The theatrics have and will always bee part of the game. The game is not about been moral or not, it is about winning. And taking time off the clock is a legitimate way of winning.
Theatrics have not always been part of the game. Just watch old footage of games in the 1950's for example. No faking, no diving, no grabbing when defending corners, etc. back then. The game should be about winning and sportsmanship. It is both and, not either or.
Exactly. if the game were only about winning there'd be no reason to do those exaggerated handshake lines at the beginning of games or the exchanging of flags
I was not around 50 years ago, but people that were had told me the same. It was and it has always been part of the game. The two continents that have been playing the sport since the beginning, South America and Europe are know for this type of theatrics. This was never a gentleman game. That is why I see this argument as kind of silly. Anybody that knows the history of football will tell you that it is all part of the game. Look at basketball and American Football. In order to play the clock, players either foul out or throw the ball away to stop the clock. It is the same thing.
Clearly, when someone writhes around on the ground like a fish out of water for five minutes, even though the opposing player was a clear 1-2 feet away from the guy, the "on the ground guy" must know that the time will be added back on, right? They've GOT to know that the time will be added back on. If anything, it's neutralized.
Not really. In those two sports, if someone falls down, they're probably really hurt. In basketball, if someone gets fouled, they'll stop the clock and shots are taken. In South America and Europe, it's more like what I said in the previous post. How many times will a basketball player fall down, roll around on the ground, scream in agony, only to play a few moments later like nothing happened?
Diving is cheating, plain and simple. Cheating should not be tolerated at all. I would love if they brought fighting into soccer like they do in hockey. All the divers and cheats would get beat up and would think twice about pulling a dive next time.
I wasn't around 50 years ago either. By talking to my dad and watching archived footage of games back then, it is clear that the theatrics we see today did not exist then. The faking and diving is a modern problem that currently plagues the sport.
I don't know about the people you talk to, but I remember when ESPN had replays of the 74 and 78 world cups on 2 years ago I don't remember any of what you're talking about. Holland Germany and Holland - Argentina. Compare to the 2010 final and it's night and day.
This conversation will only take place in The United States of America. Anywhere else we will not be talking about fake dives on other theatrics about the sport. I was around in the 70 and did see this theatrics in both Europe and South America and Live. But enough with that. The Champions final is getting more interesting by the minute. R. Madrid is in a tie race for the title in Spain, B. Munich lost today and is now 4 points from the leader. Chelsea is not gaining grown in the EPL and Barcelona is just getting better by the minute. And yes, all the announcer keep talking about how blind all the referees are. I think we should bring in re-play to Football, so we can tell who is diving for real and who is not. Or if Xavi's goal was good or not. Why not have four quarters and time-outs. I believe this was try back in the Cosmos era. So since I am in the United States, I guess I will have to talk about the morality of Football, a game play by gentlemen.
Look, you can critizized the game all day, this for some reason has always been done in this country because the sport is seen as a foreighners' sports. However, many Americans are taking their kids to soccer camp because is the hip thing to do and they are now confronted with the reality of the sport. So you are teaching your child moral values, so the first thing you do is tell your kid not to fake and injury or a dive, and please do not cheat. But the true sports is nothing like that, and players will always do what ever they need to do to have an advantage in the field. Players know that referees have a blind spot and the player will do everything to take advantage. So welcome to real football. And by the way, I have yet to see a game from the 50 for the whole 90 minutes. As a matter of fact I have the video from the 1970 World Cup in Mexico and all I am getting is highlights. So is it Barca, R Madrid, or Chelsea and B munich?
From what I hear its universally accepted in Latin America as part of the game, a way to be sneaky/ be sleek. In other places like the US its totally disgusting to watch. We as Americans hate to see cheating in any form. The steroid use in baseball was huge and turned so many fans off from the game for good. I know for a fact that many Barcelona players used HGH in their younger days and I would not be surprised other teams do so as well. In the US if such a thing happened a ban would be in place. Essentially Messi would be banned from playing soccer in the US because of it. In Europe its basically ok to do it in soccer which somehow makes it stranger that in other sports like cycling you get banned for doing it as well. Just makes more the reason why top soccer organizations have th eimage of corruption not only because of bribery but because of diving, drug use, and goal line technology.
