new CONCACAF qualifying format like or dislike?

Discussion in 'CONCACAF' started by JYDA, Sep 1, 2010.

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Do you like the new format?

  1. Yes, this is good for CONCACAF as a whole

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  2. No, the status quo was fine

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  3. No, but expanding the final phase to 8 teams would have been better

    0 vote(s)
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  4. No, 2 groups of 6 in the final phase would have been better

    0 vote(s)
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  5. Other

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  1. JYDA

    JYDA Member

    Sep 10, 2003
    What do fans of all CONCACAF teams think of the new format?

    To review, this is the format:

    Preliminary round: Teams 29-35 in CONCACAF playoff in 2 leg ties
    First round: 8 groups of 4. Top 2 advance
    Second round: 4 groups of 4: Top 2 advance
    Final round: 2 groups of 4: Group winners qualify, runners up play-off for the third spot with the loser going to an intercontinental play-off.
     
  2. elite8

    elite8 Member

    Jul 16, 2010
    Is this a done deal? If so does Mexico and the United States get byes to the second and/or final round?

    IMO this is a bad idea because you know Mexico and the United States will be in opposite groups in the final round. This means the only attractive game -- MEXICO vs USA - won't happen. Very bad idea IMO.
     
  3. JYDA

    JYDA Member

    Sep 10, 2003
    It's been submitted to FIFA for final approval (which is merely a formality). So yes it's going to happen

    As for byes, there are none. The top 32 teams contest the first of three group stages. It's basically a bracket format with 4 team groups.
     
  4. Nazzer

    Nazzer New Member

    Jan 12, 2008
    Penticton,BC,Canada
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    I like this, more games means more opportunities for teams to improve. I just hope that they don't set the groups for each stage from the first draw; they need to have a fresh draw at the beginning of each stage to accomodate for upsets in the previous rounds or one group may be significantly weaker than the others.
     
  5. Crazy_Yank

    Crazy_Yank Member

    Jan 8, 2001
    Matamoros, Mexico
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think this is a stupid idea. I don't have a problem with tweaking the system to add more games for lower ranked teams. I wouldn't have a problem with allowing more teams into the final round. What I have a problem with is splitting the final stage into two groups. It should be a round robin home and away series. The cream rises to the top. Concacaf is not a deep confederation. We need to have our best teams representing the confederation every time. The US and Mexico are by far the top dogs. I think reasonable people from both groups of supporters would admit that a logical argument could be made for either one of those teams as the number one team in the region.
     
  6. Edgar

    Edgar Member

    It seems there will be a draw after each round, according to Ben Spencer.
     
  7. elite8

    elite8 Member

    Jul 16, 2010
    You think it's a good idea that Mexico and the United States won't be playing each other? In the end both teams will qualify for the World Cup and we won't see them play against each other 1 time.

    How is that good?
     
  8. TBR

    TBR Member

    Mar 15, 2007
    DMV
    Club:
    CD Aguila
    Nat'l Team:
    El Salvador
    No, I wanted a single group final round. That's why I was fine with the revision of a 12 team final group. But I understand the cons...I'll miss the Hex.
     
  9. jkdd77

    jkdd77 New Member

    Jul 16, 2005
    England
    As a European, I have no real business on this thread, but I do think that the format will lead to some hideous mis-matches in the first group phrase, with the likes of Mexico vs Montserrat and US vs Anguilla likely to be so one-sided they scarely deserve to be called "sport".

    If either federation decides to score lots of goals in protest at being made to play such silly matches in such a ridiculous format, then Australia [C team]'s 31-0 win over America Samoa is not likely to stand for much longer. It wouldn't surprise me to see post-draw withdrawals for financial reasons, leading to 3-team groups.

    I think World Cup qualifying is about making sure the best teams qualify to represent the confederation and earn more spots (or at least have a fair chance to qualify). Allowing weaker teams to improve can best be accomplished through the likes of Gold Cup qualifiers and the Caribbean Cup.

    If it was up to me:
    Preliminary round (2 legs): 35 -> 28 (Top 21 exempt)
    First round (2 legs): 28 -> 16 (US, Mexico, Honduras and Costa Rica exempt)
    Semi-final round (4 groups of 4): 16 -> 8
    Octagonal: (keeps US vs Mexico, and gives the cream the chance to rise to the top)

    The realistic maximum number of matches for a final intercontinental play-off team would be 24, but starting earlier than in previous cycles would give plenty of time for this.

    Perhaps teams eliminated in the early stages could go into a AFC Challenge Cup-type event, with the best teams qualifying automatically for the 2013
    Gold Cup.
     
