Robson Lothar Matthaus Paul Breitner Uli Stielike Soren Lerby Ruud Gullit Jean Tigana Gary Mabbutt Miguel de Andres Ray Wilkins Carlos Manuel Attacking midfielder Michel Platini Dirceu Liam Brady Alain Giresse Khoren Oganessian Felix Magath Juan Senor Juan Lozano Giancarlo Antognoni Herbert Prohaska Carlo Ancelotti Safet Susic Michael Laudrup Fyodor Cherekov Winger John Barnes Gordon Strachan Jesper Olsen Bruno Conti Sammy Lee Steve Coppell Ludo Coeck Geronimo Barbadillo Salvatore Bagni Pierre Littbarski Forward Kenny Dalglish Karl-Heinz Rummenigge Charlie Nicholas Jan Ceulemans Franky Vercauteren Tibor Nyilasi Stoycho Mladenov Joachim Streich Striker Ian Rush Hans Krankl Rudi Völler Roberto Pruzzo Alessandro Altobelli Luther Blissett Peter Houtman Horst Hrubesch Vahid Halihodzic Fernando Gomes Erwin Vandenbergh
I haven't had much chance to look through/think about this one comme, plus I guess there's a bit of overlap somewhat with the prior seasons. I guess one thing I could ask is for the thinking/info behind Mabbutt in and Hoddle not. For Hoddle I guess it could be a case of it not being one of his best seasons. It'd also be interesting to see who you are thinking about for the highest ratings amongst the players you've listed so far. One player I might check would be Bernard Genghini, interestingly in his only season at St Etienne. I think he was mentioned in previous editions of your project, and it could be he struggled in this season anyway and he didn't score a lot of goals, so it's more out of interest - does anybody have a detailed analysis of his form in this season? Perhaps babourum would be able to help again.
Good call on John Barnes I think, although not for a World Class rating I'd assume (more applicable to his first season at Liverpool probably for example).
Well Hoddle was injured for quite a bit of this season, so that hampered him. Mabbutt had his best ever season this year and started to establish himself in the England team which was no mean feat. Obviously the two players were leagues apart overall and Mabbutt normally played as a centre back but this year I think his fitness gave him the edge.
For this season I would say Platini, Dalglish, Magath, Falcao, Forster. Undecided entirely on some others. People often ridicule Luther Blissett of course and suggest that Milan meant to sign John Barnes, but he was top scorer in probably Europe's best league. A real achievement that.
Thanks for this and the other answer above. Yes, I'm sure Blissett had his limitations but it's similar to how Garry Birtles did a lot better at Forest than at Man United I should think.
OK, internet seems now working a bit again. Well, I disagree with a few choices (don't think Förster was beyond question the best defender of the season) and I don't firmly believe in classifications as World Class or whatever but I'm certain that Piet Schrijvers doesn't belong in the list.. It is true that some questioned the offloading by Ajax, also because other experienced guys left which could have damaged the nurturing process of the young guys. That was the reasoning at least of the press and coach himself as well as the the young players. But his form wasn't very good and necessarily the best GK of the Netherlands or low countries. He went to Zwolle (and had as honor to play in the last competitive match of Johan Cruijff) but he gained infamous nicknames as 'bolle van zwolle' (literally 'the sphere/ball of Zwolle' which means something like 'the fat one of zwolle') and 'het lek van PEC' ('the leak of PEC'). I would go for a Belgian GK and Pfaff was controversial for a reason. That was both related to Pfaff himself who had noticeable weaknesses and to the competition he had at that time. My 2 cents.
Concerning Forster, I have that doubt about the certainty because Dieter Bast, also an defender, has a higher rating and was more often included in the 'team of the week' too. Bast was 7 times included and Forster 4 times. 7 also seems to be the record for that season for a defender (not sure about this observation though).
That's interesting. World Soccer stated that he was in the best form of his career and that he was going to be a huge miss for Ajax for whom he's been a key player. Also there was a suggestion that he was the Dutch player of the year. This was in a separate article by Eric Batty talking about why he thought Joachim Streich should have been European player of the year for 1983. Did you have the Dutch players of the season by the way?
Forster received another world class rating overall though from kicker I think. In a preview for the 1984 Euros there was also a mention of him as being almost universally regarded as the best "stopper" in Europe. Where are you obtained the teams of the week from by the way?
It's on the Kicker site 'Elf des Tages' http://www.kicker.de/news/fussball/...liga/1982-83/0/elf-des-tages-am-spieltag.html On the right you can click 'Spieler' to see who got the most each season. For 83/84 Rummenigge, Völler: 10 Matthäus: 9 Bast, Milewski: 8 Breitner, Franke, Magath: 7 etc.