This has to be one of the most uninformed/ignorant post I might ever respond to. Messi had a growth problem. His body was not producing the normal hormones a body produces to grow. He needed outisde help, then he got growth hormones (in his teen years), which he does not need to take anymore. It was necessary as for a health reason nor a performance reason! How can you compare Barry Bonds taking the cream and the clear for racist/ubercompetitive reason to taking growth hormones for a kid to have normal development. Oh and Radio Cope made the same accusations about Barca, and all of a sudden UEFA randomly test Barca players, and none have turned out positive. Stop spreading ignorance.
um ... Europe has much more stringent testing standards than the US does. Have you not seen the 2 year/lifetime bans they gave out to cyclists, rugby players and sprinters caught up in EPO or Balco scandals? Hell they gave Rio Ferdinand 8 months - almost an entire season - for missing a test. If Rio played in the NFL he'd miss 4 games. WADA has been on our ass for years for not accepting blood testing in our sports leagues and relying only on pee tests.
Marca.com posted an interesting video on how yesterday's game was broadcast from Goltv. Very interesting. So we are talking about the Champions final or the dark force of International Football. Here is the link of the video, or you can just go to Marca.com and play it. http://www.marca.com/2012/04/12/futbol/futbol_internacional/america/1334249367.html
Is HGH not illegal for sport? Graham Hunter wrote about this in his book. Being short in the 5 foot-ish range is not something that affects your health (height Messi would be without it). If a 5 foot person is allowed to take HGH for that specific reason to grow taller why can't a 6 foot tall person be allowed to do it for the same reason? There was no problems medically that affect you for being 5 foot so the only reason he took HGh was to get taller for the sake of being taller. Getting taller adds a benefit to your game the same way increased muscle mass helps a batter hit more homeruns.
1. It looks very cramped in those offices 2. There's really nothing more to talk about until the CL Semis start. 3. Except that maybe there's something to Barca having one less rest day on either side of El Clasico.
...except that hormone deficiency is an actual medical ailment and the treatment for it is injecting HGH. Legal treatment. Not Barry Bonds cream/clear or Pete Rose selling from unmarked brown bags outside of gyms. Besides he got the injections when he was 9, not last year.
It is not necessary to watch the entire 90 minutes, just talk to people who were soccer fans back in the 1950's, 1960's, and/or 1970's. They will tell you that the faking/diving we see today did not exist back then. Many "old timers" dislike very much the theatrics they see today in pro soccer.
This is my last comment on this subject. I was around in the 70's and did see plenty of theatrics on the field. Back them I had the luxury of going to the stadium. If you had the pleasure of listening to old broadcaster from both Europe and South America, they will tell you that they was as much theatrics back them as there are now. It is part of the game, but I am sure you will not take it from me, so write to broadcaster, individuals that made a living of Football back in the 50 and 60, and they will tell you what used to happen on the field. You see, this high moral bar that we claim exist in American sports, is an American thing. The British, the founders of Football try to keep the game as clean as possible, but the game was played by the working class, and it is still played by the working class. The best players from South America came from the fabellas, porters or ghettos. So diving or faking injuries was a way of getting ahead of the game. Football is a working man sport, it was back them and some may say that it is still a working man sport, and if you ever been to a ghetto, you know that people really are not all that in to gentleman rules. I know that you will continue to argue your point, but do some research, and you will find out that this was the case. At least in South America and Europe, I am not sure about any other continent however.
I think it is more precise to use the term "sportsmanship," don't you think? And sportsmanship is not only an American thing, it is a universal concept. So for the sake of sportsmanship being displayed on American free over-the-air TV, I hope for a non-Clasico final. And I'll leave it at that.
When you get the time watch this game, and tell me theatrics have always been commonplace in soccer. [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ce-RMQy3eK4"]1957 FA CUP FINAL MANCHESTER UNITED VS ASTON VILLA - THE FULL MATCH - YouTube[/ame]
so one game is going to make up all of the games played in the 50, in both South America and Europe? Really. Talk about a small sample.
The Brits have this idealized version of football (soccer) that no longer exists, starting with the "beautiful game" nonsense. Gamesmanship replaced sportsmanship when the money started getting big due to television about 30-35 years ago. Soccer is now "human chess" with a ball. It is now about mind games, played against each other and against the referees. Getting into the referees' heads, manipulating the refs into making favorable (and incorrect) calls, diving, simulation, professional fouling (for the purpose of controlling the pace of the match), injury "time outs", and "biochemistry" are all part of modern football. The "human chess" that is modern football is driving TV viewership. Modern football is "soap opera" for men. (Pro wrestling has taken the "soap opera" for men concept and run with it for the past 20 years. Pay TV networks around the world that target young men 18-34 can't live without it.) The Brits lost control of football a long time ago. Heck, the Brits don't even own the biggest brands in English football anymore. 3 Americans and 1 Russian now own the "Big 4". The only thing the Brits control in football are the commentary boxes, and that is only because the large herd of English-speaking consumers from the Indian subcontinent (whether they live in North America, Asia, the Middle East, or Europe) demand football commentators who possess the "proper" accent and call the matches using "proper" terminology.