  10. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Small countries have the same vote as big countries,

    It will happen in the first round, there will be many 10-0 games for sure, but oh well, I mean San Marino and Andora get killed all the time also, but they still have a right to play in the elimination.

    It sucks for small Islands that every 4 years their World cup run lasts only 2 games.

    Now the countries that make it into the first group round will get to play at least 6 games.
     
  11. bradjmoore48

    bradjmoore48 Member

    Aug 3, 2010
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ultimately not a big fan of the new format, mainly from US and Mexico perspectives as it ruins the two truly world-class match-ups these teams will have. And I do think a final round single group stage does add to the drama. So here would be my suggestion, if I had any real power :)

    1) First, there are way too many small Caribbean islands to justify each having a single, crappy team. Using historical links, I was able to pare down 17 Caribbean and South American nations in CONCACAF down to 3 teams: 1) A West Indies team made up of 8 islands (Antigua, Barbados, Dominica, Grenada, Guyana, St. Kitts, St. Lucia, St. Vincent & Grenadines) 2) a British overseas protectorate team (Bermuda, Cayman Islands, Turks & Caicos, Anguilla, Montserrat, and the British Virgin Islands), and lastly, a 3) Dutch Caribbean team of Aruba, the Dutch Antilles, and Suriname. This pares down CONCACAF to 20 teams. And let's be realistic, if any player TRULY worth a damn is playing in these places, they'll have a first class ticket to the UK or Netherlands. And the combination will make for less really crappy teams, and more for a few mostly crappy teams.

    2) A seeded v unseeded 2-leg playoff, top 10 teams advance to...

    3) the Final Group stage, winner (and 2nd, 3rd, possibly 4th place) take all. Basically, its South American qualifying. 18 matches, home-and-away against every other team. Yes, it leaves 10 teams in the dust in terms of more matches played, but it certainly gives more to 4 more, likely to improve the Confederation teams. We still get to keep our cherished US-Mexico matches, but it gives teams like Canada, Jamaica, Trinidad, Cuba, and Haiti a LOT more matches, so a lot more room for those teams to improve. I think we should only have the Gold Cup in it's 'true form' (only CONCACAF nations) the year after the World Cup. Then following the Gold Cup, 3 years or so of qualifying, just like South America.

    Bonus Good Idea: I think the year before the World Cup, there should be an invitational tournament between CONCACAF and CONMEBOL teams that are not participating in the Confederations Cup. Maybe like the bottom 6 of each qualifying tournament, giving teams like Trinidad and Canada to face off against teams like Peru, Colombia, Ecuador, Venezuala. It can be a solid consolation to likely not qualifying for the World Cup, or good practice for the teams on the edge of qualifying.

    Just my thoughts....
     
  12. Sakatei

    Sakatei Member

    Jun 24, 2007
    I wonder how many "home" games these smaller countries will play in the US if they get a bigger opponent?
     
  13. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Let me call the president and tell him to invade those Islands to get your plan going.
     
  14. bradjmoore48

    bradjmoore48 Member

    Aug 3, 2010
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Haha might as well, nothing like a good ol' fashioned war to get the country to forget about health care, the economy, gay marriage and religious fanaticism. :D
     
  15. MRschizoid21

    MRschizoid21 Member

    Nov 5, 2004
    Brooklyn, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's terrible.


    There's not enough talent to make 2 compelling final groups of 4.

    I'm sure they could have found some other way to give smaller teams more games without messing up the hex. Staggered byes, something.
    There aren't any byes here, either. So teams lumped with USA, Mexico, Costa Rica will be absolutely thumped on a regular basis.
     
  16. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    in the USA, Mexico and C.R., but those 3 teams had trouble when playing away even in the round prior to the Hex.

    So yes the first 2 rounds will be bad, with some horrid scores, but the final round should be good,

    USA
    Mexico
    Costa Rica
    Honduras
    T & T
    Jamaica
    Guatemala
    Canada

    That is 8 teams for the final 2 groups. (maybe El Salvador or Panama)

    Getting 16 teams for the second round is more iffy. You would have to think

    Prior 10 I mentioned
    Cuba
    Haiti
    Belize
    Nicaragua
    2 more Islands?
     
  17. MRschizoid21

    MRschizoid21 Member

    Nov 5, 2004
    Brooklyn, NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    For most teams qualifying will be 18 games, just like it was prior. I would think they'd come up with a way to reduce that.

    Also, I just looked at the rankings and looked at the teams that would automatically qualify (1-29) and playoff (30-35) for 32 teams.


    Just imagining a group stage with teams like Bermuda, Turks & Caicos, Dominican Republic, wow.
     