He was player of the year based on ratings. But it was controversial, he had also a few errors and his physical state was criticized. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Footballer_of_the_Year Btw, defenders and goalkeepers often have an advantage in average ratings based rankings. I'm also pretty sure that Belgian GKs as Preud'homme or Munaron were simply better. I'd say that Soren Lerby was Ajax their best player that year. He received universal praise. He went to the heavily indebted Bayern Munich which caused some big tears at Ajax - "debt financed Dinky Toy" and other blahblah. Chairman Harmsen said some unfriendly things and got unfriendly rebuttal back from Hoeness. How times have changed... Anyhow, Lerby was without debate seen as one of the best players of Ajax during and after the season.
Yes, completely agree on this. I do think that ratings (while extremely useful and helpful to a project like this) can be generally unreliable. I may well have said this before but Brian Glanville once said that it is impossible to write a match report and give out 22 (or more) match ratings at the same time. It's just too much to expect from someone in a 90 minute spell.
Realiable or not, here are the highest rated players in Italy, Spain and Germany that year: LA LIGA 2,06 Señor (Zaragoza) 2,03 Maceda (Sp. Gijón) 1,93 Barbas (Zaragoza) 1,87 Álvarez I (Sevilla) 1,87 Bonet (Real Madrid) 1,87 Buyo (Sevilla) 1,86 Gordillo (Betis) 1,75 Cortabarria (Real Sociedad) 1,75 Regenhardt (Málaga) 1,74 Cardeñosa (Betis) 1,71 Stielike (Real Madrid) BUNDESLIGA 6,93 Franke (Braunschweig) 6,85 Bast (Bochum) 6,78 Burdenski (Werder Bremen), Matthäus (Mönchengladbach) 6,77 Breitner (Bayern München) 6,75 Schumacher (Köln), Kargus (Nürnberg) 6,74 Pfaff (Bayern München) 6,68 Strack (Köln) 6,66 Völler (Werder Bremen), K-H Rummenigge (Bayern München) 6,64 K-H Förster (Stuttgart) 6,55 Wohlers (Bielefeld) 6,54 Briegel (Kaiserslautern) 6,52 Möhlmann (Werder Bremen), Nickel (Frankfurt) SERIE A 6,77 Vierchowod (Roma) 6,72 Martina (Genoa), Ferrario (Napoli) 6,68 Falcão (Roma) 6,65 Tancredi & Nela (Roma) 6,62 Mannini (Pisa), Tricella (Verona) 6,60 Tacconi (Avellino), Bordon (Inter), Di Bartolomei (Roma), Bagni (Inter), Brady (Sampdoria), De Vecchi (Ascoli) 6,57 Fanna (Verona) 6,55 Collovati (Inter) 6,53 Ancelotti (Roma) 6,52 Platini (Juventus), Vignola (Avellino) 6,50 Scirea (Juventus), Edinho (Udinese), Galbiati (Torino) 6,48 Dossena (Torino), Dirceu (Verona), Antognoni (Fiorentina) 6,47 Gentile (Juventus), Spinosi (Verona), Barbadillo (Avellino) 6,45 Causio (Udinese), Casale (Pisa).
Interesting Matthaus is so high while he wasn't a locked starter at euro84 I think. In the first match against Portugal he was a sub anyway, and because of injuries (according to coach Derwall) he entered. In the other two games he was a starter though. In a preview Rummenigge mentions all good players of Germany and categorizes Matthaus in the second category (below the category with himself, Voller, KH Forster and Schumacher, who are of "European class" in his view). He said that in the context of some (not all!) unsatisfying displays by the team and that the team is good enough to play better.
Yes. Ratings from Don Balón, Kicker and La Repubblica. Don't forget Glenn Strömberg's incredible form this year. The Swedish nat'l team was really impressive in 1983 (2-0 and 3-0 vs world champs Italy, 3-3 vs Brazil etc), and Strömberg was devastating on many occasions.
I'm struggling with Stromberg's appearances between IFK Gothenberg and Benfica. He only made about 35 league appearances in total for Benfica and he was unquestionably excellent in 1983-4, so I guessed he hadn't played that much in 1982-3. Do you have any more info?
I don't think there is a single source which can be depended on. These ratings are a case of me trying to piece together the picture, but I'm missing quite a few bits. So I'm using the average ratings, player awards, teams of the year, statistics where possible, books and magazines, hunches, trying to apply logic where possible and come up with what I can. I'm probably building a reasonably accurate picture, but it is definitely pretty distorted in places.
Just to add that it's the imperfect nature of my sources that mean that help and opinions are so much appreciated. The more information and opinions I have the better these lists will be. Ultimately I do think the ones so far are reasonably accurate, and the closer to today we get the better they'll be. Once I get to 1990 I'm able to use the European Football Yearbook as well, which is very reliable IMO.
That is why it is good to explain in key words the logic behind choices. Like in the previous thread.