Opinion on US Soccer from a swedish paper

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by Coog, Jun 12, 2012.

  1. SPA2TACU5

    SPA2TACU5 Member+

    Jul 27, 2001
    ATX
    When are you going to die, exactly?
     
  2. Libero4

    Libero4 Member

    Oct 26, 2007
    Great post!
    As a high school teacher and varsity soccer coach, what you are describing still holds true.
    I constantly talk to my my team about making the right choices.
    In many cases some of the players have far more potential in soccer but choose to play football in the fall, then soccer in the winter.Although only a handful could continue to play on to the next level, they usually play the most popular sport at the school to the detriment of their soccer potential.
    I believe this is part of the reason why we are going to continue to have worker bees instead of stars with great world class potential.
     
  3. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am thinking sometime around 2050.
     
  4. Hobo

    Hobo Member+

    Apr 29, 2007
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    SPA2TACU5 repped this.
  5. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It was close.

    I have

    2014
    2018
    2022
    2026
    2030
    2034
    2038
    2042
    2046
    2050

    10 More world cups, lets see if a Concacaf team wins a world cup before that.

    I wonder; well this being a USA forum I assume the responses would be bias.

    But I wonder what confederation will win a WC first.

    Concacaf
    CAF
    AFC
    OFC
     
  6. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Germany, Spain, Italy, Mexico, USA, Holland, Argentina, Switzerland, Sweden, England; the teams that have made the knockout rounds in at least 3 of the past 5 World Cups. Pretty nice company. The team is punching pretty far above it's weight in terms of results for the investment and interest in the sport.

    Gotta get lucky with the semi-final bracket. Avoid Germany, Brazil, and the Netherlands....
     
  7. Coog

    Coog Member

    Jun 29, 2011
    Stockholm
    Nat'l Team:
    Sweden
    Yes we played really well against the english and did even better against the french (Zlaaaaatan) but against the Ukraine we was just horrendous. If we played against them as we did in our two last games, our players wouldn't be on a plane to Stockholm right now.
     
  8. dna77054

    dna77054 Member+

    Jun 28, 2003
    houston
    Off the top of my head, your list is missing Brazil and Paraguay. Having a relatively easy qualification and hosting one of those WCs really helps us get into that list.
     
  9. LinksterAC

    LinksterAC Member

    Jun 30, 2008
    San Diego
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is changing, if it hasn't changed already. The stigma is gone and I think that kids with soccer potential are staying in the sport instead of forcing themselves to adapt to another, more popular, sport that they're less suited to excel in.

    It's one of the myriad reasons I think the US will be a consistent Top 10 nation by the time the 2020s roll around.
     
  10. ScrappytheSeal4

    Jun 5, 2010
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wow, um, let me go ahead and stop this myth right here. Nobody feels "forced" to play football or any other sport that's popular in the US. Kids play football in the fall and soccer in the winter because it's fun to play both.
     
  11. voros

    voros Member

    Jun 7, 2002
    Parts Unknown
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    By my calculations CONCACAF has the highest rated team of those (Mexico is currently top 10, Ivory Coast and Japan are not).

    Top 10: CONCACAF = 1
    Top 15: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1
    Top 20: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1, AFC = 1
    Top 25: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1, AFC = 2
    Top 30: CONCACAF = 2, CAF = 2, AFC = 2
    Top 40: CONCACAF = 2, CAF = 4, AFC = 4
    Top 50: CONCACAF = 5, CAF = 5, AFC = 4

    If my ratings are close, Mexico has an outside shot at this right now, the Ivory Coast less of one but probably on something you'd categorize as reasonably possible. Everyone else falls into "extreme longshot territory."
     
    dwsmith1972 repped this.
  12. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    By ELO

    Top 10: 0
    Top 15: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1
    Top 20: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1, AFC = 1
    Top 25: CONCACAF = 1, CAF = 1, AFC = 3
    Top 30: CONCACAF = 2, CAF = 2, AFC = 3
    Top 40: CONCACAF = 3, CAF = 3, AFC = 4
    Top 50: CONCACAF = 4, CAF = 5, AFC = 5

    ELO has China as 47, WTF????
     
  13. dwsmith1972

    dwsmith1972 BigSoccer Supporter

    May 11, 2007
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Jayus! Saturday, March 25, 2045. I don't know what to do now. I guess lower my BMI. Only 8 more world cups. I feel weird inside.
     
    Hobo repped this.
  14. voros

    voros Member

    Jun 7, 2002
    Parts Unknown
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One of ELO's main weaknesses is in rating teams in Asia (and Africa to a lesser extent) who rarely play meaningful matches outside of their confed.

    Generally speaking ELO does well with the top 40 teams or so, which is why it does pretty well in predicting World Cup results. From there I think it suffers from some substantial inaccuracies from not being an iterative system.
     
  15. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Disagree somewhat. High school sports such as football, basketball and baseball at the varsity level are more competitive than ever, and playing more than the one sport you're committed too is generally frowned upon by head coaches and unless you're a rare two sport standout, generally knocks you down the totem pole a little bit.

    For football you have spring training, then workouts all through the summer. You're expected in the weight room getting stronger all winter, post season.

    For basketball the better players play AAU ball all summer inbetween camps, run pick up for the first couple months of school and start practice Oct/Nov, play through the winter.