  18. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    fyp
     
  19. 13370

    13370 Member

    Jul 27, 2008
    Club:
    Stoke City FC
    A JAMAICAN OPINION .


    I want to say this is a better deal for Concacaf emerging teams but I dont know , The FA Cup in England does its draw after every round and last year stoke city was a victim , they draw Arsenal , Man City ,
    and lose out to chelsea in the Q' Finals . This example may happen
    to Jamaica been drawn into difficult groups , Concacaf is a currupt organization by Jack Warner , Chuck Blazer etc , and if FIFA
    does the draw after every round its best to use someone from outside of the confederation , I say this because Kasey Keller Manipulates the last draw and if anyone from Concacaf does it , its likely to happen the same way .


    This may not be fair way because jamaicans are mostly blacks and
    everybody have their prejudices especially against black people so lets
    hope FIFA are mindful of those concerns . It would be good if FIFA disaprove this Format and Concacaf changes it to a Final 8 of 14 games
    Home/Away . The good thing is(new Format) it takes 2 additional teams in its FiNaL RounD, and if done fairly its OK .
     
  20. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hear Jack Warner hates black people. :confused:
     
  21. TrueCrew

    TrueCrew Member+

    Dec 22, 2003
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Look, I don't LIKE it, per se, but I do think it is better for the confederation as a whole. And therefore, I'm for it. And this is from someone who lives in Columbus, OH, and will now NOT get to see the USA host Mexico once every 4 years.

    I think there are benefits for each "level" of team in CONCACAF.

    I think this method will be better for the top dogs in two respects.

    First, by having more games in WCQ for the minnows (almost everyone will have 6-8) and mid-level teams (most will have at least 12), these teams will get some wins and draws, and generate more FIFA rankings points. And so, even when beaten, the top dogs will earn more points.

    Second, the first round of group games, which everyone is disparaging as too easy, will be a time for the more powerful nations to get a look at young players. The "top" players, or "A team" or whatever, won't have to play in that round, so they'll in fact end up playing fewer games than now. 2 of 4 advance, so one slip isn't fatal, and if the youths get in trouble, you can call in reinforcements to get them out of it. So, the A team will now only have to play 12 games (2 rounds of 6), where before, they had to play 17-18 (one two legged knockout where they have to play at least one game, 6 in the SF round, which can be tricky (McBride's goal at Guatemala saved the USA in 2002 from not even advancing to the Hex, and the Mexico, Canada, Jamaica, Honduras SF group was a joke last time), and 10 in the Hex.

    For the lesser powers and mid-level teams (Costa Rica, Honduras, T&T, Jamaica, Canada, El Salvador, Panama). They have a better shot to make it to the final group (with 8 in instead of 6). They'll benefit ranking wise just like the top dogs, and will play more games as well. Like the top dogs, they might be able to use some fringe players in round 1. And can avoid the nasty, Jack Warner rigged SF group that happened last time, as they'll all be seeded in the SF round (or at worst, a #2).

    For the mid level teams (Haiti, Cuba, Grenada, Suriname, etc). They'll get more games, more points, more chances to develop. More games (with 16 teams into Round 3). More chances to get some TV or tourism revenue (games against USA, Mexico, CR). More money and a decent chance improve the game and try to move up a notch to join the CA teams and the Caribbean powerhouses in the final round, and maybe even contend for a WC spot.

    For the real minnows. More games, a chance to play a regional powerhouse team, and a chance to develop and get some exposure.

    Yes, I'll hate to see USA/Mex go, but maybe now the Gold Cup will mean a bit more? CONCACAF wants and deserves an extra half (so much more so than Asia), and I think this is the way to go about getting it. Improve the region, improve the rankings.

    The USA and Mexico should still be fairly safe bets to qualify. And if one fails, then they will likely NOT be separated the next year.
     
    1 person likes this.
  22. Taly

    Taly Member

    Feb 25, 2001
    Big Al's Brewery, WA
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I am gonna have fun when I check out a couple games of the USMNT playing in the Carribean.
     
  23. Jorgito

    Jorgito Member

    Sep 24, 2008
    Los angeles, CA
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    this is jack warner's move.
     
  24. Taly

    Taly Member

    Feb 25, 2001
    Big Al's Brewery, WA
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the way to enjoy playing a CONCACAF minnow.
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2sXLbXM0RY"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2sXLbXM0RY[/ame]
    I gotta give the English credit. They know how enjoy a sporting event in the Carribean.
     
  25. slaminsams

    slaminsams Member+

    Mar 22, 2010
    How can you not enjoy a sporting event in the Caribbean? Unless you go during hurricane season. If you travel with the team there are worse places to play minnows then the Caribbean.
     

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