    Baseball generally has year round commitments to, even though it isn't a rule for any of these sports the coaches frown upon anyone not as committed and not showing up, unless a rare two sport star as I said.

    If you play multiple sports because it's "fun", you're probably not a varsity athlete with college aspirations. If high school soccer players are wasting time playing other sports because it's "fun", that won't help our soccer program at all. Elementary and middle school is of course different.
     
  16. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think this is about right. I think the 2022 cycle is where we're going to see more technical ability and tactical knowledge across the pitch compared to what we're used too, from a combination of improving MLS academies and a growing number of teens in foreign academies. It'll take a little while to see results from that, but 6-8 years from now we should be seeing the beginnings of the most talented generation of US players ever.

    Also think unfortunately we might get a little worse between generation before then and there will be a 2-4 yr gap where we struggle, post Landon-Clint.
     
  17. ScrappytheSeal4

    Jun 5, 2010
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The coaches of each sport would rather you only play their sport. Of course. But the idea that you can't play more than one sport and be very good in one, or both, is nonsense. I actually don't know how to respond to that any further. And I also have no idea why you felt the need to put fun in quotations.
     
  18. SweetLife

    SweetLife Red Card

    Oct 4, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rankings don't matter much you have to look at the roster and the quality of players to decide if they have a chance. I will firmly say Mexico will never get past the round of 16 because of the lack of quality.


    A quick comparison of Mexico to even Ivory Coast shows the quality gap( I know not all the players are included)
    Mexico
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/mexico/startseite/nationalmannschaft_6303.html
    Even with players like Carlos Vela added the gap is still huge...
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/carlos-vela/profil/spieler_35773.html

    Now look at a team like the Ivory Coast.


    Ivory Coast

    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/ivory-coast/startseite/nationalmannschaft_3591.html


    The Ivorian Coast team is worth twice as much as the Mexican team and if they get on a hot streak have the players to beat all the top teams. I am certain that Mexico does not.
     
  19. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Because this day in age, varsity sports are more about winning and year round commitment, not whatever the student athlete considers to be a "fun" way to spend their time. Really nothing else to say.

    I've worked as a personal trainer for years with many varsity athletes, and their coaches for the most part couldn't care less if they thought going out for another sport for 3-4 months would be fun for them. They'd tell them to go have their fun, and someone else just took their place in the pecking order, and that it's tough shit for them as another kid is showing more of a commitment to the team by training year round.

    Of course you can excel at two sports, as I stated above. But tha'ts not close to the norm. If you want to be a soccer player, commit year round. Basketball player, commit year round, Etc. If simply having fun and switching back and forth is your thing, then enjoy your future playing intramural competition in college with the coeds, which there's nothing wrong with, but that aint where our future prospects will come from.
     
  20. SweetLife

    SweetLife Red Card

    Oct 4, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    More analysis

    Why does mexico beat us? Their players are worth a bit more!
    This is Us.
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/united-states/kader/nationalmannschaft_3505.html


    Now Ghana who beat us.

    Right now
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/ghana/kader/nationalmannschaft_3441.html

    When you add the players not on the list
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/asamoah-gyan/profil/spieler_26802.html
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/michael-essien/profil/spieler_5588.html
    http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/kevin-prince-boateng/profil/spieler_16922.html


    In fact Essien, Gyan and Kevin Prince Boateng are worth almost as much as our whole team


    It is not rocket science. The teams with better players will likely win. With hard work anyone can beat anyone because everyone is a professional but, in the end the numbers matter.
     
  21. SweetLife

    SweetLife Red Card

    Oct 4, 2010
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  22. ScrappytheSeal4

    Jun 5, 2010
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I love how you think the two are mutually exclusive.

    Yeah...still not sure what that has to do with what we're talking about.

    Ok, now I realize why you keep saying "fun" like that. You think that when somebody plays a sport they either have fun OR they want to make it their profession. So...

    A) That's NOT what I was talking about when I made my initial comment
    B) That's NOT how it works

    You can have "fun" and still be "competitive" at "multiple" sports "despite" what "you" "may" "think" "."
     
  23. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lol. Not how it works because you capitalize NOT?

    Despite what you think, the better highschool athletes don't dabble in multiple sports. You also seem to read what you want and dismiss the rest as I pointed out kids can be successful playing multiple sports. Quit being a schmuck and acting like it's all or nothing. I'm referring to the norm, not the exception, and any monkey with half a brain could understand that. If you commit to one sport in high school, you're more likely to be successful than the kid playing two or three sports. Pretty f'ing simple. Are there exceptions? Of course, as I stated previously.

    You keep acting like it's possible you can succeed at more than one sport. Well, no shit. That's what I also said. But it's also not the preferred route. Too bad Landon didn't take swimming more seriously when he was 17. Too bad Kobe didn't think volleyball would be a worthwhile way to spend 3-4 months a year when in high school. I think Derek Jeter would have been a better baseball player had he taken up football in high school. I also think the youths in the Barcelona academy should take a 3-4 month break and concentrate on rugby, as they can excel at two sports.
     
  24. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Two of the Cups were held in Europe with a third in European timezones. Again US doesn't have access to UEFA resources.
     
  25. voros

    voros Member

    Jun 7, 2002
    Parts Unknown
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    BTW, checking the odds to win the 2014 World Cup outright, Mexico has better odds than the Ivory Coast in 9 of the sites versus just one for the Ivory Coast.
     

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